sadoldgit

Yeah, but what about Ed Davey? https://amp.theguardian.com/uk-news/2024/feb/18/former-post-office-boss-stall-horizon-compensation-payouts

Didn’t de Gaulle die over 50 years ago and before the EU was the EU? I think that you will find that the world has moved on a bit since the 1960’s.

So NATO members want to embrace other NATO “friends” into NATO???

Nothing dodgy about this at all. https://amp.theguardian.com/world/live/2024/feb/16/ukraine-war-live-russia-avdiivka-assault-continues-as-zelenskiy-set-to-visit-europe

100% this. I have not seen any down playing of the Hamas attack on 7th October, quite the opposite. Calling out the actions of the IDF has nothing to do with downplaying the horrors of the initial attack. It has been said many times but there is a huge difference between real antisemitism and criticising the agenda and methods of the present Israeli government and their military. Sadly the methods of dealing with that criticism often results in the erroneous playing of the antisemitic card, which as has been said, does the Jewish people no favours as it diminishes real cases of antisemitism. What is also clear is that there are people who are fine with Islamophobia but get in a real lather about what they consider to be antisemitism. Any normal, rational person would recognise that any form of discrimination against racial, religious or other minority groups is not ok. There are normal, rational people on this thread who understand that but there is also a small group of people who either don’t get it, or chose to ignore it just to score points and stir things up. Hundreds of innocent people were killed or maimed in the horrendous attack of 7th October. Since then tens of thousands more innocent people have been killed or maimed. Neither are ok.

And the current Israeli government and their enablers feel exactly the same about the Palestinians. I think most of us understand that this goes back a lot further than 7th October and that there are factions on both sides who want the others gone. There are also those who want peace and to find a way for peaceful cohabitation. This isn’t going to happen as long as the Israelis, who have a great deal more power than the Palestinians, continue to abuse that power. It’s not rocket science that if you keep kicking you are going to get kicked back. History shows us that it doesn’t matter how many Palestinians the Israelis kill, it doesn’t bring Israel any more security. If anything it just makes reprisals more likely. If they want a more secure future perhaps they need to stop stealing land from the Palestinians, let the people in Gaza live like everybody else, and show the Arab world that they are prepared to live side by side in peace. Why wouldn’t Hamad want them gone. They consistently ignore international law and UN resolutions. Maybe they should try to show hat they are prepared to live side by side and in peace and give the Palestinians a chance to do the same without treating them like “human animals”. Frankly it is hard to understand how anyone who was horrified at the attack on 7th October can be perfectly ok with what has happened since. Forget religious differences, on what planet does the destruction of Gaza equate to a proportionate response to what happened on 7th October? Israel are going to end up isolating themselves in the international community the same way that South Africa did.

This incident was covered in a phone in on LBC yesterday and a couple of people who were at the show phoned in. It sounds horrendous and isn’t going to do Currie’s career any favours. Sounds like he lost the plot big time. Back to the Labour problem. I have no idea if Azhar Ali is an antisemite but he does seem to have a good relationship in the past with members of the Jewish community. People will have their own view on what he said. Personally I don’t see a problem with thinking that Netanyahu didn’t have a problem with the attack and used it as an excuse to flatten Gaza. It is an opinion and given the firm evidence we have about how much intel he had before the attack it is not without some traction. It could be completely wrong but accusing him of it does not make you an antisemite. It makes you critical of Netanyahu for his actions and not of his religious standing. His comments about those in the media using antisemitism to shut down debate and criticism of Israel is also not without foundation. There are Jewish people (and non people) who play the antisemitic card on a regular basis to push back against any negativity directed towards Israel. Strangely it happens more so against those left of centre. Apparently those on the right of centre are allowed to criticise the Israeli actions without the immediate assumption that their concerns are based on a hatred of Jewish people, I have been slagged off many times for making the same point despite the fact that many Jewish people feel that antisemitism has been weaponised too. Just one of many such opinions from a Jewish person. https://www.jewishvoiceforlabour.org.uk/article/for-the-safety-of-jews-and-palestinians-stop-weaponizing-antisemitism/

What I don’t get is that, through his own words, Duckhunter says that anyone who criticises a Jewish person is anti semitic. Lots of people who have criticised the action of the Israelis have been labelled as anti semitic. You can criticise Christians, Sikhs, Buddhists, Hindus etc all you like, but as soon as you question the actions of the Israeli government you get jumped on as being antisemitic. Those who use antisemitism to shut down valid criticisms are the small minded ones.

Cameron joins the ever lengthening list of anti semites. https://amp.theguardian.com/world/2024/feb/13/israel-in-breach-of-international-law-if-gaza-denied-food-and-water-says-cameron Anyone here know how many Tories have been suspended for anti semitism/Islamophobia? Was Johnson suspended after publishing Seventy Two Virgins? 🤔 https://www.jewishnews.co.uk/boris-johnson-accused-of-employing-pernicious-antisemitic-tropes-in-books/ No hypocrisy here at all eh!

