Saint86

Nah, if they're found guilty of most of these charges they're done. They'll be stripped and kicked out. Will mean they've essentially cheated financial rules to overspend every season since 2009 - impacting on the competitiveness of other teams, they're league finishes, as well as the required cost of remaining competitive in the league. Teams have been sticking to the rules whilst City may have been paying shadow contracts to staff and players - effectivley ignoring FFP and allowing them to dope themselves to the hilt every season. All of which has compounded over the years. The big 6 will turn on them, sides like us will have had placements affected on the odd rare seasons, domestic cups have been won, and there will also be inevitable follow ups related to 3rd party ownership and tax matters. Plenty of examples in Rugby, European football, and even cases like Swindon in this country.

There is an element of him being the right guy at the perfect time for this tbh. The real judgement really should be on Rasmus. Its abundantly clear that he is Rasmus' man, that rasmus appointed him, and likely also that Rasmus is the reason he hasn't be sacekd. Jones is Jones and clearly has his flaws - but one person in particular has created this situation - and that is Rasmus, the guy leading SR who said they weren't going to interfere too much in the running of SFC. When you add Jones' short fuse, the ease with which he gets wound up, and his atrocious media persona together, and then combine it with the club wide disaster that is unfolding under Rasmus' decision making to date - its not really a surprise that the fanbase has just gone after the obvious target.

Yes fine, but given they all know how sensitive the situation is (and Semmens most of all given it wasn't his first rodeo).. I think he knew exactly what he was saying, and he went as far as he could to make it clear he had no time for Jones.

Only Rasmus was, and i thought it was clear that he couldn't really give a toss - Jones is his man and he isn't going to change it based on fan feeling. The only thing that will be achieved by fan toxicity now is to accelerate the race to the bottom. I am on the fence over whether that is a good thing or not - depends if you think we're in terminal decline, or if given infinite patience by daddy rasmus, Jones might actually start winning (as obnoxious as he is) - and we have put in some good performances under him. Semmens called Jones stupid and said that he wasn't happy with his conduct and was quite concerned. I would say its quite likely that Semmens would have sacked Jones. Everyone remembers when SR said they weren't going to get too involved in running the club... well right now we've got a manager specifically hired by Sports Republic and Rasmus, and which SR are preventing us from getting rid of. The only way you'll get change here is going after Rasmus - Semmens isn't the villain of this piece, and indeed i have started to think he hasn't done much wrong to deserve the ire he's getting from some of the fans. Technically Jones doesn't deserve the personal vitriol he is getting from some fans. He is out of his depth and struggling with the pressure - none of which is particularly nice to see. Ultimately Rasmus gave him the job (by all accounts it sounds like a "now or never" style approach from saints), and Rasmus is happy with his metrics off the pitch - as well as overestimating his on pitch performances and personality traits i would say 😆😰

Another two goals in the cup last night. Sincerely hope we can keep him and getting him playing for us... or as an absolute minimum get a good sale price out of him.

But then why have they got better since he left... 😨 Unless its the infamous momentum curve in action 😏.

Semmens publucally called Jones stupid in from of a live recorded fans forum 😂 and it's then gone out. How often does that happen at a premier league club. I don't think semmens is the bad guy that the fans make him out to be tbh. Was obvious Rasmus is the one backing Jones. To me, it seems like rasmus lives in a world where he doesn't care what the fans think of his decision making - which could ultimatley be good or bad subject to how it all turns out... However, precious few people are backing him on Jones... The most telling thing rasmus said, was basically that he'll stick with a mananger as long as he can "improve the players"... So what I actually heard there was assets... which says fundamentally to me that he sees asset/player value increases and player trading to be as important (if not more) to him than Premier league survival? Or am I the only one who heard / took it that way? I guess that wouldn't be so surprising from a guy from brentford and the crazy profits they made (whilst achieving ultimate promotion and building a new stadium). Could the difference here be that brentford got lucky with their mananger, and that Rasmus has taken that to mean all his appointments will work out as well? Or that the brentford success wasn't really due to Rasmus? Tough one for the fanbase tbh. I guess we have to go into wolves backing the team. But another loss and the toxicity is only going to ramp up and may lead to a change. A draw would be the worst result - fall further adrift and more likely to prolong the paralysis.

