IamLeGod

History is an area I have a reasonable knowledge of (im not questioning yours), whilst yes whilst aspects of what you say are true (re: alliances with poland), but I do disagree when you claim the Nazi's racist/genocidal tendencies had nothing to do with it. Having studied history quite extensively in recent years from the knowledge I have acquired I am inclined to disagree with you. I am not the one that claims to have an undying pride in the history of Britain and the empire. If anything I believe we should feel quite the opposite. Our actions were in fact pretty shameful and disgusting. Neither do I claim our democracy is anywhere near perfect or that we have any right to go around claiming people should follow our model (same should be said of the US). But to get back to the original point. To claim that patriotism seen during the war whilst fighting against a racist (i sincerely hope you do not deny that the nazi's were racist) and genocidal regime can be compared to calling for the deportation of all immigrants is severly misguided. The two terms are no where near the same. It is racist groups that perpetuate the blurring of these lines as it is in their own interests to do so in order to try and claim some air of credibilty.

Well also the fact that they were rounding up millions of Jews, Gypsies, Blacks, Homosexuals, Disabled people and homosexuals and executing them? This may have had something to do with it. The whole American idea of "You'd be speaking German if it wern't for us" is a self-serving falisy. Hitler and the Nazi's had little intention of attacking Britain until we got involved due to their aggressive actions. They weren't that much of a rival to us. At this time we still had the British Empire, with which most of our trading occured, so frankly Germany taking a bit of land from france and poland was of little relevance to us.

You see it like that because that is true.

The two are quite seperate. Patriotism in WW2 was encouraged as the country was struggling financially and militarily against a racist Nazi regime. Quite different to running around stating that the country is flooded and that we should put up the walls and deport everyone not born here, and in many cases people who were in fact born here. Nick Griffin has been quoted and convicted on numerous occasions for making racist and anti-semitic comments. Tell me how saying that the holocaust didn't happen, or stating that (i am paraphrasing) "the jews have been chased out of everywhere they have gone, there's no smoke without fire" is patriotic and not racist? Tell me how the former NF (patriotic or outright racist?) leader Andrew Brons calling a police officer of ethnic minority background an "inferior being" is patriotic and racist? Also quite hypocritical seeing as his family are in fact of German descent? But thats ok because Germans are White, right?

Thanks, guess thats another one to add to the seemingly ever-expanding list of games on my wish list!

Same here. Is it not also worth noting a slight contradiction here? These damn immigrants are coming over here and 'taking all our jobs!'. Yet the majority of these jobs are low-paid long houred jobs. Making them a large part of the working classes of this country. And apparently they represent 98% of the new jobs created, I would be willing to suggest that the large majority of these were as said previously low paid working class jobs. Now do we think these people will be supporting the BNP? Also, it may just be me. But I just cannot take seriously a party that wants to run the country when some of its most prominent members have served jail time for race hate related crimes. To me that seems a perfectly legitimate reason to dislike and distrust a party. In a system of representative democracy do we really want criminals convicted of race crimes to represent us?

Was at a friends earlier, played Little Big Planet for the first time. I absolutely loved it. A fantastically fun, quirky, imaginative, intuitive game. Platform gaming at its very best. Reminded me of plating computer games as a kid. Seriously the most fun I have had playing a computer game in a very long time. Would thoroughly recommend this to anyone!

As is what you are suggesting. If half the population of china was to move to South East England, that would represent a population shift of well in excess of 500,000,000 people, almost 10 times the current population of the UK. Realistically, there would be mass over-population and a complete lack of food/jobs/accommodation etc. Health and schooling services would be over-run and therefore the appeal of moving to the UK is greatly lessened as the apparent superior quality of life is non-existent. In such a case people would look elsewhere, or even look to fill the void in there own regions. People seem to assume that the UK is the only place that has immigrants moving to their countries, which is quite false. There also seems to be an idea (played up by groups such as the BNP or even the NF) that we are over run by immigrants. Which again is simply false, hyped media rubbish stirred up by the Daily Mail to sell papers to their xenophobic ignorant readership base and the BNP to further their own goals. There is a clue in the name 'Ethnic Minorities', they are just that, a minority.

I'm inclined to agree with you. I don't see myself as particularly hippy, but ultimately we are all humans living on the same planet. Nations are creations of man. Why should someone born into a poor, less developed nation be doomed to a life of suffering in squalor and refused the opportunity to make a better life for themself if they are willing to move elsewhere and work for it? I simply cannot understand this irrational fear of immigrants. What makes anyone more entitled to live in a certain area than anyone else? If there was no work in your village/town/city you would move to where there is? So then how can the same principles be perceived as a negative when it comes to people moving across national borders?

Maybe because the two both controversially made headway in the last set of elections the country saw last year. Additionally both parties are essentially one-dimensional, lead by eccentric leaders that make themselves and politics look a joke on a regular basis, and neither stand a real chance of gaining a majority vote in a General Election. Policy wise they are different, but in terms of their respective positions on the political horizon and agenda they aren't exactly a million miles apart.

Nick Griffin said so?

