NickG

The club clearly want a more balanced squad. I also suspect that RK viewed AL and RL as squad players, preferring his two new signings. The question I have not seen those accusing the club of scaling back our ambitions answer is why are we trying to sign an England keeper? We finished 8th in a season when all three keepers were injured, our first choice quite badly. Easy for us to stick with status quo, but we appear to be investing millions. Season before last we finished 14th. How will we compare? GK - appear to be aiming to be much stronger. Defence - Danny Fox played 14 games. Shaw was inexperienced 17 year old. Are our two LB options worse? Midfield - Lallana had some criticism (26 games 4 goals) puncheon gone. Added Tadic possibly Taider & others. Also add options of JWP, Reed and isgrove and we look stronger, but most significantly add Wanyama - huge player for us - midfield much stronger. Forward - only had Lambert and JayRod. If JayRod hits 75% of form he had before injury he will be more valuable than he was in 12/13. Pelle looks useful so hopefully not miles away from RL's 15 goals. We also now have Gallagher. Good argument to say we are stronger. Is RK an upgrade on Adkins? Have Steve Davis, Fonte, Clyne and Schneiderlin improved? In my view we are well ahead of our 14th place season without further signings. With some of Taider, Schelotto, Celtic x 2, Vlaar, Ings etc we could have stronger squad than last season. The biggest two factors will be how good is RK and how quickly players settle. RK was the fans' choice and if as good as we hope I'm sure we are not as doomed as those wallowing make out (hence Fitz going quiet on wager after his hot air )

At least my 'hot air' discusses football, rather than rather sad macho 'I'll bet you ' challenges. As you want, I'll take the bet that I'm just talking hot air and we will get relegated. Do you get any enjoyment from saints? You just seem to whine about everything, when I was posting, at request, the stats being updated on our great run in league one, you and alpine whined, you saying you can't enjoy it as you know it will come to an end, well maybe it has now and perhaps you could have enjoyed it more. Try looking forward rather than back. Make it charity bet, then no real losers. £50 if we stay up.

Think some replies are confused, probably due to hot heated mindless ranting that has been going on! To be clear, it is bad we are losing players we are attached to, good players, or young players with potential. It is also much better to have a preseason like last year, with players in early and lots of positive energy. Things are negative and we are not where we were last season. However, I'm not sure what exactly people are disagreeing with in my OP? Even with the rumoured further departures we are probably better off than our 14th finish season - and Koeman spoke on Friday about several more signings to come, - for example we know we have bid for Forster. The attempts to sign Forster totally undermines the continual moaning about KL lacking ambition and cashing in. Why would a team who has given up of premier league, or an owner cashing in bother signing another keeper at all, when we have the three that have given us 8th and 14th? Surely that would be an easy position to justify no spending - none have left, even with all three current keepers suffering injuries we had impressive season. So, no need to spend money there particularly if happy to be relegated or just stay up. But, no, they have bid for a young member of the England squad - please explain how that fits? (BTW any replies that mention just a PR stunt or deliberately bidding too low will be filed in nutter responses ) We have seen some uninspiring management appointments at other clubs. Koeman was the fans choice, but not cheapest option. Please explain how his appointment fits with board with no ambition? Further more added his experienced brother, well thought of Sammy Lee and England goalkeeping coach? Hmmm fire sale? There was a blog linked on here, by a fan from another club, criticising saints for not allowing players to leave unless we get silly money, even mourinhio agrees! Players are being sold for huge fees, more than they are worth. The profits on Lambert and Lovren are bizarre. Club bending over too easily? That's not the general view, quite the opposite. I knew Shaw was on borrowed time, quite clear when he was already the best in the premier league but hoped that we may get one more season. But £30m ffs??!! People argue that there is no proof that Tadic and Pelle will adapt and be successes. I agree. I don't know how they will compare with Lallana and Lambert. However, I am very confident that Koeman would have preferred them. I also think there is decent chance they will be improvements - particularly Pelle. But it is exciting to watch and find out. There are risks with signings, as there is with a new manager. Which is why I cannot guage where we are. Its gutting to see a team disappear, losing its identity, but can I suggest you look at all departures one by one, judge how player acted, the fee, the likely replacements, etc - even if you are dead against the board, can you see an explanation that would make them correct decisions? For balance, of course I can see an explanation that fits evil board so will reserve judgement until I see the football. If Chambers stays, do you think it would good for his career waiting for Clyne to drop form or be injured? Imagine that doesn't happen this season? And we had turned down enough to be bringing Ings off the bench just to keep a second choice RB? Bit harsh on Chambers as I think he will get better and maybe suits other positions but you get my point. Am I confident that we will sign more players? -yes. That they will all work out? No. That we will be top half? No, but think we have decent chance. Am I confident we are not in a fire sale or not given up on top half - yes Read the times article on another thread.

