trousers

I would usually agree, if the "simple and most obvious" explanation wasn't just as bizarre than some of the conspiracy theories...

Agree, but wouldn't the punishment in that circumstances be significantly less than if we had willingly sent him up there with explicit instructions to spy on a training session knowing that it would be in breach of the rules?

One would like to think so 👍🏻

Yep, exactly. Imagine if one of us nutjob conspiracy theorists had come on here before 'Spygate' came to light and said: "You know what, I reckon what Tonda should do to help us win the play offs is send an analyst up to Middlesbrough's training ground within 72 hours of the game and record their training session in plain sight on his iPhone. We might get chucked out if he gets caught (which is quite likely) but it's a risk worth taking", we'd have been laughed out of town for coming up with such a ridiculous idea... Something doesn't add up, that's for sure...

I know this "whistleblower set a trap" notion is conspiracy theory territory, and that kind of thinking inevitably attracts the wrath of the forum thought police but, to me, the alternative reality - that we willing sent a junior analyst to stand in plain sight to video a training session knowing that it was breaking the 72 hour rule and knowing that it could lead to us being thrown out of the competition - seems even more bizarre than some of the 'conspiracy theories' to me.... Are we really stupid and naive enough to have done that...? If it is a simple case of us knowingly breaking the rules, at Tonda's level or above, then we deserve to be chucked out of the competition. All I'll say is that the emergence of a whistleblower that just happened to work for both clubs in recent times seems a tad convenient (from Middlesbrough's perspective) to me...

I made the fatal mistake of going out last night and it's a nightmare trying to catch up as the thread is growing quicker than I can read...! Currently on page 79.... 🙂

Will Salt face masks on every Saints seat at Wembley... Make it so!

I was just thinking that Middlesbrough have done something than no man, extra terrestrial being or supernatural force has ever been able to achieve... And that's to unite the disparate factions within Saintsweb! We've even had people agreeing with Soggy FFS... Bravo, Middlesbrough, bravo 👏🏼👏🏼 😂

Fair enough 👍🏻

Hmm, fair point, but why have the EFL charged us under both rules then if the 72 hour rule trumps the other rule?

Bree - Stephens - THB - Manning Edit: bollocks... Beaten to it! Well played chaps!

Even if he wasn't aware of the 72 hour rule, observing another team's training is still in breach of the lesser "acting in good faith" rule, hence he was always going to be acting a tad cagey....

Not a fan then?

## Interesting first post having been registered for 3 years klaxon ## P.s. source?

One theory is, we "haven't been caught before" because other clubs do it and there's been some kind of gentleman's agreement between clubs to turn a blind eye (especially outside of the 72 hour embargo period)... And that we only got "caught" this time because Gibson / Middlesbrough decided to break ranks in an attempt to unsettle us in the playoffs. As I say, just a theory....

Nah... We were told time and time again during our poor run in the first part of the season that we had a squad full of mediocre championship players, at best, that no manager on planet Earth... "Not even Pep"... Could get a tune out of...

Because there's a chance they might do 'spying' themselves too...?

Yep, that's probably it in a nutshell. I definitely reckon there'll be other clubs thinking "shit, we could get caught up in this next", especially if it goes to appeal and/or the scope of investigation broadens

Henry Winter just being interviewed on BBC News... Starts off by saying that we were caught spying "on Middlesbrough's private training ground".... Technically, yes, but he gave the impression it wasn't 'publicly accessible'... Cheers Henry 👍🏻

Indeed... It's nowhere near our self inflicted points penalties at the start of this season... 🙂

Nice try.... The regulation specifically refers to 'training sessions' though... (Yes, I know you were probably being tongue-in-cheek )

Indeed... I bet a lot of clubs are keeping very quiet for this very reason...

Indeed, although the precident for just breaching 3.4 alone is a fine. (Not that believe we haven't breached 127 in some shape or form)

Once again, note the more adult / rational approach being taken by Hull City and their fans. They're right, the root cause of the chaos here is the EFL's inadequate rule book, not the (no doubt many) clubs that bend or break the rules...