Verbal

Wise words from the great Carl Sagan: "I am often asked, 'Do you believe in UFOs?' I'm always struck by how the question is phrased, the suggestion that this is a matter of belief and not evidence. I'm almost never asked, 'How good is the evidence that UFOs are alien spaceships?'."

I didn't call you gormless. I was using a metaphor about the mountain range. You may now hang your head in shame.

What utterly baffles me - and perhaps one of the simpering Tories on here can explain it - is why the Tory 'rebels' are rebelling against something that was in their own manifesto just two years ago. "People have been shut out of Westminster politics for too long," it says, and therefore the Tories will "work to build a consensus for a mainly elected second chamber to replace the House of Lords." Sounds like these 'rebels' have attained truly alpine heights of gormlessness.

That's because they, unlike Pompey, have been taken over by someone with actual money, and now have serious, well backed ambition. Expect Forest to push for promotion this season.

Ah ok. I did not know that. Can I suggest then that we shorten Full Member PLUS to Big Member so that it fits nicely under the name?

Brilliant impression of Colonel Blimp as updated by a Daily Mail reader comment!

Oh, you're right. That's amazing - it would take an Act of Parliament to chuck the little criminal out.

You really didn't understand the sentence you highlighted, did you. Go back and read it - don't rush, the point may sink in slowly, although I suspect not at all. Unless you really do mean you think cronyism is a good thing...

RonManager. Learn to multiquote.

I think Archer has been de-frocked, hasn't he? The same should have happened to Ashcroft of course, but the way the system works, he won't be. Ashcroft is cronyism personified - he was caught up in the 'cash for peerages' scandal of 2006. I wonder what 'expertise' he brings to the table? Advising his Lordships on the latest tax 'schemes'?

And the American one doesn't work? The one that has been at the centre of the world's most successful economy of the last century and a half? There's a lot wrong with the American version of bicameral democracy, but there's nothing wrong with the principle of the separation of powers. However, you can't have a separation of powers in any meaningful sense without 'competing' chambers having some sort of legitimacy. The only legitimacy claimed by the Lords is inherited privilege and cronyism - something the lower house has sought to maintain precisely so that it can sail on unchallenged.

Why?

Apart from your first sentence, I agree with this. What's proposed won't serve representative democracy well (as opposed to party politicians) nor will it enhance the kind of expertise that can act as a real brake on the lower chamber's battier ideas. There also needs to be more thought on the balance of power between the chamber - the kind of discussion that has been stymied precisely because thje lower house have been able to lord it (pun intended) over the upper chamber. The archaic nature of the Lords has actually been in the narrow political interests of parties in the lower house - hence the failure to really change it. But if it IS changed, there is at least a chance that public cynicism about politics, which is so damaging, would be diminished. And yes, we should take the constitutional knife to the monarchy.

I'm going to wait for you to edit this so that it makes sense.

With experts, sound judgement and up-to-date knowledge are one and the same thing. There's nothing more dangerous than a medical 'expert', for example, whose training has not been updated in 20-30 years. So if you don't buy the expertise guff, what floats your boat? What it is about the Lords that works as a shining example of representative democracy?

Says the one who started the thread but has shown no understanding at all of the reforms proposed, or interest in discussing the detail. I'll put it in baby words especially for you. We live in what is supposed to be a representative democracy. You could say we invented it, and this movement for democratic rights reached its zenith with the 1832 Reform Act. Representative democracy emerged from a battle between the oligarchs of the day and those demanding these democratic rights. Ever since the Magna Carta, compromises have had to be made to either appease the oligarchs or neutralise them. Hence the House of Lords. The fudges that have been made to the chamber, mostly in the 20th century, have still not dealt with the basic problem that it is a ludicrously anachronistic way for a modern parliamentary democracy to organise a political institution. No one actually defends the Lords on he grounds of representativeness. The best you get, aside from the knee jerkers like you, is that the Chamber is full of 'experts'. It actually isn't; if you spend any time there, it's pretty clear it's full of retirees who have long ago lost touch with the modern world. Hence 'good grief'.

As it gets nastier for Kanu, it's worth emphasising again that the reason the parachute system exists in the first place is to ensure that player contracts are honoured when relegation suddenly stuffs a club with unsustainable overheads. To drum players out of the club because of their Premier League contracts in order to for the club to get its hand on the parachute payments must be pretty damn close to criminal - ie theft.

Good grief.

Jacko is hidden behind the Riverside stand, where you have to earn as much as he did to afford a ticket. But yes, Fulham has a large section in the Putney End where fans from either club and neutrals can sit. It's a great place to watch a game, and the only club in all four divisions, I think, where it's allowed.

What?

Good. The end of an earache.

Which lord has reformed? Or is it just another of Dune's illiterate musings?

It's disappointing that Kanu is playing into Birch's hands like this. Can we send a PTS delegation over to Nigeria to persuade him to go to the rec with the other players and kick a ball?

Yep, it was Manchester City council's investment in the Commonwealth Games. It's been a win-win for the council and the club, because it's an outstanding stadium and it's helped rejuvenate the area around it. (As St Mary's could yet do...)

There is one club we'll play this season where you can do this completely guilt-free - and you can jump up and down to your heart's content when we score even though you may be surrounded by diehard home fans...