In part thanks to the latest South Park: Buffalo Soldier - Bob Marley

Poor bloke, hope for a speedy recovery

Unlikely Led will be there, cant see them not headlining, and seeing as the headliners have been announced (U2, Muse and Stevie Wonder) seems unlikely.

The use of Muslim Extremists is an interesting example. Going further than simply their expressions of hate etc against the Western world; you can understand their terrorist attacks as a manipulation of the Western Liberal Democratic system to which they are so opposed. Due to the ideas of freedom of expression, association etc and the pivotal notion of innocence until proven guilt, it is possible for such extremists to get together and formulate plans relatively easily. The clever thing about these groups is their ability to recruit often unsuspicious 'westernised' muslims disillusioned with the western world. Authorities are powerless to simply round up random muslims simply for their appearance/background/ethnicity/religion in the hope they may find someone who is engaged in terroristic activities (rightly so). It is the western democracies reliance on liberties and rights that allows these groups the freedom to carry out these attacks, using these liberties and rights as a weapon against them.

Can't say I disagree with any of that. I'm not espousing the virtues of cameron in the slightest. if you look back at this thread, i have on several occasions expressed my doubts in cameron. as i said before he is suimply blair mk II. Taking 'smoke and mirrors' politics as i like to call it to a whole new level. blair (one of the most skilled politicians in years) has changed the face of the game completely, the pair are very good at playing the game. but as blair demonstrated, style over substance rarely works and tends to gain a fascination with short term pr victories. i hold little hope for anything different should cameron come into no. 10.

Sounds like he is one straight out of Brown's book. The left seem to hold their values very dearly, which whilst this is admirable, makes them very aggressive towards any view point that is not their own. Unwilling to agree on differences and simply attack them. Brown is a tribalistic, nasty piece of work, who in desparation attacks oppositions background (like someone else on here?). Oh Mr. Cameron how can you run the country? You cannot be fit because you went to the best school and university in the country, doing one of the hardest courses and got a first! Obviously you are a poor candidate to run the country. I on the other hand am a much better candidate. I cannot spell the name of an injured soldier in a handwritten letter that i write in scrawl with a marker pen and in my handling of the recession broke every single one of the 'golden rules of economics' i made up during my time as chancellor, overseeing the 'economic miracle'. Nevermind if this was, in hindsight, a false inflated period of boom, which I exacerbated for political points.

I've made a similar point on other threads. The BNP's 'success' at the european elections last year was quite distorted and disproportionate. I would be very surprised if they are manage to come close to replicating this in anyway at the General Election. Much of the BNP vote last year came for two reasons. 1) These were the first European Elections since the passing of the Lisbon Treaty. The BNP campaigned hard on the issue of EU withdrawal, away of voicing discontent at the governments passing of the Lisbon Treaty without asking the electorate. However, I find it difficult to believe that in a General Election the electorate will genuinely feel that BNP are the party to handle issues such as the economy, education, health etc. 2) In the wake of the Expenses Scandal (the latest in the long line of scandals) leaving people disillusioned with mainstream politics. This lead many voters of the mainstream political parties to either not vote, or vote for the BNP in protest. People are more likely to make protest votes in European Elections as they do not see their MEP as having much of an impact on their everyday lives. Looking at the BNP vote in comparison to previous elections, one would notice their vote did not actually rise too dramatically, it was more a case of other parties votes falling. Also it may be worth remembering that they did only win 2 seats, the hype the media made about this played into the BNP's hands, making it appear that had in fact done much better.

Don't insult my intelligence. Im capable of forming my own opinion thank you very much. Put your arrogance away. Not really sure how much better things look. a 0.01% growth is hardly brilliant. Ive already explained im not mad keen on cameron. Im not convinced he would have done any better.

Personally, Im not quite as convinced. Hailed (mostly by himself) as overseeing the 'econoic miracle' during a period of global economic prosperity. Then as soon as things went bad it was nothing to do with him? He then claimed his policies to deal with the downturn had positioned us better than anyone to move out of recession faster than any country, which as we know simply isnt true. His dealing of the economy has summarised his Premiership, confused, slow, bumbling,clumsy and ineffective

Blair MK II. Damning show of what politics is coming to. Style over substance. Worries me that he has a good chance of being PM soon, though as I said previously can we really stand another 5 years of Brown? Used to think I would side with the Tories but recently have changed my mind massively! What to do, what to do

Thought I was banging my head against a brick wall for a moment

K fusion is the best sega megadrive emulator i have found. Where did you find a ps1 emulator?

Seeing as there are similar threads in the Arts section. Thought it might be interesting to have a thread for Games. Figured I'd get the ball rolling. Finally got an Xbox 360 recently and got Left 4 Dead 2. Played the first one and loved it. This one appears to be of a pretty similar vein. Granted the graphics aren't the best around, but the gameplay is gripping and extremely intense, with the player hardly given a moments respite. Noticed that this game won the best multiplayer award at the BAFTA's recently, and the new game modes do seem to be interesting. Certainly looking forward to getting Xbox Live sorted and trying my hand at being a zombie.

What's the general consensus on this one in the series then? Bought an Xbox last week and was considering buying this. Is it worth it?