dubai_phil

There's theory and then there is Corporate Branding, hence why I can see the PL simply saying phew Club not named... sweep it under the carpet with everything else. (Although one day the carpet will have so much under it the edges won't touch the floor!)

Yep I'm retarded. I don't read the Grauniad OK what I meant to say was that it doesn't actually mention his "employer" in the indictment. It mentions the owner. My (college level) of law is pretty slim but I know it's pedantics make MLG seem off the cuff, so if they (Club) weren't named as doing it for the purpose of avoiding EMPLOYERS NI then they are highly unlikely to be "tried for it" at this hearing. Employee NI avoidance is onw thing but the club look to have a ready made get out clause. THEY didn't pay the money Just my IMHO that's all

Well, it's obvious. we are massively broke and massively in debt and nobody will deal with us because we don't pay. (Well, that's what the resident blue trolls on the poopey lounge thread keep telling us)

IMHO the only real way any new sanctions can be aimed at them would have to come from UEFA or FIFA. They can be seen as having taken the PL punishment and moved on points deduction wise. The ONLY real harm that could come out of the trial would be "Un-Registered Agents" ala Luton. BUT with this being a very specific charge in this specific case, UNLESS 'Arry turns "grass" to save his career (IF he felt he could lose) there really is no way that the English Authorities would see any need. OR if 'Arry has evidence that "misrepresentations" were made to the Authorities about finances, but then what would be the gain for 'Arry, the submissions to court by Storrie were after 'Arrys days. BUT if some of the dodgy deals/agents broke UEFA rules there may be some grumbles.. BUT with the way English Football keeps p1ssing off Blatter, something coming out that is FIFA related - that may be a different kettle of skates. Still think it highly unlikely anything will stick to the few. But that's fine, they will bumble along mending clocks and finding ways to save water

There should also be a distinction for the MANY Saints fans who live overseas. We only get back for something between 2 and 5 games a season, but since 1967 have probably seen more games than some of the latest uber fans. Probably held ST's at the Dell & SMS for longer than some of those wavers have lived. Some get plenty of prior notice and can plan well in advance, others have to blag work trips and bend their employment rules and get back at short notice. Are those guys (who were at Oldham, Sheffield and the likes Away back in the 2nd Division days) Plastics? Most of the times I have come back I have been lucky enough to have a mate who can get me a ticket on his ST or Dbase info. That still meant a nightmare at the JPT which I (and my son between us) spent around a grand flying back just to see. He was sat on a crush barrier on the Milton to see MLT when he was 5 moved here when he was 6 but still saw 3 games last Xmas and 2 more in the season. Yet he only gets short notice of having a weekend free. Yet twice now he's had to miss games because they were sell outs and he couldn't plan in advance. It was a close run thing for me to get back this coming weekend - tickets are really tight already but if it had been an away game - no chance. Cannot be difficult to have a "Making a special effort Dbase"

This If there was tax avoidaqnce and Mlan was paying 'Arry for services related to his work then there would be issues over National Insurance that the Club should have paid. Don't see any mention of that. This really should not impact on their continued stumble towards the really dark side

Jacques Delors

Just booked through LGW no airmiles to LHR ditto land 6:35 Friday heading back Sunday lunchtime. My "Driver" parks down near the old City Wall and usually goes for Fish & Chips to Mike's (was Max's) (before you get to Debenhams coming from Dock side) for lunch. Open to ANY ideas for a pub close to there if anyone wants to meet up PM en route

Yes. Not only am I a Plastic, I'm also a cheapskate Plastic having FINALLY managed to book my airmiles ticket for next weekend after a dismal fail to get back for Boro. All I need now is a Match Day ticket. Whadda mean it's sold out? WTF where did all those fans come from Arrrgghh

Yes, but by your own logic, those like my mates who didn't miss a home game in L1 but have real money troubles this year and can't make every game will then be called plastics when we get promoted or they sort out their finances by ctually finding new jobs.

The Chapel will be looking a damn side better than usual on Saturday. Thanks to me being there AT LAST! fank fook was really worried I wouldn't find a weekend when I could get a flight!

Oh well, another argument that neither side will ever listen to. Still the uber's can console themselves by taking up the well known refrain before Away fans in the PL do.... "Where were you when we/you were sh1t?" Strangely, this season I know two people who have had to reduce their attendance at games. One is a manager who has been with a Council for 10 years. He kept his job in the re-orgs & cut backs BUT at age 53 he was told quite simply - 30% pay cut or redundancy. But as he was a nasty Manager he had no Union support. Another mate was kicked out his flat because "The Landlord was returning from overseas" (did he hell he just re-let it at 20% more). Having had no pay rise for the past two years (because of the economy) his rent has gone up and he now struggles. There's a recession on. It is hurting good Saints fans. Will he go see us play Donny? Or will he be at WHU? Anyone who thinks money doesn't come into it - well I actually REALLY hope you get a shock in your life really soon like so many others have done. (Oh & I'm going Saturday not because it's Brighton, simply because it's the only weekend I can get away from here before Xmas. I could have saved about 100 quid coming midweek this week and grief from future Mrs D_P but no, I want to see us play. Sorry I'm a plastic)

