The Kraken

Yeah. God forbid people should use an online forum to, you know, talk about stuff.

I don't doubt for a minute that pretty much all of the players who played a major part last year can more than hold their own at Championship level. We've got rid of Gobern, but I don't see anyone else of the established players who would struggle at a higher league. I think we're just missing a few players who can really improve the quality of the team. there aren't wholesale changes needed, which is why I'm not too concerned about the lack of transfer activity so far. We'll see what players arrive in the next few weeks, we know NA wants to bring in new blood, and the rumours we've heard so far are encouraging.

Agreed. The club will not outwardly aim for mid-table, they will come out and say they are aiming for top spot. But there's a very good reason we have a 5 year plan; the club expects it to take that long to get back to the Premier League. Which suggests they won't be bank-rolling us as we've previously seen with the likes of QPR etc. I think we have a good core of the side, and currently a squad that would comfortably consolidate itself in the division even if we made no more signings. I just wonder how far up that table we could get with 3 or 4 quality signings.

I think the next 2 or 3 weeks are going to tell us an awful lot about next season's prospects and ultimately our longer-term future. I have and still maintain that we need at least 4 or 5 new players in if we are to compete at the top end of the table; I think the current squad would do well to finish in the top half. As I see it we need a quality replacement for Jaidi, at least one maybe two central midfielders, a centre forward with pace and who can be relied upon for 20 goals, plus a decent attacking right back (what I've seen of Butterfield and Richardson is lower to mid table quality at best). I accept the reasons why we haven't brought anyone in yet, but we're now at the point where players are back from holidays and signings start happening, so I'm hoping to see some from us pretty soon.

I'm not necessarily disagreeing here, as I clearly don't have too much idea of the hidden costs of a membership scheme. I am extremely surprised, however, at the notion that it would cost so much money to run. I'm guessing that the club think it wouldn't be self-sufficient while we're in the Championship, as there simply wouldn't be the demand for it; you wouldn't need to be a member to get tickets for most games, and there's no other real benefits. as a consequence the likely take-up would be pretty small and the club may think they would struggle to break even on it. In the Premier League it was massively advantageous to be a member in terms of being able to purchase match tickets early, sometimes at all. And at £20 a year, you only have to shift 5,000 memberships to see a revenue of £100K coming in. That easily pays for a full time member of staff of the dbase plus tie ins with all the other relevant departments IMO. In reality membership levels in the Premier League were at least double that figure, so at its peak I can't see a membership scheme as being anything other than a money spinner.

Chemical Bros were outstanding. I've seen them a couple of times live and they're just amazing.

Do you think Liverpool doesn't have similar local towns and villages outside the city centre or something? I have family in an around Liverpool and the catchment area is huge, if not in geographical size then certainly in terms of population. Take the Wirral peninsula alone and you have a population of around 300,000 just in its Metropolitan Borough, which is just on the other side of the Mersey to Liverpool. All clubs have a catchment area around them.

Done it a few times, but only whilst away skiing. Skiing off a mountain, thoroughly exhilarating (though of course you end up paragliding with your skis on). You'll love it. I'm not very good with heights but found it to be an amazing experience each time.

As I said. Until I hear from the chairman that his plans have accelerated and the club are going to increase the stadium capacity, I'm going to assume it won't happen yet. If someone says its "far too early to think about doing it yet", my assumption is that he doesn't mean he's going to start within the next 15 months. You clearly feel differently, and as I said, you carry on, I'm not going to try to change your mind. I'd appreciate it if you'd also do me the same courtesy; I've made my position very clear and I find your hypothesising in the face of evidence to the contrary all rather pointless. Please consider this my last comment on the matter with you.

Until I hear from the chairman that his plans have accelerated and the club are going to increase the stadium capacity, I'm going to assume it won't happen yet. But if you want to carry on believing that the club should and will install another 10K of seats right now, please be my guest.

God almighty MLG, let it go. The link you provided to Cortese's interview has already demonstrated that the club are considering a whole range of things for the future, that may or may not involve increasing the capacity of St. Mary's, or may or may not involve relocation to a new stadium. And, in Cortese's own words, its far too early to think about doing them right now. I really don't know what more there is to discuss on that matter. You have the words of the chairman and what he intends to do. End of story.

Sunderland played at Roker Park mate....

The simplest solution to this is to do what they did a few years back; have a bottle bar separate to the main bar. I think it was £3 for a half litre bottle of lager (Carlsberg, so not great but better than nothing). Hardly any queues at all for it.

Oh dear me. A blatant refusal to look facts in the face! Cortese has said (in that very interview above) that they are looking at plans for a whole host of things. They are planning for "what if" scenarios. And he'd be silly not to. I imagine he has commissioned many studies into how the stadium COULD be increased. How we could go from 32K to 36K, from 32K to 40K, and from 32K to 45K. He's also probably looked at the potential for a new stadium. Just because he's looking at how it COULD happen, it really doesn't mean it WILL happen. It's called a feasibility study.

Yeah, you're right. I imagine in one year, having achieved exactly what he had planned to achieve, he'd want to accelerate the process tenfold. Give it up; you're the only one clinging on to this ridiculous notion. Yes, there are plans to increase thye stadium capacity if necessary. But it won't be done for a long time.

