The Kraken

I think Matthew le Nutjob can account for 2 or 3 of those on his own.

No, of course not. But neither should we forget that Adkins targetted CB and CF as two areas that needed improving; we have no new CF and we still don't know if the CB area has been improved.

The simple response is "why did you let the away fans out and allow such a general melee to be created in the first place?" but we're going round in circles with that one and we all know it was the wrong decision by the police. Shame they can't admit it, you get the feeling this type of nonsense will just keep on happening.

It's in the police report at the top of this thread.

For the record, I don't think we need another sticker either. We could do with a striker though.

As much as it was a policing cock up, there's absolutely no condoning a Saints fan repetitively spitting at Millwall fans from the safety of a police corden. You deserve a slap for that.

The lack of intelligence on the day, I don't buy that, especially as there was the scuffle with the barrier inside the ground. How can there not be intelligence from previous years though? I remember 3 or 4 years back hearing stories of a group of Millwall walking through West Quay and the precinct giving random people a slap. P*ss poor decision, no doubt.

I think there's no poll.

Actually, there has, but only just recently. Only gossip of course, but rumour of a bust up between the two of them due to losing out on Gorkss.

Whack me in the underwhelmed category; I thought we were worse off than with Pardew and that it was a mistake. Happy to have my face rubbed in it though.

Erm, yes, I think I would.

Pretty sure the window opens up in the next few days. A loan can last only up to 93 days (although can be done in increments i.e.. Chaplow where we extended it when the original 30 day agreement expired). We could only sign in the Jan window, so any loan from the next few days would still have a gap over Xmas before the player could be transferred. Season long loan are not allowed to be conducted outside of the main transfer window.

I've resisted from writing him off, as a few others have done. However, it's completely natural to research a player, search message boards, ask fans of his previous clubs what he's like. Take Jose Fonte, for instance. I have a few mates who support Palace, all were devastated he left them, thought he could do a job in the Premier League let alone League 1, and confirmed he was a brilliant signing, one of Palace's best players over a number of seasons. Palace message boards were full of exactly the same. The case of Hooiveld is markedly different. You will struggle to find a good word to say about him on Celtic message boards. I've asked two of my close friends who live in Glasgow (one of whom is a Celtic season ticket holder) about him, and they think that he was absolutely terrible for Celtic ("pure pish" was the actual terminology) and said that they were amazed we would be in for him. They further elaborated that Scottish football is currently so far in decline that Saints would beat Celtic if they came up against each other, and Hooiveld is nowhere near good enough for their first team. Now, of course, none of that actually means anything until we actually see him play, and I thoroughly hope he's much better than we're expecting. Even if he's not I hope he gets a fair crack of the whip and isn't subject to Puncheon-type treatment. But, as much as gut-instinct can be wrong as it can be right, I can't help thinking this won't be the successful signing we're hoping it to be. and i'd be thoroughly delighted to be proved wrong on that.

I think, before Hooiveld, that we already had plenty of cover players in that position. He just seems another addition to that, i.e. not significantly better than we already have. I might of course be wrong and he could be the answer, time will tell. But until then I will remain convinced we missed a massive trick by failing to sign Gorkss, who would have improved us an provide a great partner for Fonte, whilst also of course adding to the strength in depth in case of injuries.

I agree. Despite what your average Daily Star reader will tell you, we are not a good enough side to be favourites for a major footballing championship, and haven't been since Euro 96, and even then only because we were at Wembley for every game. We're pretty good, from top 3 or 4 downwards, but reaching the quarter finals of a world cup should be seen as a par, and therefore commendable, achievenment. Anything else beyond that is a bonus and classed as real success. As for the FA and FIFA, don't even get me started down that road!

I had a similar chat with LGTC on another thread, about which positions Adkins had highlighted for improvement at the start of the summer. I think we both agreed that CB, CM and CF were all major targets from the outset. We got Cork in early, we bid for Sharp early, and the Jemal deal started early. After Sharp we chased Rodriguez for a while then seemed to lose our way and wouldn't pay over the odds, and with £12M in our pocket it's easy to see we were being rinsed on prices. So yeah, I wouldn't blame the chairman at all for not shelling out over the odds there. For CB, I think it's much less forgivable what happened. Jemal fell through, whether for him or the club being disagreeable. I'm sure we have always had an interest in Gorkss, only because I heard we enquired about him even before the Jemal interest came to light. Not signing Gorkss was a big mistake IMO, he eventually went to Reading for less than £1M. We showed we were willing to spend 4 or 5 times that amount on a forward, yet I consider CB to be the position where we need to strengthen the most, and I think he would have complemented Fonte fantastically. To let him slip through our fingers, go through the Fontaine episode and then end up with a last minute loanee does not reflect well, and with Seaborne and Jaidi now out I hope we don't suffer as a direct result of it.

That's all true. But to go to the extent of wishing your national team to lose, simply because they have a few big-heads in the team and haven't progressed beyond the 1/4 finals of a major tournament in 15 years, is slightly bizarre IMO.

So would you feel different had we won the WC in 2010?

What a very strange thread. But deciding to hate your own footballing country just because they're not as good as you'd like them to be is truly weird.

To these points; I'd be very surprised indeed (especially given Adkins said so himself) if most of these players had not been identified by the club at the start of the summer. Adkins words on the OS were "we highlighted a number of players in this position [CB] at the start of the summer". So it's fair to assume that there was a list, although you're right to say there was an order of priority. The only one I'd say that was not the case was Hooiveld, who I think was more of a panic search when all other options had fallen through. But I thoroughly think we dropped the ball with not signing a top quality centre-back, time will tell with Hooiveld but my suspicions are that he will be no better than the backup we already have. I'm much more forgiving of the failure to bring in a striker. We know we had a bid accepted for Billy Sharp in excess of £3M but the player clearly wanted too much money. We also put in substantial bids for Rodriguez that the club didn't accept. Paying £6M plus for that type of striker, when you could have paid the same amount in summer 2010 for Javierr Hernandez, just didn't make financial sense. And when Barnard returns it's not as if we're massively short of attcking options, with Lambert, Connolly and Barnard backed up by Lallana, de Ridder, Guly and even Forte. Fairly healthy options, I'd say, and if a more cost-effective option becomes available in the New Year window then all the better.

I'm really not sure whether to laugh at all this or not, as it just seems a bit cruel. Nah, f*ck it, I'm laughing. Thanks MLG, you are an unintentional comedy genius.

If this guy turns out to actually be decent I'm going to suggest he must have been playing in disguise for a number of years, nobody seems to have anything good to say about his previous appearances.

No you don't, I could give you any number of examples of how this isn't a pre-requisite.

That's my take on it. He can't be far away from 100% fitness, just maybe a bit rusty with a lack of first team football. But he's a 6'4" centre half, not exactly a twinkle toes midfielder, so less succeptible you'd have thought. If, after 10 days training with his new teammates, he can't displace Martin (who is effectively our 4th choice centre back) then I'll begin to wonder what this transfer is all about.

He'll have had 10 days between signing and his first game. He may not have been match sharp when he arrived but there would be something pretty wrong if his fitness was that bad that after 10 days training he's still only 80%.