Sorry for errors in list. So even if Koeman and his team are no better than Adkins, and don't feel players such as Clyne improved, the comparison with side that comfortably stayed up is - Targett v 17 year old Shaw JWP, Reed, Wanyama v Morgan Isgrove, Gallagher, McQueen v Puncheon However, Koeman states several signings to come. I'm not at all worried about relegation.

Trying to look at which is most likely as objectively as possible. Relegation? All bookies I have just looked at have us safely finishing 9th. In the 12/13 season Nigel Adkins achieved 14th, and nicely safe before the end of the season with; Boruc /Davies Clyne Yoshida Jos Fonte Morgan Lallana - at time when many slated him Lambert Fonte Davis Ramirez Puncheon JayRod - not same level as last season Puncheon Shaw (inexperienced 17 year old one. Even if we lose Morgan, Chambers, Lovren and JayRod it won't be hard to recruit to better that squad. JWP, reed, Gallagher, isgrove add something. We won't get relegated. Asset stripping / fire sale? Looking at search signing independently they can easily be justified and prices good. What gets to people is the volume. Most people are amazed at the prices we are getting - we clearly aren't cheaply cashing in. How much profit on Lovren? Lallana double price of Tadic? Shaw one of most expensive defenders in history? Would we want, or be able to attract Koeman if in a fire sale? His brother? Watson from another club? Sammy Lee? Much cheaper ways of doing it. We have had a confirmed bit for England squad player. I think it is likely Koeman saw Pelle and Tadic as upgrades on Lallana and Lambert so jumped at chance. Lovren the club wanted but his comments made it hard, nothing to do with ambition - money and CL. Chambers? He is too good to be 2nd choice in a team of our level. Thought at end of season some sense in selling him. Great to have, but how likely would he sit behind another RB for a club like us? I think we have had disappointing departures I wish club would make some signings but facts still more consistent with aim of 7th than a relegation battle / fire sale / asset strip.

This info isn't positive. Whatever plans the communication sounds worrying. If you look at any thread from end of season about who people want signed, the almost unanimous view was sign first choice CB to partner Lovren, and him being third choice. If, big if I know, and hasnt happened, but if at end of season Lovren hadn't got stroppy and someone like Vlaar signed no one would worry about a contract offer for Fonte. Point is we don't know if we will sign a decent CB, or two or.. Cork has never been nailed on first name on sheet since VW arrived. You are just wrong. You may feel he should have been (I don't , I agree with MP's choice of MS and VW)

I doubt we will sign those CBs but point is we don't know and therefore don't know plans for Fonte. I have rated him since we signed him, seems decent character, happy to start with him. Last season Cork was not a starting player, first name on sheet etc. If Wanyama hadn't been injured he would have hardly played. Until then, even if their were changes in central midfield JwP and Davis were used more. He is another good player and character but currently (depending on departures, formation changes, injuries ) not automatic first 11 player. 6th choice is an extreme but if RK signs his last year captain and Dutch international I think it is fairly safe he will be ahead of Cork in RK's plans. Reed and JWP are very well thought of and I am sure if not getting game time would be wanted by decent clubs. Think Cork will impress RK but equally he may seem him as a squad player.

I thought the advice on here was that Crook knows nothing? Firstly it is a bit concerning hearing this but a bit of perspective... 1) most posters have been saying they want two new CBs and don't want to see Fonte in our team unless there are injuries. He is currently on a contract and towards the end of his career. Not knowing the clubs plans and progress it is hard to judge how important he will be. Taking it to an extreme, if we sign Vlaar, the Celtic CB and one of the two feyanoord CBs we have been linked with - do we need Fonte, Yoshida and Jos? 2) why embarrassed if we don't want to offer the same as Cardiff? We know we could afford to pay him more than he is worth. If we choose to offer less, it could be because of the above, or because Cardiff are offering silly money. Much of this applies to Cork. He is currently not good enough to be a first choice in midfield. We also have Reed and JWP getting better, (Do wonder if RK may feel Reed has already over taken Cork). We have been linked with Classie who would also be ahead of cork. So at best 3rd choice, possibly 6th choice - maybe why not rushing in to tying club to long contract?

