NickG

Imho that is unfair, but even if it was all he did it would have still made him a mom contender today! Couple of times think he stood off (like most teams do) rather than pressing but he was tracking back - even got back to successfully defend once! He is desperate to have the ball, helping Clyne out when he is under pressure. Twice won free kicks with direct running. Always looking for space. Several good touches around penalty box. I'm not saying he was world class or even up to Lallana's recent form but he played well. And he only played 30 mins what do you expect? Cork gave the ball away more often running sideways in our half. Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk

Not as slick as earlier games but decent 3 points. Predictable type of game - first 20 odd minutes well on top relaxed football with WBA keen to frustrate / time waste. Lack of goal made us a bit rushed at times. I don't think anyone played badly but few less sharp than their best, JayRod was quiet of periods but had a few good runs into the penalty area and at least shot! Lambert played deeper but I felt he was needed more as CF without Osvaldo. Back five looked pretty comfortable , Shaw had excellent first half. Cork covered a lot of ground but feel its his awareness and decision making that puts him well behind Morgan - few times you could see Cork running out of ideas and into trouble , needless giving the ball away. Sounds harsher than I mean just how good Morgan is - often easy to miss but rarely caught wrong side of a player or in possession. Ramirez made such a difference. Won the game. As soon as he came on it raised crowd and team. Several nice touches. Was talking to a colleague about his ability to 'win' freekicks running towards goal - sure enough within minutes he did just that. Even took a very good corner after his pathetic attempts last season. His assist for the goal, was world class. He moves into space constantly and always wants the ball. He does work defensively but no where near level of pressing others do. I can see he may not be everyone's favourite, that may disappoint expectations, may not press enough but anyone who has seen him knows he isn't rubbish. His attitude has been criticised by a couple ( personally think it is purely a racist prejudice) but since in has justified inclusion. His biggest problem was the good form of others. Can't see us dropping looking at Man U and Newcastle! . Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk

Agree with this. I try to remember its still early days with Lovren but can't help thinking he could be our best ever CB. He seems to be able to mix the traditional solid CB role with swift defending (Des Walker bizarrely came to mind as an example?) But with better ball skills than any I can remember. If he carries on, or even improves and we keep him, suspect will be remembered as our best. Fonte, on his form this season could well be good enough for some sides in top ten - but I've been surprised how well he's doing - can he keep it up? Also thought Yoshida would have been higher up within club and have been disappointed in him. Appreciating that not all young players reach their potential and some won't stay but with three years improvement the potential of a side with Clyne, Chambers, Shaw, Lovren, Wanyama, Schneiderlin, Ward-Prowse, Lallana, Rodriguez. So I wouldn't be surprised to see the club sign, within the next couple of windows, someone they see as having potential to be a top 4 standard CB but still not at his peak. Maybe, as CBs mature later someone like Astori but maybe younger. May have similar aim for CF. Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk

It appears that those wanting more additions to the team are same ones who criticise likes of Osvaldo or Ramirez as wasters if they are not picked. Also talk of Lambert or Cork going if they aren't in first team. How many good players will come to us to be in/out of team - if we are not in Europe? Will JWP, Shaw, Chambers, Schneiderlin etc stay if not playing so much? If we pick up a few points in January, and teams above us fail to drop points, our final position could be pretty much decided by end of month - whether we sign no-one or top player. I don't think we 'need' a January signing. Sometimes clubs sell good players before they go for nothing in the summer. If we can sign one or two who look good longer term signings I'm sure we would. But we are in good position where we don't need to panic as say West Ham or even Man U. What was described as a clueless amateur summer window brought us excellent start and at least one player who could be one of our best ever. Relax! Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk

Last 10 league games we have let in 19 goals. In the equivalent games last year we let in 23 goals. Our good start to the season was based on the performances of Boruc, Lovren, Wanyama, Fonte, Schneiderlin. In last 10 they have missed Boruc 7 ½ Wanyama 7 ½ Fonte 3 Lovren 2 Scneiderlin 3 Shaw 1 Clyne was also out and although upset balance Chambers has done well. Es

Yes. Shows the level of expectations that people are disappointed. Shows how close we are. We were not thrashed in any, closest was Chelsea at home. Even with injuries etc we were close to beating Spurs and Villa, and drawing at Everton. That's how close the margins are as well would have put us top 6 now - why we are targeting that level. But we didn't! So top 6 would not be unreasonable target. However, we are always going to drop points in easier games or games when on top. Which is why I think its a target if things go very well (or other teams do badly!). I said when season started young squads often have dips in form but thought would finish 9th.

