egg

That's a stupid thing to say.

Ditto.

Crying is fine mate. It's just that he's a cock and I'm happy to see him upset.

Anyway, who's this Nadia on ITV?

Yep. The winner tonight is the winner imo.

If it's us, I hope so. If it's France, I hope not.

Yep. On his own to get the focus. All about him. Selfish, self centred idiot.

Wow! Well done Morocco. I don't like to see a man cry, but I'll make an exception for Ronaldo.

Yep. Theatrics. Whining. Ronaldo. Bruno Fernandes. Horrible team.

I think you're right. Tonight is as tough as it gets for both teams. We'll never get a better chance than this year.

Indeed. Ethnicity=inclusion and errors overlooked. People like Merse suffering with a mental illness should be given at least the same level of tolerance, and opportunity. I'll never forgive him for playing for that lot though.

I take your point. Merson is the white male exception. His health issue (addiction) is well known, and sky would be almost as hard pressed to bin him as they would a black woman. There's also the Stelling link - he only stayed after MLT went as he wanted to support Merse. I think they'd lose Stelling if they let Merse go.

Why is it? There is absolutely no doubt that inclusivity and diversity has gotten ridiculous. @saintant sees the world in the same way as many people, he's just more honest than most.

Different issues conflated. Duckie is correct, the Argies showed no class. VvD chipping in the refs ear is part and parcel of the game. Putting players off pre penalties isn't unusual. Even if the Dutch were wrong though, it doesn't stop the Argies from showing a bit of class and professionalism in victory.

Alias

I agree entirely that we can only accept our lot as we can't change it. That's altogether different though to my preference being to compete rather than struggle, even in in a lower league. I'm with you on hope too, but I'm not one of those who comes away happy with a hard fought 2 nil defeat.

100% agreed. I get the impression that some "fans" will lose interest if we're relegated. It's almost like the premier league is a bigger appeal than Saints. I find that genuinely sad.

Yep. I could live with that. I find the notion of being happy with being a shit team in a great league bizarre. It'd be like being content with celibacy. I'd rather a year of decent sex followed by a barren year personally.

Given the option of the thrill of the chase to avoid relegation, or the thrill of the chase to gain promotion, I'd prefer the latter personally. Different perspectives I guess.

Genuine question - What's the appeal of never having a chance of success compared to having a chance of promotion, and competing well at the top end of the table? Other than the better league and watching us getting beaten by really good players, the appeal isn't obvious.

On your last bit, yes, there are massive financial impacts of relegation to include for staff etc. However, the discussion (I assumed) was from a football perspective only. For me, on that front, relegation ain't an issue. Personally I want my team to compete. I also want to see them achieve something positive at the season end, or at least have a chance to. Playing for mid table nothingness does nothing for me, and fighting to stay up is shit. Look at the championship table now, and the premier league, and ask yourself whether you'd rather be in the shoes of a Millwall fan sitting 7th with a real chance of the play offs or promotion, or a saints fan with a real chance of relegation. I suspect many people will be reluctant to give the honest answer.

Of course, but ask yourself when/if that's likely to happen again. Personally, I have no issue when/if we go down, and if we lose some fans who've only hung around in the hope of us pushing for European places, then that's no bad thing.

I don't get it, and I don't get why it's considered preferable to scrape safety in the premier league than, for example, enjoy a push to make the play offs. I checked the championship table earlier. 17th place is only 6 points off the play offs. That's 17 teams with something positive to play for. Compare that to the PL with maybe 8 teams having something positive to play for each season.

Yep, and the skates and Leeds, like forest and all the others had something to play for each season whether it was/is play offs or straight promotion. We have the dizzy heights of safety to play for.

Chandler