Indeed. I remember all Rasmus' guff about understanding saints and the culture of our club... but here we are with them blocking the pathway for our academy kids and trying to get us playing 5 at the back hoof ball. Broadly speaking we're a fanbase that wants to see the team play attacking football and have a go, with a smattering of academy players in and around the first team.

To be honest, if you want to get change, go after the people above Jones - start posting Rasmus out and going after Rasmus and SR on social media. They are ultimately the ones at fault, and given that, they're probably not that fussed if jones takes flack in the short term. Conversely, if you shine a light on Sports Republic and get that trending with Saints' 1.5M twitter followers, it will immediatley be damaging their brand and future business opportunities. Nathan Jones is not a brand.

This.

Agreed, although Dragan may attend. Though technically SR are the owners and Rasmus is the king there - i.e. Dragan is the money man, not the boss. Not saying we should do what Everton's fans did, but they certainly got a reaction by making the atmosphere extremely vociferous for the board - sit ins, protests at the training ground etc. SR's approach to Jones has been weak as well. "A stay of execution" - what does that really mean? Are they hoping he'll turn it around? As fans that message surely says that if we kick off enough, he'll be gone... But kicking off and creating a toxic atmosphere will cost us points and increase the likihood of relegation. They'd have been better off saying that he is staying until the end of the season / until relegation, or sacking him imo. Instead they've left uncertainty where increased toxicity will fester.

The academy was the best side in the country last year - outside of man city's u18 galacticos equivalent, and between them they put a lot of effort and good work into the academy and training setup. The scouting had somewhat recovered (i.e. no more leminas, hoedts, boufals, or vestergards) and a lot more smarter acquisitions like KWP, Broja, Tino Salisu, likely ABK etc. The women's team has certainly significantly improved as well... All of which should be praised given we didn't have a pot to piss in and with a significant loan and covid losses hanging over the club. So yes, minus the total lack of funds for the first team, Semmens and Ralph did a fairly reasonable job i'd say. Also, I didn't say SR "decimated" the squad (that was someone else misquoting me), i'm saying they've damaged our squad - and it is a real mess imo. Now you're ofc welcome to disagree, but we're bottom of the league and have played half a season with no competent attackers for this level. Not to mention our summer of recruitment ultimately weakened our midfield with no cover for Lavia. Where do you stand on the Forster vs Bazunu appraisal? Anyway, I don't know what else you would call that given we're in a league where you have to strengthen just to survive...? We're bottom of the league and have spent half a season with glaring holes in the squad 🤷‍♂️

Fine I'll rephrase, they've spent that money on players that aren't ready yet and overall are not of the required standard... Which means we're one of the highest spenders in the league and we've gone backwards vs the competition. I agree lavia and ABK are both good players - but I was talking about the squad, not individuals. When you add that to the total upheaval in coaching setup and playing style (as you say), the academy, scouting and recruitment etc. Then what you have is one big mess - that's the result of 18 months of SR. The club currently has no visible identity and/or direction. And against all that, performances on the pitch continue to decline. All of which could have been so much different with a good striker and mananger - although that wouldn't resolve the off the field turmoil. I don't blame Ralph or Semmens for that tbh. Those 2 had done a good job keeping the club going but didn't have the funds to strengthen the team, I suspect that with the money and no SR oversight things would have been quite different. Ultimatley, it's all since SR and Rasmus came in that it's started to get really messy - and we have to hope they've got the money to see this through, and the ability to learn very quickly now. As for Jones, he is sadly just out of his depth and floundering big time atm. Impressive really quite how much damage he's done to harminony and the fan relationship - if he had just kept his thoughts to himself for the last 2 games' post match interviews it would have been so much better 😂😢... Now it all looks very terminal. Sadly a toxic atmosphere won't help the team or the club, similarly I think social media protests have minimal impact. I echo the views that a near empty SMS would make a strong impression, similarly a protest at the fan forum could get the message through.