I won 2 free tickets to see Britney in concert. I'm just back from it. I didn't post this in the what are you listening to thread because it really wasn't music. Hell, she kept forgetting the words to her own songs. Luckily she was miming so most the crowd didn't notice. It was a Light & Dance Spectacular without much dancing. Although the Male dancers seemed to pay homage to the original Police Academy by wearing outfits from the Blue Oyster Bar. She is really getting a bit too dumpy for an evening of Swimsuit demonstrations, and really not so sure how her LapDance of a Local kid is going to go down with the censors here. I detect a bit of an uproar. It was about as sexy as a fart in a Jacuzzi and her bum is not worthy of the name compared to Kylie. It was worth the price of a free ticket but I'm pretty hacked off about paying 6 quid for the petrol to get there. If she comes to a venue near you soon & your 13 year old daughter insists on going - LET HER GO WITH HER MATES, trust me, you'd rather sit in the Fratton End on a Saturday afternoon

Hmm Voldermort Dark Horses Ah ha we know what comes next The Dark Lord returns as DOF

Another point. As saints FANS and wanting us to move into the PL be competitive and challenge for places in the top 6, then we need bums on seats. Who actually gives a flying fook about Plastic Fans? They are money in the bank and the more of them the better. The uber fans still have their ST's (they wave them at those of us who can't make it every week. So what IS their gripe?) They get in every week and have their owm seats - they go to EVERY away game of course so they are always first out the hat at ballot time - WHAT IS THEIR PROBLEM? Is it that they just have to wait longer in the queue for a manky pie at HT? Some people get to whatever game they can - hell, didn't see so many of the uber fans at the Torquay JPT game last year - some have to look at the schedule (like Trousers) and say I can get to 3 games a season, which one shall I watch? BUT the point is that with our catchment area and with this style of football we really COULD be getting crowds of 40,000 plus IF we had the room and THAt would make us a Competitive Team. TBH, perhaps the uberfans wanted us to stay broke, or want some kind of ubermoney giver in charge or even want the poopey model - all 9,000 of them. I do NOT want to get promoted and then have another 5 or 10 years of "Great Escapes" (ie being krap) I want us to be successful, to pay OUR KIDS wages that keep them with us and to be at the level in the PL that MAKES then want to stay. And unfortunately THAT needs money and THAT needs bums on seats every week. And THAT means Plastics & Prawn Sandwiches

Lol It's not like it hadn't already been mentioned a few hundred times on the Lounge thread about their Business Plan........ It also bears a remarkable resemblance to the Overall Strategy of the Business Plan in the BBC Panorama programme "How to Buy a Football Club" that got Bryan Robson into trouble for showing how somebody could potentially have interests in two football clubs. There is actually a clear link in all of that (ie how could the Manager of the Thai National team get filmed with something so close to what poopey seem to be doing)which a decent bit of detective work or a long weekend in Bangkok (when the floods have gone) could find out. But the specualtion provides far more entertainment than the truth.

Frankfurt - Southampton on Flybe 140 quid Ticket (only one available) in Corporate 99 Quid My son flew back for that to watch Saints against the Mancs. He could justify that cost but couldn't justify it for a Charlton game. He took in 3 games last year and has managed 2 so far this year when he could fit it around his work. When he added up the cost of those games it came to more than an ST. He's unlucky, his job took him to Germany, he'd far rather be an uber fan

oops 'puter troubles double post sorry

Sorry, this argument is krap. The Demogrpahics are simple the Saints catchment area contains around 4 million people. A great many - like around 50% will be male. Now anyone can do a google on what percent of the male populations like Football or watch football. Inside that 2 million will be several hundred thousand males who have watched Saints on and off for as long as they have been able to find a way to get tickets. They are NOT plastics, they are people like Buctoomin, me, EoA, even TDD who cannot get to every game. they will be like my mate the Taxi driver who has to work a set number of Saturdays a year. He got his ST this tear even THOUGH he knew he'd only get to around 15 or 16 games. Is he a Plastic because he could get to a Tuesday night game against WHU? I posted on the poopey thread. Ex Village Cricket team mates who used to watch around 5 or 6 games a season - they cheered on Saints but applauded Thierry Henry - they weren't SAINTS fans but were FOOTBALL fans. They follow us they know as much about us poopey & the PL as any uber fan. There ARE no Plastic Fans. That is a dream of the Stone Island Muppets in the Northam. I didn't see a single Plastic at Wembley for the JPT - I saw 55,000 SAINTS fans giving EVERYTHING to cheer us to Victory. Respect to those lucky enough to go every week. Respect to the Club for having systems to try and ensure they can get tickets to Away games they want to go to. But if they really are uber fans why do so many moan that they need tickets for Brizzle Away. Surely their ST's would get them one?