It really doesn't make any good points to anyone with half a brain. His basic two points are...if we lose all our games we will be in relegation battle. Same applies to Man U! His other point is we need to examine reason for one win in last nine. OK will help him with this; 1) Chelsea H Top 3 side and.. lost to this... Cech 28 Azpilicueta 03 Cole 12 Mikel 24 Cahill 26 Terry 10 Mata (Oscar - 53' Booked ) 07 Ramires 09 Torres 17 Hazard (Essien - 85' ) 14 Schürrle (Willian - 53' ) Substitutes 05 Essien 11 Oscar 19 Ba 22 Willian 23 Schwarzer 29 Eto'o 33 Kalas 2) away to Everton top 4 side. Away. Narrowly lost 2-1. More shots. More possession. Martinez said " Day defeat by Sunderland in the process. Everton boss Roberto Martinez: "It was a completely different test to the one we had on Boxing Day. Southampton are a very god side and we knew that and we had to be perfect in our performance and the two goals were of outstanding quality. "To see the way we got the winning goal was very satisfying and the nature of the victory was also pleasing considering the players we had out. "We defended well and had real concentration which we needed against Southampton" 3) beat Cardiff 3-0 away. 4) lost to spurs. Lost narrowly 2-3 to the team in 7th. Unlucky own goal. 57% possession. 17 shots. 5) Newcastle . away against 6th. Creditable draw. We had 60% possession 6) man city. Drew with 2nd placed side. 55% possession. 55% possession against top players. Pellegrini said " "It is a good point. I don't feel like we lost two points. "In all the other games away I felt like we deserved more but here this was the result that both teams deserved." 7) lost 2-3 Villa. Only really disappointing game. Freak game. 78% possession. 30 shots! BBC said It was only the third time Saints had conceded at home all season, and the hosts' confidence did not appear dented as they continued to monopolise possession and create goalscoring opportunities, flurry of chances, domination.. Chelsea lost away to team in 2nd. Reports we deservedly in lead and on top at half time. Chelsea on top 2nd. Only after unfortunate injury to Boruc did we lose. 9) lost away to top side in league - Arsenal. Had more possession. Gifted them the lead. Martin Kweon said Arsenal lucky to win. Wenger recently said we were one of best sides they have faced this season. Only freak Villa game would be described as real disappointment even for team in top 9. We got 5 points - what would fans have predicted at start of season from those? Even if thought we would do well. 7 would be a decent return. If we play like that for next 9 we will get more than 5. We lost Boruc, Clyne, Lovren, Fonte, Shaw, Scneiderlin and Wanyama during that tough period - all back 7. So not sure what valid points you mean? Need to get points to stay up? Easier games are easier time to get points? Not worried at all - if playing badly maybe Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk

This. Only about 5 posters. Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk

Most is just guess work or speculation. The only thing we know for a fact is whether he is first teamer or not. We have played 20 prem games... Lambert played in...20 prem games! Only Lovren, Fonte, Lallana and JayRod played more minutes (not many more ). He started and scored in yesterday's cup game. Only games he hasn't been starting in are Chelsea and Man C when MP used him as sub (guess due to fear of being out paced in midfield at start of the game). So you are wrong he is first teamer. Doubt accuracy of rest but as i don't know facts can't say. Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk

Of course by "now playing his joker where he said a likely finish above 13th" you mean in third paragraph of OP in March last year! Lol. So well before staying up was guaranteed (one of your moans in thread). You may disagree but its your arrogance that sends you off on a rant claiming different view is deluded. Club talk about targets of 4th / 6th / 8th etc. Obviously we've added Lovren who has played most of season, Wanyama who has played ⅔ of season and Osvaldo. But without their contribution I reckon a finish above 13th would have been likely, reckon we would have been aiming 6-9th and hoping good form / no injuries. You say you think all will agree with you??!! Have a read of the thread...most common view is you are a wum...think your inability to discuss intelligently will only increase that view. Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk

Agree. Its CB and Turkish arguing the case that given the choice between winning the FA Cup but finishing 10th or losing today but finishing 8th we should choose the cup.....errr yes!? Which would be a fair point - but I'm not sure who they are mocking as I can't imagine anyone disagreeing. Also, we don't have that choice. In a cup game anything can happen. Which is why it is obvious a club plans its future (finances, progression etc) on the league. Winning the premiership is better for a club than winning the cup. I'd prefer to go to a losing fa cup semi final if it meant sacrificing our good league start and dropping into bottom half. What they seem to miss is that the club are not given these as choices but make judgement calls. When we played Sunderland we were one point off 2nd. We played two players we don't use in first team. The club said they had a lot of games coming up and needed to vary - judgement call. Team wasn't millions miles away from team that beat a better Cardiff side 3-0. Maybe shouldn't have given Reed and Lee a game but gave Reed experience and Lee a chance (not taken). Maybe Lambert didn't need a rest... But that team should have had a decent chance - we played 6 full international players, three who played u21 / GB etc - only Kelvin (who definitely should play in cup games) and Reed hadn't. If the club wanted to use Lambert etc to get us a trophy...we only would have had to beat Chelsea, Man Utd and most likely Man City - it was on a plate for us!! If Cortese's progress keeps going we will be starting every cup with bookies putting us in quarter finals. I'm sure Cortese would love to win the cup final this year. If we did it would also greatly assist the club progressing - but even losing in the final wouldn't help much. (But a day we want and would remember). Hopefully we will get a good cup run, it can also help league form. But if we do badly in the cups but get established in top 8 hopefully will get lots more opportunities. The cup isn't that open. Best way to get to Wembley.. Get into top 4! Other than Wigan and Portsmouth I don't think a team outside the top 4 has won in last 25 odd years (and only a handful of losing finalists - from memory us, Cardiff, skates, Millwall..?) So its not a choice of A) move up league two places, or, B) win cup final Its a case that sensible planning to progress club, attract better players etc has to be based on league. Cup used to be more magical when it was a rare live TV game at the end of the season. Great memories watching all day, its a knock out, player profiles, coach journeys etc. Sky games, internet etc all progress but has taken away the novelty.

You may disagree young man but a different opinion to yours doesn't make it utter bol+ocks. I'm fairly confident you would have said anyone predicting the three years that we have just had was talking utter bol+ocks. But you fail to provide any rationale as to why you think its wrong or find anything I've made up. There's no need to keep trying to find argument. Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk

Lol, very true! Think we are at the stage when Turkish needs to find a responsible adult he trusts to read the posts and help him understand, poor lad. Hopefully they will explain that a target is an aim, something you aspire to, hope to achieve, build / plan for and if all is successful you hit! Surely not that hard? It was separated in OP! Target 6-9th - still looks fair doesn't it? What I predicted, most likely, realistic, believable end of season outcome was above 13th. Again, still looks fair? So, trying really hard to keep this Turkish level, I was pretty sure an OK season would see us above 13th (still with me?) But thought in a good season, if all went well, we should be hoping higher (6th being highest I felt we could aim for, 9th still being a very good season). This has been shown to be fair. Yes we have added players. But surely, even you, when not on wind up, knows that three players, of their value, don't guarantee jumping 10 places - maybe two or three? So, with new squad, maybe a target of 4th-7th would be an aim (club spoken of top 4, 6 and 8th so again reasonable). And yes the additions have changed my prediction of where we will finish. Before them I was confident of top 12. Now certainly top 10, pretty confident top 9. Again prediction gone up by two or three places. Not sure can make it simpler. I'm not changing my view, being antagonistic or winding up. You bumped my post of a personal view - to mock as you feel it's proven wrong. I disagree. I still hold the same view and feel season so far supports it. Maybe read through my recent replies again before you reply? On a better note, Bearsy is becoming my favourite poster - in contrast attempts to brighten all threads up rather than snipe. Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk

So you bumped this because you got excited after a defeat thinking it made my view seem to optimistic. But now, because I (and others) still think it was reasonable, in your strange desire to find arguments you now having another attempt that its too pessimistic. Lol, you are struggling, still Barry will probably change stance to help you! My view on summer signings; Lovren looks great, really good value and significantly increased our chances of finishing 6-9th. Wanyama very promising, as we had Cork not as big an impact as Lovren but looks one who will get better. Money well spent. Osvaldo, clearly very able. Still needs to deliver a lot more to justify his fee (as older than Wanyama / Ramirez potentially less resale). So, in summary not disappointed in this season. I'm happy with OP (sorry to spoil your pleasure in our defeat and bumping this). I still think it was reasonable to think the squad at end of last season would have started the season with a positive view - aiming towards 6-9th. I still think that squad would have finished this season higher than 13th. I believe form of Boruc, Lallana, JayRod, Fonte, Clyne, Shaw, Schneiderlin etc supports my view. I think signings have improved us but are not enough to take us to very top level....yet I know you are more pessimistic and view likes of Everton as light years ahead. I don't have a problem with your opinion just disagree. I don't understand your desire to knock others pleasure / excitement / optimism. I would have thought that people would start to see that the 'happy clappers' have been right more than you moaners over last few years

Not at all, why would I be very, very disappointed with a great start to the season? Admittedly Lovren has played a big part, and also Wanyama, but predominately last season's squad was recently very high, and at half way point 9th, with a gap from 10th. As I said we will probably finish above 13th we are doing better. If not for bad luck with simultaneous injuries I think could be much higher and may end up higher. It has also been positive to see that we are not light years behind teams like Everton and Spurs as you said - behind yes, but we have shown to all they are catchable. So not disappointed at all - its looking pretty positive. As for end of season target - its looking sensible as a target.

13/14 goals (assists) Schneiderlin 1(0) Davis 1 (2) JWP 0 (2) Cork 0 (0) Ramirez 1 (0) 12/13 goals (assists) Ramirez 5 (3) Schneiderlin 5 (0) Davis 2 (1) Cork 0 (0) 11/12 goals (assists) Schneiderlin 2 (3) Cork 0 (2) This season Schneiderlin, JWP and Davis have been ahead of Cork for MP. When we went behind he is also the player least likely to score or create a goal. Appreciate the argument about possession but substitution makes perfect sense when trying to get a goal. Ramirez completed most key passes during the game, plus scored in cup games.

Target = objective to strive for (6-9th). Likely = probabable, credible, believable (above 13th). Currently 9th. 6 points above 13th. When had Wanyama etc we were much higher (playing Arsenal to go top). When your support is from Barry you must realise you are a laughing stock surely? BTW, agreed with your post in match reaction thread but this is my last post of day. Happy new year. Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk

Maybe likely finish of 13th was pessimistic, think we will better that. Also think my view that Cortesse would be setting targets of 6-9th was low - its seems from talk in interviews that club target was somewhere 4th- 8th. What I wasn't wrong about was my view that Turkish / Dune/ Barry / Stu whoever is a very strange person who looks to boost himself by moaning and making arguments for pleasure (often, as with CB, playing some bizarre devils advocate against a forum view that wasn't ever posted). I'm sure some expert would have great fun analysing him and what caused his bitterness, lack of respect of others and wanting to dampen what is meant to be a pleasure / hobby. Notice more and more are getting fed up with their immature approach. My first though today....disappointment, wanting to dry out, hope we don't get dragged into a rut... His...that he can look big and clever against me....why the obsession??? I looked a while ago, when particularly bored with his stalking, (just posting three a day max ) he had quoted all of my last 10!! Strange boy. Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk

For those who didn't go, I suggest you read some reporters' views as some here, imho, are OTT. http://www.goal.com/en-gb/match/109439/southampton-vs-chelsea-fc/player-ratings http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/match-reports/southampton-0-3-chelsea-match-report-2875575 http://www.chelseafc.com/news-article/article/3599741/title/match-report-southampton-0-chelsea-3 http://www.independent.co.uk/sport/football/premier-league/southampton-0-chelsea-3-match-report-fernando-torres-and-substitutes-oscar-and-willian-inspire-blues-to-victory-9032880.html http://m.bleacherreport.com/articles/1907618-southampton-vs-chelsea-score-grades-and-post-match-reaction http://www.standard.co.uk/sport/football/southampton-0-chelsea-3-torres-on-target-as-ruthless-blues-record-impressive-win-9032827.html A team as young as ours is always going to have games when players go missing. I'm a fan of Jay Rod but, for example, thought he had quietest game for a while, not half the player he has been recently. Our outfield included Shaw 18, Chambers 18, Lovren 24, Clyne 22, Morgan 24, JayRod 24, JWP 19, Cork 24, Lallana 25 - all young (or very young players). We struggled with a few of their top players, as better sides than ours will. Thought Torres looked very sharp from the start and first time Lovren looked stretched. Ramirez was decent considering time since last started, opposition and how game was going (certainly better than Cork looked at start of his first game back). Reading comments above saying how poor we were, slating Ramirez and Schneiderlin it's amazing we matched one of best teams in Europe for so long and had more possession, shots, 8 corners etc.. Maybe we were not totally ****? Chelsea looked comfortably better, faster in midfield, quality players. We looked jaded at times. One of those reports said that Chelsea brought £130m of player back into side after resting in last game! I got soaked. Disappointing game, point possible when ball was bouncing in the goal mouth but best side won. Radio five report said final score flattered Chelsea and we played decent football. They were discussing whether we had been found out - the conclusion was no, just played tough games, playing well but missing out over busy time. As others said, today isn't the game to judge our season, its the next period. Those slating the substitution of Cork - isn't it quite obvious when you need a goal to consider taking off your midfielder who doesn't score or create goals? Of course leaves gaps but no a stupid call surely? Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk

Would anyone 'not' prefer, sorry? Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk

Would anyone prefer 9th plus cup over 6th? Sorry if missed it but suspect not. Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk

Don't think it is difficult concept? 100% fit = no injuries at all, no tight muscles, joint problems etc, no colds, been fully training, all measurements show at peak. Few players would be there. Other extreme is too injured to be considered - ill, torn ligaments etc Players will be somewhere between hopefully nearer 100% fit. Some used to prefer Jos to Fonte so it is not difficult to understand that the clubs judgement could have been that 100% fit Jos could play better than a 40% fonte but that 40% fonte is better than a youngster? Club have said he is carrying injury and not fully fit, no secret. How hard is he training during week? Is he able to fully work on all set pieces etc? We have still been playing well, Hull, Arsenal, Newcastle, half of Chelsea, villa, even spurs was no where near as bad as it felt at time, more disappointing due to how good we are. The solid defensive unit of Boruc, Clyne, Fonte, Lovren, Shaw, Wanyama and Schneiderlin has only had Lovren survive. Reckon even top sides wouldn't expect much from that run of games with 6 out of 7 defensive players out. Of course we need to turn it around and get points but obvious to anyone that its not case of imploding / running out of ideas etc - combination of, over short period so slants things; harder games, bad luck, injuries, silly mistakes, freak result. Bizarre that those who said would drop to bottom half moan when well placed 9th

Considering supporting saints is a passion / pleasure / hobby reckon being "other end of the spectrum to a negative repetitive pain in the arse " probably is a good thing We need a range of opinions on here as long as people hold them genuinely, have reasonable debate with respect where possible for other posters. I left ground ****ed off yesterday but don't get why some seem to always look for negatives. You want players / manager / chairman to never be satisfied but wonder what some supporters expect? Talk of players we "need", overly critical when just few weeks ago we played Arsenal away with chance to go top. We lost silly gifted goal, Martin Keown saying Wenger would feel bit lucky as we did well , Wenger says we are good side, half time reports against Chelsea said better side, villa was just bizarre, both pellegrini & kompsny said happy with point as we were better (with 4 18 year olds) Spurs we were OK but defence under performing. This with injuries to Boruc, Clyne, Shaw, Fonts, Schneiderlin, Wanyama - only Loren fit through out. Enjoying season....sorry! , Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk

Golac for me. Probably not as skilful / quick as Clyne, and maybe bit of rose tinted hero worship but my memory of Golac is that no one would get passed him, and when he ran forward a tank needed to stop him. Hard to compare as the game changes and without the opportunity to see players, from different generations in similar sides etc. Our side is so young you cannot compare players still improving, learning with players we have had when they are 27-30. I think Lovren could be best CB we have had. When he chases wingers down (situations most fullbacks would be happy to block a cross, or at most put it out, he manages to turn away with the ball. Of our previous CBs a few match or maybe beat him in air or as blockers. But who match him for speed, fast tackles, reading the game, passing and dribbling? Unfair to put him ahead of others after ½ a season but ability I can't imagine any old ones matching last 4 months. Shaw, Clyne, JWP could get there but not for a while. Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk

If anyone ever doubted you enjoy moaning cynically and trolling.... Happy christmas Sent from my Nexus 4 using Tapatalk