Why are there 3 "Save Our Saints"?

[Pancake]

1. The Saints Trust "Save Our Saints", as promoted on the SFC OS which included the bucket collection at SMS and concerned with collecting cash to keep the CLUB ticking over until the end of the season.

 

2. The Poll from 'derry' on this forum that people have contributed to to say they would put money in to 'own' the club; currently stands at just under a million I believe.

 

3. The 'last gasp' Save Out Saints campaign being promoted by The Saints Web which is ALSO concerned with buying and running the club, but only if no other buyer comes forward by the 11th hour.

 

Would it be too much to ask that these groups named themselves differently to save confusion?

 

I, for one, am happy to gift the club money to keep it running until an owner is found; but I do not want to put money into a fans ownership proposal, be it the one from derry or the other one with the full proposal on TSW. Im of the understanding from reading the poll thread that the 2 initiatves running on this site are using separate totals and are not connected to each other. Why is this?

[Scummer]

I thought items 2 and 3 were the same thing?

[bridge too far]

I thought items 2 and 3 were the same thing?

 

Me too. However, if they're not then it would appear that I have pledged twice :shock:

[Pancake]

I thought items 2 and 3 were the same thing?

 

Me too. However, if they're not then it would appear that I have pledged twice :shock:

 

This is what confused me to. From reading the thread, it seems that the one on here is for "us only" (as in members of the Forum), where as the other is for members of the general public.

 

Either that, or the organisers are getting themselves confused and are looking to combine both totals, in which case they will come up short as people, as BTF as said, are pledging on both.

[stevegrant]

2 and 3 are now the same thing.

 

As far as I'm aware, derry started the original "How much would you be willing to donate?" thread just as a "typing out your thoughts" type thing to see if anyone else thought the idea was a reasonable one - he then got involved with the group who have been calling themselves "Save Our Saints" for a while (think they set up a hastily-arranged meeting at the De Vere a couple of months back?) who essentially had the same ideas in terms of raising enough money from fans.

 

That poll's obviously been running for a while, but it's easy for people to read a poll on the forum and just click on an option without much thought - actually parting with cash is clearly another matter entirely. The idea behind the separate page on the main SaintsWeb site is that a) it's accessible to those who aren't registered on the forum, and b) users need to enter separate data on there which, to be honest, those who were just clicking a button on a poll just because there was a poll there (of which I suspect there are quite a lot ) wouldn't bother filling out - there are also slightly wider-ranging donation options on there. The theory being that the data on the new pledge site will be a slightly truer reflection of the amount of money potentially available, and it's there for all to see.

 

Bit of a ramble, but hopefully that explains it a bit.

[Pancake]

2 and 3 are now the same thing.

 

As far as I'm aware, derry started the original "How much would you be willing to donate?" thread just as a "typing out your thoughts" type thing to see if anyone else thought the idea was a reasonable one - he then got involved with the group who have been calling themselves "Save Our Saints" for a while (think they set up a hastily-arranged meeting at the De Vere a couple of months back?) who essentially had the same ideas in terms of raising enough money from fans.

 

That poll's obviously been running for a while, but it's easy for people to read a poll on the forum and just click on an option without much thought - actually parting with cash is clearly another matter entirely. The idea behind the separate page on the main SaintsWeb site is that a) it's accessible to those who aren't registered on the forum, and b) users need to enter separate data on there which, to be honest, those who were just clicking a button on a poll just because there was a poll there (of which I suspect there are quite a lot ) wouldn't bother filling out - there are also slightly wider-ranging donation options on there. The theory being that the data on the new pledge site will be a slightly truer reflection of the amount of money potentially available, and it's there for all to see.

 

Bit of a ramble, but hopefully that explains it a bit.

 

Cheers for the clarification Steve. Bearing that in mind, would it not be prudent to close the Poll thread (or at least the poll part of it) and direct everyone to the pledge page to create a definite true total? I note that on the thread, derry leads people to believe that they will call in the pledges in the poll and combine with the pledge page to create a grand total... but it seems this isnt the case.

[Bourno]

If we have pleged via the thread poll do we need to pledge again on the SOS page?

[stevegrant]

If we have pleged via the thread poll do we need to pledge again on the SOS page?

