scotty

Have you considered joining my own "havent got a clue-ist" group? I reckon that could take off, might start a facebook page or something.

I realise that Sergei, just making the point that its the few fringe-element extremists who cause most of the problems that this thread was started with.

Didn't someone post a link of one of his twitter comments? Before the skates game? I'm pretty sure he made it very clear he was a Saints fan even though his father was a skate, cant remember what thread it was on now.

Thats a point where imho some organised religions cross the line. Franks Cousin has already mentioned the stifling oppression of catholicism, and obviously the bandwagon jumping of radical islam resulting in terrorist attacks supposedly justified by the koran, or someone's interpretation of it. You could also argue that the crusades were not dissimilar, looting and colonisation carried out under the flag of a religion that was diametrically opposed to such things. The one that I detest more than any other is the jehovahs witness cult. A good friend of mine, probably the most placid, unflappable guy I ever met, was deeply upset by a "friend" of his explaining to him the way things "are" according to that religion (and I use the term loosely.) Being the sort of bloke he his, he listened patiently without telling his friend to stfu, then said "well thats all very interesting, but its really not the way I see things and its not for me." At which point his "friend" informed him that although he had previously had an excuse because of his ignorance, he had now been told the real truth and had no option but to join the cult. If he didn't, he will be punished and condemned to the fiery pits of hell, etc etc. My mate was upset enough to phone me at 3am, he was in such a state that I ended up driving over there to calm him down. Utter c*nts.

Well Bletchy, I would describe myself as a "Haven't got a clue-ist". How about you? The thing that gets my goat whenever this subject crops up, on this forum and others, is the notion people have that we can prove or disprove the existence of anything beyond what we can directly perceive or show by experiment. Always strikes me as monumentally arrogant tbh, how can anybody know for sure what is outside our sphere of knowledge or capacity to know? I somehow think it unlikely that mankind is the beacon of all understanding about the universe.

While Wiki isn't the fount of all knowledge, this is its opening line on the subject; "Atheism is, in a broad sense, the rejection of belief in the existence of deities." That is, in itself, a belief. I would argue that atheists, by specifically rejecting the idea of deities, are no different to those who specifically believe in them. My own position is that I haven't got a f*cking clue, any more than anyone else; I am not in any way religious, I dont pray or go to any church, but I accept the possibility that there may be something beyond what we can perceive physically, and also accept that our physical existence may be all there is. I'll find out when I die, just like everyone else will.

Atheism is, specifically, the rejection of a belief in god(s). As it is impossible to actually know, 100%, that god either does or doesn't exist, and neither can be proved, it follows that you can only believe that they do or don't based on science, teachings, and personal opinion and experience. Nobody can say with absolute certainty that god(s) do not exist, but we are free to believe that. I didn't mention agnostics, btw.

The "theism" part is a bit of a giveaway....

Thats an interesting point, its worth you having a little think yourself. Atheism is a belief system in that you choose to follow a particular belief, ie that there are no Gods, or any equivalent of them. It is a specific belief in itself, therefore no different to a religious belief, and there are indeed fanatical atheists as wade garrett suggests, Richard Dawkins being a prime mainstream example.

Disgraceful behaviour from a Saints fan, I can only hope you were plssed when you knobbed it. That said, going by your recent postings on the booze thread, you probably were

Me too. "Dury's 1981 song "Spasticus Autisticus"—written to show his disdain for that year's International Year of Disabled Persons, which he saw as patronising and counter-productive" Ian Dury, RIP. He took no prisoners with his lyrics, very sadly missed.

I see Old Bill have showed up. Their like starsky and hutch, but without the charisma...

So thats two defeatists that reckoned we'd get tonked 5 nil, anyone else care to add any?

Harsh but fair.

Ok, I'm confused now. Never been on facebook, but were you referring to the thread I posted yesterday about how many pints he owed me, or an entirely different 5-0 pessimist?

Who are you, and what have you done with Alpine?

What, and waste a perfectly good pint?? ffs!

I didn't name him, did I? And I dont suppose he was alone in expecting us to get a battering.

You wouldn't actually realise it nowadays, but here is a very well kept secret that is the answer to your woes. Dont spread it around.......... FACEBOOK IS NOT COMPULSORY.

Can we add warmongering to this list?

We went into that game as a team fresh from back to back promotions, and a team containing a fair few that were competing in L1 a couple of seasons ago. Playing the prem champions, at home, who last season played 19 home games, won 18, drew one, and conceded 12 goals. We scored two, went ahead, and looked unlucky not to walk away with at least a point. A defeat's a defeat, but most people were only wondering how many we'd lose by. There are so many positives for us to take from that game, and the negatives are addressable. COYR

Dont worry about it, you've missed the square root of sweet f*ck all. And I've sunk a few myself, tbh;)

Well spotted!! And only three hours after Gaz pointed that out. Granty should make you a mod.

Oh well, a single pint it is then. I'm swimming against the tide here.

Oh come on, he said we wouldn't score at all!! That means he was wrong twice. Two pints, surely.