You would hope that it was down to a catastrophic intel failure but it is odd. The last people you expect to be caught with their pants down are the Israeli intelligence/military. Then we have the reports that Netanyahu previously supported Hamas financially. The New York Times reported on the numerous intel signs that were known to the Israeli government prior to the attack. There was a strange delay in the military response. As conspiracy theories go you can see why this one gained traction, not least for the way that the response by the IDF has been far from proportionate. Netanyahu had a great deal to answer for. Not just for the deliberate mass killing of tens of thousands of civilians and the destruction of Gaza, but also for the lack of preparedness for an attack that they had plenty of intel that was forthcoming. As for the latest effort to derail Labour’s election bid, the Mail have been playing a sneaky game. They have been sitting on this story for some time but chose to drop it just when Labour had no chance to replace the candidate before the by-election. Not only that, they released part of it then left it a while to release the rest to make sure they got a double whammy against Labour. Why not release the story as soon as they had it and all at once? Clearly it was held back to do the most damage. So much for democracy. Labour voters are now left with hard choices to make and have no where else to go. One more point. The right wing media are all over Labour and antisemitism whilst not batting an eyelid to the Islamophobia rife in the Tory Party. But even when Boris Johnson writes anti semantic prose in a novel, not a whisper (they are even supporting his return to politics). And where were the anti-semantic jibes from the Farage fan boys (of which we have one at least here) when he came out with this? https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/us-jewish-lobby-nigel-farage-power-anti-semitism-ukip-leader-a8031191.html The Tories have no positive stuff to fight on in advance of the election so buckle up for more anti-Semantic, anti-woke, yeah but Jeremy Corbyn, Starmer defended terrorists and didn’t prosecute Savile, doesn’t know what a woman is crap daily from the right wing media and repeated endlessly on social media by those who still think that Labour are to blame for the last 14 years of misrule and that Brexit was a good thing.

I agree that he needed to be suspended. I don’t necessarily agree that everyone who questions the government of Netanyahu has to be an anti-Semite. If you question Sunak’s government it doesn’t make he a Brit hater. If you question Macron’s government it doesn’t mean you hate the French. He was unwise in his choice of words but there are questions about how this was allowed to happen, given all of the intelligence we now know that the Israelis had a ground level that something was brewing. Many Israelis are openly questioning Netanyahu about why this happened when they are supposed to be one of the best prepared military forces in the world. It doesn’t make them antisemitic. It makes them ordinary people who want answers. And before I get jumped on again, I am not saying that Netanyahu let this attack go ahead deliberately, but I like many any normal people, would like to know why so many red flags were seemingly missed. The disproportionate reaction had not only served to alienate Israel from some of its allies but it has also served to make Jewish people around the world feel more unsafe. It has made a volatile region even more volatile and it is effecting world peace. No one is above scrutiny. Not even Netanyahu. His mistake was not to question, but to make assumptions that have yet to be proven or otherwise.

Apparently some members are paying more than 2%. I agree that Trump/the US have a right to expect member nations in NATO to pay their way, where it turns into the usual Trump batshit crazy land is where he says if they don’t, then Russia can do what they like with them. That stuff might go down well in a redneck roadhouse, but it has no place in international politics - not least when there is another sociopath looking to exploit any weaknesses in the West.

The only MP to take a major media kicking so far has been Ed Davey. What makes this particular story more pertinent is that Panorama had already broken the story a few months before her visit to Davos whereas the issue was still relatively low key when Davey was involved and this particular politician is now actively lining up her bid to be the next leader of the Conservative Party.

One of the people planning to lead the Tory Party when they dump Sunak… https://amp.theguardian.com/uk-news/2024/feb/11/kemi-badenoch-failed-to-raise-horizon-scandal-when-she-met-fujitsu-at-davos

The West are still providing munitions, isn’t that providing support for the offensive? Neither Biden nor Sunak are calling for an immediate halt. Isn’t that complicit support? You really need to pay attention. Or it this just your usual attempt at a wind up? what do you think the air strikes against the Houthis were all about? Asking them not to kill the civilians? 😳 How polite of them. Where are the economic sanctions? Where is the condemnation that we have seen against Putin? Selling weapons is still providing weapons isn’t it? Those selling arms to Israel aren’t going to go bust over night if they stop. How would you feel if it was Muslims killing tens of thousands of civilian “pesky Jews”? Still ok with that? One of your many problems is that you don’t seem to be able to comprehend that it is entirely possible to to want the killing of civilians to stop on both sides of the conflict and to understand that It is also entirely possible to be as critical of the actions of the IDF as well as Hamas. As I am sure you will understand though, the issue has grown since the terrorist attack on 7th October to an assault of genocidal proportions against the Palestinians. Or is that ok with you because they are just pesky Muslims?