Yes please.

[Pancake]

Steve, as I posted before, this doesnt seem to be what derry wants though.

[Bourno]

Yes please.

 

But only pay once?

[Window Cleaner]

1.

 

2. The Poll from 'derry' on this forum that people have contributed to to say they would put money in to 'own' the club; currently stands at just under a million I believe.

 

[

 

Would it be too much to ask that these groups named themselves differently to save confusion?

 

 

?

 

 

They really shouldn't have run that poll in the school holidays

[stevegrant]

Steve, as I posted before, this doesnt seem to be what derry wants though.

Didn't see that. **** knows then. :confused:

[derry]

1. The Saints Trust "Save Our Saints", as promoted on the SFC OS which included the bucket collection at SMS and concerned with collecting cash to keep the CLUB ticking over until the end of the season.

 

2. The Poll from 'derry' on this forum that people have contributed to to say they would put money in to 'own' the club; currently stands at just under a million I believe.

 

3. The 'last gasp' Save Out Saints campaign being promoted by The Saints Web which is ALSO concerned with buying and running the club, but only if no other buyer comes forward by the 11th hour.

 

Would it be too much to ask that these groups named themselves differently to save confusion?

 

I, for one, am happy to gift the club money to keep it running until an owner is found; but I do not want to put money into a fans ownership proposal, be it the one from derry or the other one with the full proposal on TSW. Im of the understanding from reading the poll thread that the 2 initiatves running on this site are using separate totals and are not connected to each other. Why is this?

 

 

 

Let me clarify the situation. The original SOS group was started by Mike Fenner about three months ago and have a website www.saveoursaints.info which isn't up to taking pledges.

 

I started the thread on here and was amazed at the support and contacted the administrator, who asked that we carry on as a backstop in case there was no buyer.

 

He then put the SOS group in touch with me, we met and decided to join up and go public.

 

Steve Grant set up the www.saintsweb.co.uk/saveoursaints section to take the public pledges.

 

The reason for the two pledge sections being kept live and separate is so that we can measure the public interest rather than the site members pledging twice which would then give us a distorted idea of the public support.

 

The OS/club's initiative is them using the words 'save our saints' for their cash appeal to keep themselves going in the short term.

 

These are two separate things with different aims. Our group was there first but who would deny the club using the same words to raise funds, after all they are the saints.

 

I have heard this morning that the Dyer permanent transfer and fee has been agreed with Swansea and although the fee won't be paid until the window opens the guarantee underwrites the immediate future with the bank.

[Pancake]

The reason for the two pledge sections being kept live and separate is so that we can measure the public interest rather than the site members pledging twice which would then give us a distorted idea of the public support.

 

I do think that this should have been communicated before the second pledge site was set up. A lot of poeple will have read the thread liking to the new page and pledged to there as well as voted in the poll.

 

I think you might find that the total on the SOS Pledge Page will, in the end, reflect a more correct total that the vote on the forum. A lot of poeple will have voted for a certain amount in a "hypothetical, spur of the moment, hidden by the anonymity of the forum" kind of way; but may not be so up for it when they have to reveal their real name in what could possible be construed as a binding declaration of intent.

[Window Cleaner]

I do think that this should have been communicated before the second pledge site was set up. A lot of poeple will have read the thread liking to the new page and pledged to there as well as voted in the poll.

 

I think you might find that the total on the SOS Pledge Page will, in the end, reflect a more correct total that the vote on the forum. A lot of poeple will have voted for a certain amount in a "hypothetical, spur of the moment, hidden by the anonymity of the forum" kind of way; but may not be so up for it when they have to reveal their real name in what could possible be construed as a binding declaration of intent.

 

This is right, there is a vast gulf between the "plastic pledge poll" on which the decision to get involved was made and the real nitty gritty prepare to ante up

pledge site. I'm afraid that Derry has been led down the garden path by a lot of wags with no idea of donating real money.

[derry]

No because we won't have a clue what the measure of support from the public is.

[Pancake]

But surely at present you don't know that either as there is, without doubt, and overlap of pledges on the 2 places?

[derry]

If we have pleged via the thread poll do we need to pledge again on the SOS page?

