um pahars

He put something like 130k in in return for new shares when there was a "rights issue" in circa 1999 as a part of the 3million to raise funds for SMS. But as for this story, then i don't think it has any legs (not least because it would be trumpeted from the roof tops had it been the case).

Although there is also the argument that these new players will need to gel with their new team mates and may create an unsettled feeling, I do think our experience last season shows you what some good loans can achieve. Wright, Perry & Lucketti etc certainly played their part in helping us stay up (in much the same way that Saiejs has improved us since he arrived), so would have liked to have seen some movement. Forest look to have used the window well, but not sure what our other main rivals, Plymouth and Norwich, achieved????

What were we thinking of???? Clifford was an early version of Poortvliet!!!! We might meet up with him again if things go really pear shaped:rolleyes::rolleyes:

Interesting, as at a fans forum at SMS he came across really well and quite inspirational (then again he was up alongside either Redknapp or Burley, so inspiring that I can't remember which one). Of course, that's not to say that the apointment was the right one at the right time alongside the right people with regards us;)

Simple is probably the right word to use;) HTH

You never fail to deliver LOL. As usual you waddle on here and get it wrong again LMFAO. What next, posts about Lowe raising 25million or was it 8 million from the mortgage and the remortgage??? Poortvliet should be kept on and our poor performance was not down to him??? BTW, loved you earlier post slagging off Wilde who is now Lowe's right hand man and the suggestion that Lowe runs the Club as a business. Just not sure what business would be happy with a CEO overseeing something like a 70% drop in income, a substantial fall in share price, falling footfall through the door, a PR disaster and failed appoitnments & strategies that have pushed this Club to the brink. Sounds like he could get a job at AIG, Giltnir and Landsbanki.

Well, it's quite simple. Don't come out with such ballox and it won't challenged. Of course it wouldn't stop him saying it, but it wouldn't make it right, nor would it provide more fuel to his argument or make it more "correct". At least you've changed your tune now.

But it is illogical to say it gives fuel to his argument when that is clearly not the case as you yourself have pointed out (and you're from a more pro Lowe perspective than many).

Benjii's spot on in that Thai customs won't give a monkey's as effectively you won't be treading on their soil. If you're really that worried then pack any stuff in your suitcases as I'm assuming your luggage will be checked through to Oz. He's also right about Oz customs and they were all over me like a rash when I went round the world and made me scrub my hiking boots for ages before they let me in!!!!!

Two points. Firstly, people will of course moan after a loss and they will obviously moan even more, and probably protest, after a series of them. That's obvious and if things were going swimmingly, then we would not want, nor need a change. But things weren't going swimmingly and we were in need of a change. Just as people deserve and receive the plaudits (and money) when things go well, then you should expect some stick and maybe a sacking/change when they're not. Secondly, if you concede that they didn't stop just because of a win, then you must also concede that it is illogical to suggest it give fuel to the line of argument you sugest.

They didn't just stop because of a home win. I'm sure many shared my sentiments that we had made our point, had also probably aided change with our reactions at the Doncaster game, and as Crouch himself mentioned publicly, we were now willing to give our support to the manager and team in the run in. I pray daily that we will stay up, but a "great escape" will not wipe away the fact that the decision making and leadership at the Club this season has been found badly wanting. Obviously logisitcs will play a part as we will be away on the last game of the season, but I think there will still be sort of a protest against the current incumbents once the season has ended. Given that there will be no games to focus people, then I think the most obvious form will be the non renewal of season tickets mentioned on here before.

Would be interested to know what the payment was for, but I can't believe it is as much as 400,000. He's notched up 42 appearances for us (57 if you include subs) so maybe it's based on a 40 or 50 milestone. If it is an appearance based payment, then it makes the decision to go with McGoldrick, (and then persevere with him), a very interesting one as it puts a different perspective on his bucks per goal (particularly when compared against others we shipped out) !!!!

If you're only in transit then you won't even see customs. Or are you spending some time in Bangkok?????