Well, don't be surprised if a DOF comes in. The Panorama Documentary had that model in the Business Plan Mind you if he DOESN'T come in, that then shows how tight the budget really is, which would probably be better news for the trolls, but bad news for the real fans like Mack & Mero

The Euro was a great concept. Then Politicians and National Ego's got involved. As such Countries were allowed to join at the wrong Exchange Rates Then those Countries ignored the basics of the rules. Many people pointed this out but were branded as idiots or Eurosceptics. William Hague was probably the most accurate in calling it but he was another dumbf\/ck Tory who wasn't toeing the let's do it line. It was a great invention of Jacques Delors - and the French. However it has been Germany who has MOST benefitted from having an artifically low Exchange Rate as everyone bought German cars & technology at affordable prices. Now the cows are coming home to roost in the Rhubarb Trees. Everyone knows what that really means but nobody wants to explain it. My ONLY question in all of this sadly predictable mess is this. Why is it that the SAME people who told us that the Euro was a fantastic thing are now the people telling us that the world will be doomed without it? The Euro IS unsustainable in it's current framework and form. The German people (rightly) do not want to pay for Greeks to retire at 57 and avoid their taxes. The PAIN of the collapse will be horrific, BUT if it is managed it will be short lived and EVERYONE can grow again and Democracy COULD regain a foothold in Europe. Or they can muddle on. Ambrose Prichard-Evans nailed it in an article 4 years ago in the Torygraph. he's been right ever since then. The Euro is dead, sort it out and get a new one FAST and everyone can move on and take short term pain. The longer the mess lasts the longer the pain will be when it fails.

Perfect, thanks for the link. think we'll settle for 9 holes but have a set Par format based on the stopping time for each venue. Jeez it seemed a daft idea for a trip to places that used to be good ex pat haunts 15/20 years ago but had now fallen on "hard times", but jeez, I've had people wanting rulings on Medical Exemptions, Religious Rulings..... Still sent all of them off to the European Tour web site = lol But we DO have a proper Open Top Double Decker bus already booked.... That is just a disaster waiting to happen as well

OK some of you may have heard that I am a bit of a bad golfer and stalker of Golfing Greats (while wearing the Sash Shirt tho!). Well my Golf Society (what us plebs that can't afford the membership fees here have to join) is full of Old Farts and we've decided to play Pub Golf in a couple of weeks time. Thing is I played it once on a mate's stag and really don't remember anything about it. But the old farts have voted me as one of the "Committee" (WTF!!???) My Youngest says it was all the rage when he was at Uni a couple of years ago. But can't remember much about the nights let alone rules etc. Anyone played it? Any Anecdotes? Help?? (Oh & for Eric - Big Bus Co & Deira Dark Side in Tux's - enuff said)

Good post FC. Taking on your last point about true blue fans it also relates to their attendance issues now. For more years than I can remember I played for a Village Cricket Team. I was a Saint and we had a 657 member. We got along by not talking about football other than in generic terms. In the 80's 3 or 4 of the lads would come down with me to watch Saints play in the Old Div 1 and came to away games. They weren't true Saints fans but they loved their football. In the Noughties, I wasn't around and we were sh1t anyway so they went to games with the (now retired) 657 skate. They even went to away games. because they loved their football and they loved the crack of the day out. Even today they know everything there is to know about just about every club, installed ART so they could watch all PL games every weekend. What NONE of them have done in the past couple of years is go to watch a game at either of Nottarf or SMS. Although one of them is now bugging me as to when I will next be back as he fancies going to see what is getting everyone so excited. They were never Plastic Fans - they never alluded to be true supporters, they just loved watching PL football and applauding Thierry Henry et al, they were fans of FOOTBALL. Those football watchers are one of the reasons there is such a few these days. My ex 657 mate - yeah his phot is in the book, he hates it now he's over 40 and no he hasn't been on principle for a year or so, like many with Rupert. He is a fan and I admire and respect and feel for him, Mack & Mero. But they have quite a few more years of pain to go yet. Our sentence was 5 years for 4 grand. The few for 130 mil deserve decades

Agree with this. Also "From Afar" it has been noticeable how much more important The Poppy has become in recent years. Amazingly we can actually now buy Poppies down here from the local Spinneys Supermarket which is a nice touch. But interestingly, as moted in one of the Press articles today, England played Sweden on 10/11/2001 and no fuss was made and we didn't wear Poppy Shirts back then. Fair play to the Marketing Department at EDL for recognising a cracking opportunity and pushing it through. (About all I will ever say in their support TBH) Strange to find CAmeron, Prince William & The EDL all jumping onto the same bandwagon though. Oh and another cynical comment - most of this was stirred up in Murdoch influenced media, the same day more Hacking revelations came out. Fair play to everyone for finding the compromise with the arm bands though. As Dr Who said - Nobody Dies today.....