 

Yes please.

 

I do think that this should have been communicated before the second pledge site was set up. A lot of poeple will have read the thread liking to the new page and pledged to there as well as voted in the poll.

 

I think you might find that the total on the SOS Pledge Page will, in the end, reflect a more correct total that the vote on the forum. A lot of poeple will have voted for a certain amount in a "hypothetical, spur of the moment, hidden by the anonymity of the forum" kind of way; but may not be so up for it when they have to reveal their real name in what could possible be construed as a binding declaration of intent.

 

We really need to keep the web side of the appeal and public side of the appeal separate and current so that we can measure the speed of publicity and the public support. Those that have pledged on here should leave it at that for the present. If that alters you'll be the first to know. It's the support on this site that has given the initiative it's current credibility.

 

I realise that, however the pledges on this site are opening a lot of relevant doors that otherwise wouldn't be opened to us. I don't want to lose that connection.

 

In the end pledges mean three tenths of FA. They are really a rough measure of the interest, We really need to know the level of support outside the site. If there isn't the required level of support the initiative is clearly going nowhere.

 

I will say however that in the event of the situation arising that the administrator says there are no buyers for the club, there will be an enormous media surge and fan reaction, that is the point, god forbid, that the structure in place will be able to publically launch the request for funds.

 

We are widening the media support, today the site was given out on BBC Radio Solent, and Kevin James is going to do repeats and try and get the tv side to put it out. Radio Hampshire are doing a piece today and tonight, we are talking to the Echo about another article and hopefully daily updates.

 

We are giving the media a focal point by putting the structure in place, which will kick in if we are all that is left to save the club from extinction.

Edited 16 April, 2009 by derry

[derry]

But surely at present you don't know that either as there is, without doubt, and overlap of pledges on the 2 places?

 

We know there is £53k from 45 pledgees in two days, I suspect not a lot from here if any. That sum indicates a total lack of awareness or interest.

 

We need to get the message out with the website address and see what support builds up as a result, the last thing we want is £900,000 repeat pledges, to totally distort the picture, as we have no idea who has pledged what.

 

That won't matter in the end as it is only the actual money contributed that counts, the pledges only indicate an interest not a guaranteed commitment.

[Pancake]

We know there is £53k from 45 pledgees in two days, I suspect not a lot from here if any.

 

Well thats where we disagree I guess. I would put money on 90% of those pledges being from people who have already voted in the poll.

[derry]

This is right, there is a vast gulf between the "plastic pledge poll" on which the decision to get involved was made and the real nitty gritty prepare to ante up

pledge site. I'm afraid that Derry has been led down the garden path by a lot of wags with no idea of donating real money.

 

Not at all as the whole emphasis is putting a structure in place that is able to launch an appeal in he event there is no other way. The club couldn't be saved otherwise.

 

What is happening here is just a poll measuring possible interest. It is raising awareness, getting media onside, and just being organised and ready in the event of imminent liquidation.

 

I am too much of a realist to be fooled by false promises, What is happening serves it's purpose in opening doors we want to open.

[derry]

Well thats where we disagree I guess. I would put money on 90% of those pledges being from people who have already voted in the poll.

 

Well I happen to know some people who have pledged decent amounts on there and have nothing at all to do with the site.

 

In the end the pledges mean nothing they are a guide and until called in are unquantifiable.

 

Hopefully nobody else from the site will pledge twice, provided they read this page.

[bridge too far]

Well I happen to know some people who have pledged decent amounts on there and have nothing at all to do with the site.

 

In the end the pledges mean nothing they are a guide and until called in are unquantifiable.

 

Hopefully nobody else from the site will pledge twice, provided they read this page.

 

I rather think they might, Derry (if they are as thick as me ).

 

I pledged on the poll and have, this morning, pledged on the website. So I'm double counted for a start.

 

And I'm willing to bet that others have been as confused as have I. Quite how this can be dismantled I don't know

 

Although I take the point that it's actual sponduliks that will count in the end.

[derry]

I rather think they might, Derry (if they are as thick as me ).

 

I pledged on the poll and have, this morning, pledged on the website. So I'm double counted for a start.

