S-Clarke

Was that before or after they frightened their directors out of the stadium after threats of harm? They put on an atmosphere on the final day, but I think it's easy to treat those sort of 'winner takes all' games as one off finals and support them with that mindset. Everton have been proper toxic in the stands all season though.

I find it hard to disagree with much of what you say there, it has been continuous cockups to lead us to where we are today. Maybe this is seemingly our level now, gone are the days of a Koeman coming in - so the least we can do is support him and hope for the best. But when you put it like you have above it is really quite frightening how bad a job they've made of it thus far.

Yeah exactly that, those guys will be totally ineffective if the bones behind them aren't there. I'm looking for more Dean Hammonds, Jose Fontes, Davis, Butterfield, Chaplow etc - those sorts to mix in and around the attacking 'playmakers'. Even when we had our playoff push in 2006 we had a decent defence with Claus and Baird, we should have been able to build from that - but we did 100% lack in midfield that year in my opinion. That team in 06 was much better than Derby's on paper in attack and wide, but Derby had some nasty bastards in their side - esp. in CM/up front. (howard)

I think Chelsea have proven, at an extreme level, that money doesn't equal anything. We shouldn't need to spend a mini fortune to be competitive in this league, we just need to make sure we find ourselves our own Bastien's, Meyers, Benson etc. The bonus is that we already have one of their stars on our books - Tella!

This is a seriously competitive league this year. On paper it looks great viewing and it's going to be very hard, in my opinion, for anyone to 'walk it' this year. It's going to be a right old slog, but hopefully a fun one. Former established PL sides everywhere you look, even Wednesday and Ipswich coming up for L1 just add to the strength of the league.

£15-20m will be his going rate, especially with 1 year left on his contract and an incredibly underwhelming season.

Interesting you pick up on this, Leicester fans view of that statement is polar opposite. They're not happy with that statement at all, but then I do wonder what football fans would ever be happy with. The abuse their owner has received, which he references in that statement, is nothing short of disgusting given what that family have given that club.

He's leaving us just how he arrived, shrouded in a covered up mystery.

I don't think he's saying that at all, I get where he is coming from. Both are good players and capable of playing at the highest level, but they are missing attributes which will always hold them back from breaking into that 'elite' level in my opinion. What I would say is that JWP has, at times, been able to control a game for us against lesser opposition - but he struggles against power and pace, not through a lack of effort or trying, he's just limited physically with his pace and strength which does mean he gets gobbled up in CM at times. I do prefer him further up and playing from the right in an attacking role, picking up pockets of space to thread a ball through (which he's good at doing). The timing of his runs into the box are decent as well, as is his touch and manipulation of the ball - but we will always go back to his lack of pace and physicality which have truly held him back from being one of 'elite' products.

Football fans are so deluded, from some of us thinking we'd get Potter to Leicester fans thinking Oxlaide-Chamberlain is a legit target for them.

KWP has been really poor this season by his standards, but I just don't understand how anyone can rate Lyanco tbh. I've never seen anything from him that'll make me want to keep him around.

It's a cesspit of a league if you're struggling in it, or waddling around in mid-table - no doubts about that. We've been there and that season we went down under Wotte was just bilge, 4-1 at Hull, 5-0 at Wednesday I think. Most depressing time I've ever had. It's fun if you're doing well though, as Burnley will likely confirm.

Not sure why anyone would want to keep any of our CB's around, especially Lyanco. Bloke is a disaster, no positional sense to start with and an absolutely unpredictable nightmare. You couldn't ever build a consistent team with the likes of him around, worst choice of captain ever as well.

Pretty inevitable it was going to end like that. Leeds feels a bit toxic, lots gone wrong there since they ditched Belisa. Typical Bielsa teams though, when they're good they're great to watch, but the unravelling of them is more often than not pretty catastrophic. Not sure what Leicester will do either, they have to sell lots and lots due to their wage bill size - and even that may not give them the flexibility to add a great deal. You'd have to say, overall, the 3 relegated teams are a surprise. The 3 promoted sides relatively comfortable come the end.

What are you on mate!

Rasmus is part owner of the company, it's not just a case of a 'sacking'.

A game to sum it all up. Piss poor start, rally against the so-called big sides, and piss away a lead in record time. Everything from this season wrapped up in a single game. I've been accepting of our relegation for months now, but I do feel weirdly despondent today and I didn't think I would feel like that. Maybe it's the finality of it all? And the cheerio to certain players? All water under the bridge now though, need to look forward to next year positively and get a team to be proud and excited of again. It's been far too long.

Talk about manipulating and making up history to make a (very) bad point. They didn't get promoted under Liam Manning. He was then sacked the following year after they were rooted to the foot of the table, since then it's been a downward trajectory leading to relegation to L2. Swansea had the financial issues to deal with during Martins reign, as they'd gone past that 2 year out of the PL milestone and their squad had regressed massively. No money to improve things and it was a case of make do with what they had (whilst losing Mark Guehi and the likes). They were always going to regress and Cooper saw that and jumped.

Going -

1'st/2nd years are critical, fail in those two and you basically become Stoke, Bolton, Derby etc. Our first year down last time was a total waste for everyone, 2nd season we gave it a decent crack, but we failed and that was pretty much the end for us. I think we should be aiming for it next year though, we should have enough resources to make a real crack of it compared to 2005.

Some may have, but they did already have a nucleus of PL experience in that side (Cook, Billing, Solanke, Kelly etc). Luton is a great story but they need stacks more work. Be interesting to see how they approach it, as I thought the quality on show today from them was pretty poor.

What does suit our team though? They can't press, they can't defend, they can't do long ball, they can't retain or pass the ball. Pretty hopeless in all departments. Thankfully we have a new DoF, head of recruitment and manager who are geared to this way of playing. There will be a huge change up in the summer and we will sign players suited for the way Martin wants to play, 100% gaurenteed.

What a story for Luton, certainly interesting to see an unusual face in the PL rather than the likes of Norwich, WBA or Watford - boring as hell. But I kinda fear for Luton a bit, I do not see how they can compete in the PL. It's going to be a tall order and it could be quite a humbling year for them if they're not careful (not that they give a shit now, but come next January they'll probably hate it)

Newcastle will be an amazing move for him if that happens, he should take that with both hands. I reckon we'll get a decent $$ if they're the bidders too, given that they thought it was a good idea to spend £46m on Gordon.

I think meaningless possession football is a bit far fetched, it isn't. Did Burnley play meaningless possession football? What about Boro? They were heavy, heavy possession based teams last year and in Burnley's case they got the reward for it as they had the right mix of players to complement it (one of those players is ours...!). Boro came close, but they weren't even expected to be there really. I did have the opinion that a name, a strong character, was what we needed this summer and I would have been totally for someone like Viera or Potter - but I think most of us knew that was far fetched. The fact is that this decision is done, we either jump and down every week because we wanted x or y or we put last season firmly in the bin, forget the decisions of the past and see what the new season can bring us. I do see talk about Swansea fans not rating Martin, but this is cherry picking as there are equally the same amount - if not more - who are very disappointed and upset to see him go, and those who believe with backing for the right players everything he has put in place would have been perfect.