Maybe you should have a good listen to what he actually says in that, if you think he's advocating your belief that we should be developing the stadium right now. Firstly he says that there were immediate plans for the stadium which involved making it more consumer friendly, such as getting beer into the hands of customers quicker. he then goes on to very clearly state that there is a bigger picture to be seen from the potential of whether to expand, but that it is far too early to talk about it right now. His words. Its far to early to do anything apart from just talk about it right now. He goes on to say they will consider all options, whether its an increase of St. Mary's or a new location, but reiterates that its far too early to do anything but talk about it now.

Out of interest, can you provide a link to exactly what Cortese is supposed to have said on the matter of a 45K stadium?

Thanks, that's what I thought you were advocating. My summary is that building a 45K stadium right now is the height of foolishness; using evidence of being able to sustain average crowds of 30K is even more foolhardy. If Cortese has the business brain we all think/hope he has, I can only pray he doesn't subscribe to your logic. I hope he will wait until we get to the premier League first. I then hope he will monitor season ticket sales and match ticket sales and make an informed decision on stadium enhancement from then.

Not really, as I edited my post. You weren't clear. Do you believe Saints should be extending the stadium now to this 45k figure you mention, so its ready in time for when we get to the Premier League? If not, when should we extend the stadium.

As I've previously said; talks. Please answer the question above; I'm having trouble understanding exactly what you're advocating here. Edit; that didn't really answer the question. Do you believe the club should be developing the stadium right now? Based on evidence that we can achieve crowds of 30K.

MLG; please answer this question. Do you believe Saints should be increasing stadium capacity now so that we have a larger stadium in time for kick off when we reach the Premier League? It seems to be that this is what you are suggesting. Or do you believe (as pretty much everyone else seems to) that the owners are playing a waiting game of "lets get to the Premier League, see what sustained levels our support can possibly get to, and make an informed decision from that?

Exactly. MLG fails to grasp the concept that if the evidence were there for a need for a bigger stadium, plans would be in place to make that happen right now. We have a 5 year plan to get to the Premier League, with MLG's "logic" building works would be commencing now to ensure we have a 45k stadium to play in as soon as we get there.

You seem to dismiss certain facts and instead provide complete speculation and hypothesis of your own. You refer to games selling out long in advance yet offer no evidence to back up your claims. You say "many" fans were unable to get a ticket yet provide no indication of how many. And then you pluck a potential figure of 45K fans turning up to watch Man Utd. You say that we only failed to sell out for a quarter of the least attractive games. First of all, without being in posession of the exact figures I would suggest it was more than that we didn't sell out for. The 25% figure referred to the number of games that dipped below 30K. Here’s the figures I previously provided. In 2001/02 we had 8 home league games with less than 31K (that's almost half). In 2002/03 we had 6 home league games with less than 31K (that's just about onethird). In 2003/04 we had 1 home league game with less than 31K. In 2004/05 we had 8 home league games with less than 31K (that's almost half). Now it’s impossible to tell from those figures whether the attendance was diminished through the away team not filling their allocation, or whether they had a smaller allocation but we couldn’t sell the home allocation. But the signs don’timmediately look good. And we have the 25% of games figure where the attendance was below 30K. As for your last post; of course the stadium expansion issue is complex. But if the evidence is indeed there that we need a bigger ground, and if it takes a lot of time and planning to get it sorted, I'm wondering why we have not started this by now so that by the time we get to the Premier League within our 5 year plan we can maximise revenues from those 45K crowds you talk about straight away. I have had a consistent approach throughout this thread, but I'll repeat it for you. If we get back to the Premier League, and if we're selling out week in week out, then that will be evidence for an increase in capacity. Until then, I think we've got bigger fish to fry trying to sell out our current stadium. Now I know you have an overwhelming desire to be seen to right about anything and everything. But in this case, I simply do not believe that there is any worthwhile evidence for the club to proceed in any substantial manner towards achieving a higher capacity of stadium (beyond actually talking about the fact that they're not ruling it out). Not yet. It may well happen in the future, I’m not for a minute saying it won't happen, but I think if the club have any sense whatsoever they will gauge supporter levels only when we get back to the Premier League, and then over a period of at a bare minimum of 2 or 3 years.

Of course I don't haave the ticketing database. I am going by the evidence to hand, which shows that we have failed to sell out the home allocation on many times even when at our peak. And I think you must have difficulties in reading what I've previously said if you think I've said we would never sell more than 32k. I have never said that. What I have said is this. There is plenty of evidence to show that we couldn't sell out the home allocation in previous years. I'm not going to go back over the figures I've previously provided, but they show a very significant proportion of games did not sell out. I've also said that the most season tickets we have sold is 23k. So there has never been a waiting list and plenty of fans of who cannot get an ST. I have also previously said that, for the big games, we definitely could have sold more than 32K. However, I have clarified that and said that any assessment of how many more tickets we could sell is purely hypothetical. And (I've previously said this so I'm continually going over old ground) I think it is telling that some people have come into this thread and explained that they live far away, but on the occasions they came back to try to see a game they very rarely had problems in getting a ticket. If the evidence does exist, I would ask why the club are not already expanding the stadium in line with their 5 year plan. We're upgrading the training ground, after all. A stadium expansion would likely take 1 or 2 years, so it would fit in with our timescale to start building now.