 

And I'm willing to bet that others have been as confused as have I. Quite how this can be dismantled I don't know

 

Although I take the point that it's actual sponduliks that will count in the end.

 

It doesn't matter but it would be helpful to keep the entities separate.

[Saint_Ash]

Pledging on the site means nothing, it's just what people anonomously could put down what they would offer to help whilst the SOS page that Steve has put together is to get genuine figures and offers from people if the shiiit well and truly hits the fan.

[derry]

Pledging on the site means nothing, it's just what people anonomously could put down what they would offer to help whilst the SOS page that Steve has put together is to get genuine figures and offers from people if the shiiit well and truly hits the fan.

 

Then that also means nothing until the effluent hits the oscillator and the pledges are called in.

 

Giving an email is in the end just as irrelevant, as nobody will be chasing up addresses, there would be a general appeal for those that pledged and anybody else willing, to put money into an account or pay in cheques.

 

Either way as I've said before the pledges are a guide to the level of interest and possible support.

 

If the pledged amount is nowhere near the required amount the whole initiative will sadly end there.

[ooohTerryHurlock]

We know there is £53k from 45 pledgees in two days, I suspect not a lot from here if any. That sum indicates a total lack of awareness or interest.

 

We need to get the message out with the website address and see what support builds up as a result, the last thing we want is £900,000 repeat pledges, to totally distort the picture, as we have no idea who has pledged what.

That won't matter in the end as it is only the actual money contributed that counts, the pledges only indicate an interest not a guaranteed commitment.

 

1) Can we get an advert/follow up in the Echo

2) Can the guy who did the give it to Ron stickers do the same thing?

3) Advert in Programme

4) Club needs to email everyone on database, or can we get access to this info

5) Matey with the plane and advert thing

6) Radio exposure from Wave and the rest

7)....Lucy Pinder exposure - oh yeah baby!

 

... I have pledged twice under the confusion - we do need to channel allthis enery behind one person to carry this forward - 4 seperate Save Our Saints campaigns only gives ammunition to those who question whether we can get ourselves organised to sort his out. i applaud Derry's graft and commitment and there is a very large drink to be bought for him ... but we need to have just one group. Got to dash as i am in Oxford and have got to get to SMS for the laurie and le tiss show!

[derry]

1) Can we get an advert/follow up in the Echo

2) Can the guy who did the give it to Ron stickers do the same thing?

3) Advert in Programme

4) Club needs to email everyone on database, or can we get access to this info

5) Matey with the plane and advert thing

6) Radio exposure from Wave and the rest

7)....Lucy Pinder exposure - oh yeah baby!

 

... I have pledged twice under the confusion - we do need to channel allthis enery behind one person to carry this forward - 4 seperate Save Our Saints campaigns only gives ammunition to those who question whether we can get ourselves organised to sort his out. i applaud Derry's graft and commitment and there is a very large drink to be bought for him ... but we need to have just one group. Got to dash as i am in Oxford and have got to get to SMS for the laurie and le tiss show!

 

I'll take those things up Terry, there is only one initiative, the club's emergency fundraising is really a side issue, not for them but for us.

 

The website is the focal point for the initiative and pledges and no matter the source everything is channelled back to the saintsweb/saveoursaints.

 

1 & 6 were dealt with today, Echo looking to put a daily update panel and web address plus article, on BBC Solent by Kevan James and Radio Hampshire, Stuart Dennis/myself/Mark Dennis all giving the address.

Edited 16 April, 2009 by derry

[ooohTerryHurlock]

I'll take those things up Terry, there is only one initiative, the club's emergency fundraising is really a side issue, not for them but for us.

 

The website is the focal point for the initiative and pledges and no matter the source everything is channelled back to the saintsweb/saveoursaints.

 

1 & 6 were dealt with today, Echo looking to put a daily update panel and web address plus article, on BBC Solent by Kevan James and Radio Hampshire, Stuart Dennis/myself/Mark Dennis all giving the address.

 

What about the forum match - may the 7th - get some advertising patches made up for the away shirts and home shirts - Saints Web - save our saints? can we not hi jack the game and use it as away or vehicle to advertise the save our saints campaigne?...... and what about 7?????