What is crazy is that we could draw or even lose and be no worse off!!!!!! Forest are away (albeit at Barnsley), Plymouth are also away (Blackpool) and Norwich have Sheff Weds at home. I could easily see them all only picking up a point, which would mean we would still be in with a shout (particularly with our game in hand). Of course, if we're going to overhaul teams then we have to close the gap, and Charlton is obviously our best chance of doing that, but still think we will be in with a chance of staying up even up tp the 90th minute of the last game.

No, I saw it and it made about as much sense as the drivel from you that I outlined. HTH

I personally think that if football started to live within it's means, then it would still be possible to sustain four professional divisions. The biggest problem is players wages, but IMHO there is enough money in the game so long as the wages paid out are sensible (after speaking to a few of those involved with relatively smaller clubs e.g. Exeter, Stockport & Crewe).

Granty, do some of your digging and find out exactly what happens in the lower tiers as I'm sure a salary cap is already in existence in League 2 (think League 1 also tried it for a season or two but then gave up). I'm sure I remember Malwhinney and others mentioning it a while back. I think it may be voluntary, but the main drive is for teams to run on a more sensible financial basis.

It's a footballing debt and so would not be written off (not unless we want to start over in the Jewson Wessex).

I don't think anyone is under the illusion that we would (or could) compete with the "big" clubs for the "top" players. We will never be in the market for the superstars who will of course follow the big money, but at the same time the strategy we followed meant we were never in the market for the next tier of players who may have helped us to maintain our top flight status. A too rigid wage structure (on an individual basis), coupled with a speculative and sometimes scattergun approach to transfers, along with a revolving managerial door meant we never gave ourselves the best chance possible. At one time our income was something like 9th in the Premiership, it's a pity we didn't have a strategy or a CEO/Chairman who could have capitalised on that instead of risking it all through a number of very poor decisions. And as an addendum, this type of over the top sensationalising, mentioning Kaka and suggesting we need to get real as we have no chance of competng with the top clubs is just the kind of response that Lowe would come out with challenged. He would also miss the point, in that most fans don't expect to be signing the mega stars and competing with the top clubs for the best talent, but they did want us to be as competitive as was possible given our resources. Although he would always say "We don't want to do a Leeds", it was an out of touch sentiment, as there weren't many supporters out there suggesting that we did go out and live massively beyond our means and spend extortionate amounts of money that we didn't have. But then again how ironic that under his leadership we are very close to "doing a Leeds" after going down his route.

They went down to Div 3 the same year we got relegated (May 2005), so I think 3 years.

And you could have used exactly the same line of argument in November 2004 or January 2009!!!!! Sometimes the mistake is not in getting rid of an underperforming/dire/out of his depth manager, it's the appointment in the first place. And as for your initial assertion, well sadly the role of Lowe plays big part in the performance of the two managers, with each of them having to work within a strategy overseen by Lowe. For example, many on here argue that Wotte's task has been made somewhat easier due to a lifting of the restrictions within which he can operate (e.g. much greater freedom to use older players). It is a rather naive view to believe that the manager performs in isolation to the overall strategy of the CEO and Board.

We went through all this a couple of weeks back on here. NickG's view is that Wotte was only involved in the academy;) despite Wotte also being billed as Assistant First Team Coach and the OS continually telling us about his involvement as a part of the Dutch Duo / Revolutionary Coaching Set Up etc etc etc

For me, so much depends on other teams results. I can see us getting something like 8 points (W2 D2 L3) or maybe an optimistic 11 (W3 D2 L2), but I've got this sneaking feeling that either would be enough as I think Forest and Plymouth will really struggle in the run in. I think a draw on the last day will be needed and we'll get it, relegating Forest in the process!!!!!

I think mistakes can be, and are made at every club and will often contribute to relegation. And of course they may not be the same mistakes from one season to the next. Additionally, I think some relegations just come down to the fact that many clubs can't make the jump to the big time and stay their due to lack of quality in their playing squad and/or lack of resources to support that. But I do think there has been a certain degree of similarity between our demise in 2005 and the current situation e.g. poor managerial appointment, poor transfer policy and acquisitions, sticking with that poor manager too long etc etc etc. We're certainly not unique and we are following in the footsteps of many others and I'm sure there will be many more.