The sad thing is that these atrocities have been going on week after week. At what point do the West say enough is enough and stop backing Netanyahu and his government’s butchery and destruction. Surely even the most blinkered can see that this went well past a “defensive” action months ago.

Makes you wonder what will happen when we finally lose a match. Calls for Martin to be sacked? It is truly bizarre after the run we have been on. How anyone thinks that slagging your team off lifts morale is deluded. Nothing wrong with constructive criticism, which you would imagine Martin gave them at half time (as opposed to the “metaphorical booing” as suggested by a poster earlier). It is the sign of a good side when they pick up three points after a less than stellar performance. This is a team worth getting behind and that doesn’t mean booing when they go in two down at half time. As for the goals. I thought the first one took a bit of a deflection. He had no chance with the second and it is very harsh to expect him to save the third.

It is not as if Trump hadn’t been making the same gaffes though… https://ny1.com/nyc/all-boroughs/politics/2024/02/09/both-biden--trump-have-had-their-share-of-verbal-gaffes This man has already been and could become the next President of the US. At least it gives Duckhunter a laugh. https://amp.theguardian.com/us-news/2024/feb/11/donald-trump-says-he-would-encourage-russia-to-attack-nato-countries-who-dont-pay-bills

Good to know that we are all in it together Rishi. https://amp.theguardian.com/politics/2024/feb/09/rishi-sunak-paid-effective-tax-rate-of-23-on-22m-income-last-year

More horror for the displaced Palestinian civilians. https://amp.theguardian.com/world/live/2024/feb/09/middle-east-crisis-israel-gaza-war-hamas-updates

Short memory Rishi? Probably not the best idea to attack Starmer on U turns when you have plenty in your own cupboard. https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/politics/tory-mp-laura-trott-skewered-32082113.amp https://www.bigissue.com/news/politics/rishi-sunak-u-turn-house-building-nhs-fines/ And yet another example of incompetence by a member of this government. It is beyond embarrassing. https://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/amp/entry/treasury-minister-laura-trott-in-car-crash-bbc-interview-over-economics_uk_65c55f8de4b069b665dec3e1/

This 100%. He and his party have got nothing to fight with so they are desperately trying to create “issues” that they can use to fight the next election. with. One of those “issues” being created is the “cultural war”. The fact that a very minor issue has ruffled so many feathers shows that it is possible to take a minor issue that is a big deal to a minority and make it a more widespread big deal by repeating it endlessly. Sunak made a fool of himself yesterday but Badenoch immediately piped up and added more fuel to the fire, making it a major talking point. This country is on its knees but we have a failed government whose only response is to weaponise a small percentage of the population who really should be treated more sympathetically. I think most normal, rational people see this for what it is.

Thanks for the advice but I think you should direct your attention and advice to the pile on crowd. They are the ones who do the polluting. If you find my posts so problematic just ignore them. It doesn’t matter what I say and how I say it, there is a group of people who think it is fun to jump on anything I say. They could just as easily ignore my posts, but where is the sport in that? It happened with MLG. It happened with TWAR. Anyway, the good news is that there are more “social crusaders” posting regularly now which will probably scare the thread polluters off and means I can leave them to carry the flag. As for the chill pill, I have seen you get wound up when people deliberately misinterpret what you say. You know what is going on here just as much as I do. If I stop posting tomorrow it isn’t going to prevent them from doing it to someone else when they find another suitable target. Maybe you should suggest that the wind up merchants should modify their behaviour or are you worried about them targeting you too?

Yes, I know. I looked him up after reading his article. I posted it because it is similar to others I have read and the longer this goes on, the more it is apparent that what happened on 7th October isn’t exactly as Netanyahu would have us believe. Just because he is pro Putin, it doesn’t necessarily mean that we should discredit what he says about the Hamas attack. If what he says about that day should be discredited because he is anti-Israeli, why should the pro Israeli Haaretz be given any more credence in what it has to say in rebuttal? The evidence seems to back up what he and others say about the use of the Hannibal directive and if you actually read the whole article you don’t have to be a munitions expert to understand that tanks and missiles are going to do an awful lot more damage to humans and property than small arms fire and rpg’s. At some point there will be an independent official report into the events of that day and we won’t have to speculate any more, but given that the IDF have already shown that they have no regard for the lives of civilians, including their own, do not be surprised if the findings are that the civilian death toll that day was exacerbated by the Israeli response.

An interesting read for those with an open mind about what happened on 7th October. It also supports my earlier post about the numbers of Israelis reportedly killed by friendly fire. https://thegrayzone.com/2023/11/18/video-what-happened-october-7/amp/