Worth remembering, NA achieved 14th with squad of Boruc/Davies Clyne / Richardson Fonte/ Jos/ Yoshida Fox / Shaw (just turned 17) Cork/Morgan/ Davis / Ramirez / Lallana (3 goals in 26) puncheon Guly / Lambert / JayRod Was the Shaw of two years ago much better than Targett? How does Tadic compare with Lallana of two years ago? Add JWP, Reed, Gallagher, Mayuka Will new management team be an improvement? There will be more signings but I don't think we are starting from relegation certainties

If we only sign 4 more players its a disaster??!! I think you are mixing up what you want / fantasy football with what makes a disaster. We were 8th last season, we could have dropped six more points and still been 8th. We were 11 points clear of 11 t h, 23 points clear of relegation. We can drop quite a few points on last season before we hit disaster levels. We had some pretty bad injuries last season - Boruc, Lovren, Wanyama, JayRod, Ramirez. What has changed ? Manager - who knows how a new manager will do but looks good appointment. Lost Lallana,Shaw,Lambert and Lovren (using your theory). All good players. We have added two signings, plus young players coming through / improving - Reed, JWP, Targett, Gallagher, Clyne, chambers, McQueen, mayuka etc. Pelle looks the type of player we needed often when playing it around without scoring. Our defence was good enough to stay up before Lovren, and with Wanyama infront it should be again. But we will sign more but if only 4, and they are decent, it is far from a disaster! I like the sound of the two signings from Celtic , we soon won't be too far from last season if Koeman does well.

Guly played 73 minutes last season, if you add his involvement to Osvaldo's and JayRod's you pretty much make one player. Sounds like there is some real quality moving up. JayRod has already said he expects to miss less than 15 games. So, assuming Targett is new LB, other departures already replaced - do we really need 5 just to stay where we are? Is it really impossible for Koeman to get the same out of players? We were pretty unlucky with serious injuries to key players and weak squad finished 8th?! I would say even if Lovren and Schneiderlin go we would only be a signing or two off last season - if Koeman works out. If the rest stay, Boruc Clyne Lovren Fonte Targett Wanyama Schneiderlin JayRod Ramirez Tadic Pelle Davies Chambers Yoshida jos Clyne Cork reed Davis JWP Mayuka Gallagher Not a strong side, if all at together, but good enough to stay up / provide good cover. I think signings are more getting good players in rather than panic replacements I was very impressed with Reed last season and clips this season -if he is going to be top player do we have room for- Schneiderlin Wanyama JWP Reed Davis Ramirez Cork Tadic?

Far better squad? You don't have any in Koeman? Who knows how he will do, but he may bring out more from some players and develop some of the younger lads. You obviously feel these are all far weaker? Koeman Pelle Tadic Targett And any deficiency is far from made up by Koeman development of JWP, Reid, Gallagher, McQueen, Ramirez ? The squad maybe weaker, but shows negativity to assume that Koeman, signings plus next young stars are much weaker. Targett sounds decent but is unlikely to match Shaw, hopefully Tadic will be similar quality to Lallana but I'm optimistic Pelle can add more, v early days tho

Depends what you mean by gaps? And whether Lovren and Schneiderlin are leaving. As it stands, I would like new signings but could easily be argued are squad is top ten so 'needing' players maybe strong without a target for perspective. The biggest unknown is how the new management team will do, they certainly seem an upgrade on MP when he came in - if they do well we will be fine, if - as change of manager often risky - they don't work out we will struggle. Sounds obvious but gar more impact on our season than signings. I suspect the club feel Pelle /Tadic are more than a match for Lallana / Lambert - with Targett not millions of miles behind Shaw. With Reid, JWP, Gallagher coming on there is more depth. I would like a CB, keeper and CF but with injuries in those areas last season we came 8th.

These posters you hold up as "ITK' what do they know? Nothing personal but most 'itk' posts are either vague, rehash of common knowledge, or wrong. There maybe evidence of them breaking specific news as can't say seen all their posts. OS saying Clyne out with strain? Mid season, before all rumours, I felt good chance one RB may go - hard to keep two very good (top 4 level?) RBs happy at a club our size, particularly when both young. I still wonder if their is a plan to use one of them differently - Clyne further forward or LB, Chambers one of 3 at back?

Better worry Statler and waldorf, as my predictions have uncanny accuracy!

Genuine chuckle moment! You will be challenging Bearsy soon! Look, we all appreciate you are not the sharpest tool in the box, however, do you really not see the comedy in your post? You repeat you immature racist childish criticism, you go on and on about it. You have never seen him play, ignore views and evidence showing how unfair and irrational your views appear. Your reply? Can you back up your view? no. Can you comment on the stats or counter views of others? No But you 'yawn' complaining how boring it is when I point out you are wrong with your boring factless prejudice views. Get a responsible adult to read the thread through to you. You will be very proud.

The opinion of a racist who has never seen Ramirez play. Don't expect him to be able to justify it against stats, facts, views of professional players, his international manager, or fans who have seen him & appreciate talent. Remember he also wrote off Lallana, Schneiderlin, and JayRod

Both initials same?

