S-Clarke

They've got a bit more grit and experience about them.

That's pretty much it. It's lazy just to blame the CB's, the ease in which Everton players ran at our back 4 on Saturday was slightly alarming and it does kind of spring up question marks about our lack of cover @ CM. I spoke to someone today who said that if we want to attack and play football as we are, then we'll always give the opposition chances. I don't think that's true. I look at the likes of Bilbao as an example from last season, when they didn't have the ball they worked their arses off to pressure and get that ball back. But it all boils down to ball retention, if we keep hold of the ball then they're less likely to have chances...! And then when we do need to pressure them, we'll have more energy, as it can be seriously sapping to be out on the field chasing the ball for 90 mins. I think we've been sloppy on the ball at times this season and we've given it back way too easily, now if we can really retain it then we'll concede less goals. Sounds simple...! But it always requires a bit of patience from the stands. When we've retained the ball previously and have gone back to the GK, and to the CB's etc then all I hear are moans, and groans ''GET IT UP'' etc. Why? What will that achieve? Nothing half the time, other than the ball being headed away and picked up by the oppo...but at the end of the day, when we do pass it backwards the opposition haven't got it and they can't score.

In terms of a player that would immediately fix a shortcoming in our side, it has to be Baines. I still think Clyne is a bit of a square peg at left back, he can cover there - but he's primarily a right back.

annoyingly, Evertons second goal came from them waltzing straight through the middle...!

This is actually quite an interesting debate, and it's interesting to see that most people are thinking along the same lines, and that the overreactions are from a minority. Personally, with our start, I didn't expect a great deal if I'm honest. I fully expected us to be in the bottom 3, so the fact we're not is pretty astonishing (OK, that may end tonight..). But we're playing as I expected. Fluent, expressive, enthusiastic - but probably slightly more naive than I thought we would be. It has been a baptism of fire, everyone has been given a short, sharp lesson on the Barclays Premier League. It holds no prisoners. So, I think the start will have given us a quick education on what to expect and I think we're looking a bit smarter. The quality is there though, technically we're a terrific little side. If we can just get the balance right between attacking and defending then we may have a good season after all. I know a fair few fans (not particularly just saints fans) are saying that we're doomed, we look relegation fodder etc - I don't think we do. I see a team that creates plenty of chances, causes any team problems and scores goals against anyone - bearing in mind we've just played what will probably be the top 4 or 3 in the league. If I was a Reading fan I'd be slightly more worried. They've had a pretty straight forward start compared to us, yet they haven't won a game. They concede goals, yet never really look like scoring. They don't stand out with the quality whereas I think you'd look at us and immediately see quality in certain area's. If we stick together and do what we have been doing in an attacking sense, then against the likes of Norwich, Reading, WHU I think we'll start to shift up the league. We're not a bad side, we just need to learn.

My take, is that he got his positioning wrong on Evertons 2nd goal. He should have got something on that if I'm honest. the Third goal came from such an amazing angle that he probably didn't expect it, and it was headed with such power that there wasn't a great deal anyone could have done - taking into account how unexpected it was as well. their equalizer...not really. Could have said he may have taken a bit more of control of the situation, but my take on it is that it was a rash initial clearance that went no where, and no one tracked Osmans run into the box.

Eh? What on earth are you on about? Is it said in jest or something, as it makes no sense. It's a bizarre couple of paragraphs which are just, weird.

It really wouldn't. We'd still be over run in midfield, as Guly is not a central midfield player. He is an attacking forward/striker/winger. Playing him in midfield is suicide really, and it would kind have been like hanging the poor guy out to dry.

I like petric, looks a very busy player who has an eye for goal. Risse down the left is dangerous too, in fact they're not a bad team. Much, much better than Villa.

At least we actually got an 11 out of you, but now you see the problem. We didn't really have another way of playing yesterday with the players we had available. Guly in midfield is wrong, and Adkins would have been lambasted (probably by you) if he'd have done it, and we'd lost anyway.

Prepare to face the wrath of Roger.

Adkins did say it wasn't as bad as corks, but that didn't exactly fill me with hope that he'll be back soon.

Yes, medial ligaments.

I'm still waiting for an alternative setup for yesterday, that you'd have gone with. All well and good criticizing, but if you can't think of an alternative, then what are you actually criticizing?

Hasn't he traveled something like 8 miles in games? More than any other? What he gives you is pressuring of the opposition, you watch him...he never gives them a rest, always tugging at them...and when he does get the ball 90% of the time he retains it and picks up good area's to do so. We don't have another player like him in our squad. I'm still stunned to see how people fail to see what he brings to us in terms of team-shape.

Great post, and it's this change in mindset which some are struggling to come to terms with.

Adkins suggested that it's not as bad as Corks knee injury (not sure what that says about the seriousness of Corks injury..!), but it's not a good one and he is touch and go for Sunday. That's probably a little optimistic, as he's done his medial ligament he's out for probably 3/4 weeks at minimum. Luckily we have an international break during that time.

He's injured and was missing yesterday, but it's still a chance he could return for Sunday according to Jol.

You can have the 2 best CB's in the world, but if your midfield leaves them as exposed as ours, then they'll still have problems.

Jeez, he actually says it was nice to see others questioning his ability? Why is that nice? Oh, maybe because he's still trying to prove his point which he lost around 18 months ago. Sad.

I think we'll sneak a surprise one along the line, but we'll need that certain side to have a serious off day. We're not even close to competing with that level of sides yet, not down to our quality, but our inexperience. I said in another thread that I think our squad could be a late developer this season and we could end up having a terrific 2nd half of the season, as we defiantly have the quality it's just the youthful inexperience that's costing us (and that's players, and at times, management). Luckily for us, I think Norwich and Reading are equally as **** but have less of a potent attack about them, so I think we'll still be in touch come January. They've also accumulated less (or equal) points with a seriously easier run of fixtures than ours.

You're right, it's not as easy as saying ''We need a new CB'' - It's the entire team setup, but it's also our lack of quality depth. There's not much we can do about that. Without Cork, and Morgan we all of a sudden look very week in the central area and as good as WP is....I think he struggles as part of a 2, and he gets outmusscled easily which is understandable. Davis if anyone should have got more stuck in yesterday. I think it also shows what Adkins thinks of SDR, pretty much the same as all of us. The most ineffective player in history.

With everton, Arsenal, Man Utd, Man City in that group of 6 fixtures, I'm not massively surprised at our return. Wigan is the one game that bugs me.

Can you explain what formation he should have started with yesterday? I keep seeing it trotted out that he got it wrong yesterday, but not one poster who has criticized it has given a valid alternative. Puncheon has had a knock all week, so has Mayuka, Morgan was out. What we started with was the best we could have put out in a tweaked formation.

I was surprised at the ease they sliced through the middle at times, and were running straight out our CB's. Now, we cold buy the best CB's in the world - but if you give them no protection, then they're going to be pulled all over the shop. You guys came across well though, heard lots of saints chants - very little from EFC though as you said.