Wanyama / Schneiderlin JayRod / Ramirez / Tadic Pelle Pretty good front 6, with sub's/ cover Cork, JWP, Davis, Reid, Gallagher, Isgrove, Rowe, Plus whatever happens with Ings, Osvaldo, Classie etc Pretty confident of our options there. If Lovren and Schneiderlin stay we are not far off a good squad. Personal priorities - CF, CB then keeper ( think Forster may come to join Watson). Ignored LB as have no idea standard of Target. Thought of Ramirez, Tadic building a partnership is exciting.

And he isn't good English lad so doesnt appeal to Alpine's racist views. Poor bulldog Cork, not fair he is on bench as just because Wanyama and Schneiderlin playing well, must keep him happy. Gash Carlos Kickabout lazy and happy to be paid fortune to sit on bench just because Lallana playing so well. Its some reassurance knowing those who don't see his ability haven't ever seen him play! Remember, Lambert said he has never played with a player who has such good vision. Neville - best player played against in12/13 Good ratings in world cup. But on here he is rubbish!

Clearly not fancied by MP, and suffered injuries but he has looked decent in his limited appearances recently. As a flair player the stars often look bad, however, a few quick examples- Liverpool home, 85% pass, 3 successful tackles (both better than AL). West Ham away, only on 30 mins, 2 tackles - 2nd highest, 4 shots 2nd highest, best pass accuracy 96%, 3 dribbles - 2nd highest, lost possession 0 - (AL 5.) Cardiff played 60, 3 shots (2nd), 1 key pass, 86% pass, lost possession 0 (AL 4), highest successful tackles. Everton away, 25 mins, one of 2 players with shot on target, despite playing ¼ of game 2nd in key passes and dribbles, ONLY player not to lose possession. Wba, 30 mins, most shots on target, highest pass accuracy 94%, 1 dribble, lost possession 1. Norwich home, 60 mins, sort of game we struggle to break down, most key passes - 3 more than AL, most successful through balls, 5 players lost possession more, best pass accuracy 95%, (AL 79%). Chelsea, most key passes, lost possession 2 (AL 7). Know stats aren't everything, but don't normally do his style of player justice. Certainly doesn't support criticism given

Definitely poor injury record. Which game did he give possession away so much and gave away numerous free kicks?

Looked good just about whenever called upon last season, particularly just before injury. People moan about both our lack of squad depth, and his fee - first choice for his role last season in positions and style, was Lallana. So a £13m player was kept out of team by £26m player - isn't this the squad depth we want? Just as Cork kept out by Wanyama?

Upper mid table a bit of throw away comment - mi mean not in relegation group, nor amongst worse of rest but comfortable. Biggest unknown, as is for any club, is change of manager. However good he looks, and we hope/feel we do - a new manager is unlikely to achieve exactly the same with exactly the same group of players, I don't know whether last years squad would have moved on with Koeman or dropped, so with changes in playing staff there are a lot of unknowns. My initial post didn't say without replacements - said with Tadic for Lallana and Pelle or similar for Lambert (wouldn't be surprised if we get Ings and Pelle for Lambert). Clearly the panic of fire sale, not being ambitious, KL wanting out etc was wrong - yet again - as can be seen by attracting Koeman x 2, Watson, Lee as management team and Tadic (as I read on here how bad the board are losing him to Everton so must have done something right to get him ). Changes, many we wouldn't have chosen, but reasons to be excited and look forward rather than panic, IMHO (which is normally about right )

Where you are going wrong is getting carried away with the value of players - confusing the commercial value v footballing value. You seem to panic over loss of £100m players. Their footballing value, now, is no where near that. Shaw was not a £30m player last season. He was that price due to his potential & being English. Of course he is very good. Lallana £25m? Hopefully Tadic will soon overtake his product for ⅓ of the price. You have said (I believe, apologies if wasn't you) Cork should play defensive midfield for England, when Wanyama plays the CBs take the day off! Academic anyway as I am sure more players to come. But have watched most of those players many times you can be assured, if Koeman is half decent, its not a relegation team. My main point was people posting these long want lists and describing them as need lists without quantifying need to achieve what. We will need to replace Lambert with a good forward to match last season, and think we will. (Actually think we may add 2 ). Lallana has been replaced. I'm happy to go with clubs view on Targett or Clyne or new signing at left back. There is no need to bed wet, we have a lot of good players, a few areas clearly weaker than others - but a have feeling club would have noticed! I want more depth in goalkeepers, - but last year, with injuries our current keepers were what was needed to finish 8th - so hard to argue we "need" a new keeper to stay up, facts show otherwise. Will be different views but don't confuse greedy panic / bedwetting want with need!