I personally think Semmens and Ralph did us alright. But rasmus' decision making has been an absolute car crash from the start. We had stability and indeed growth off the pitch before SR. They've spent over a hundred million and damaged the playing sqaud, and any stability in the coaching, academy, and scouting departments. They're on the verge of setting the club back 10-15 years...

Yeah it does look like that, which isn't great to see, and its why i am trying to keep it all non personal. Myst be horrendous for him really, works to build his career, has a nightmare at stoke, rebuilds his career, and is probably having flashbacks now... Hes the kind of manager who (if he's ever going to make it) needs to get to the prem by himself with his own side... And in hindsight, we were always going to be a nightmare for whoever we took on because of the post Ralph hangover.

needs to happen... similar to a "you fat bastard chant"... build it... build it... and realease! "hands up if you want jones out!!!!". Repeat again. Needs to happen.

So wait, Sutton said something that everyone agrees with... 🤯 unless ofc your name is Rasmus...🤣

Our team in the championship next season under Jones... Pretty much seen that back line already... Bazunu, Bree - Lyanco - ABK - Bednarek - Perraud Diallo - Alcaraz Moi AA Che Might get lucky and retain players like Tella, Orsic, DCC, Sulemana, Onuachu, i doubt it somehow. 4 of them must be regretting their move here and Tella could be going into a breakout season in the prem. Salisu, KWP, Lavia are all certain to be sold. Quite likely JWP but we'll see. ABK could also get taken off our hands - in which case i guess we'll see Lyanco, stephens, and bednarek as our 3CB's for Jones' Championship run... Some may think that isn't that bad - but what a fall from grace it is considering where we are. Imagine achieving that within 18months and a £100M plus net spend. Not to mention taking apart much of the backroom scouting and academy set ups. Impressive really. And the elephant in the room behind all this. We've massively shat the bed overspending on player wages, agents fees, contract terminations etc. The recruitment (especially this january) has been all over the shop, and we're going to run smack into EFL's FFP limits. Similarly our owners are not really that rich. There is a very large abyss where we're heading if we aren't careful. I guess Rasmus directly targeted a manager who could compete in the championship on a shoe string budget...

They can't appeal to CAS apparently. They're accused of some shady stuff. Listened to talk sport earlier and apparently Mancini had a shadow contract that paid him more than his man city contract... for 4 days work... if they've done this with key staff and players going back to 2009, they're simply no way they don't have their titles stripped and get demoted. It would invalidate their league finish in every season since... Its an entirely separate issue to their fake "sponsorship" deals - but that in itself is worth sanctions if proven. If they have had shadow contracts for players and staff, i would imagine they'll be further repercussions on those individuals as that breaches 3rd party ownership rules. They haven't provided evidence because presumably they don't like what the evidence shows... Added to all of that, the government is now looking to take controls from the premier league and has accused it of not being able to police itself. Up steps the perfect opportunity after 4 years of investigations and 100 allegations... they're deeply in the shite as it stands, and they need to find some pretty compelling evidence to defend these various allegations... evidence that they've already been sanctioned for withholding 😆

That doesn't even bear thinking about!

Leeds have acted and sacked Marsch as well. Wonder if they consider / can tempt bielsa back.

Agreed. The only thing that needs to be conveyed is the dissatisfaction with SR's running of the club. Jones' position, troubles with squad harmony, the wrecking ball they've taken to key backroom staff in the academy and scouting sectors etc. The scatter gun / panicked approach to recruitment could be mentioned, and i almost don't want to know what a financial shit storm is going to hit if we end up in the championship.

I'd give him a go tbh, he'd certainly sort the atmosphere and the dressing room out here. Only question is whether he'd by into doing what SR want re selections and asset development.

Obviously I would also support this 😊 as I don't think we should have sacked him in the first place. What should have happened is SR should have given him the godamn striker they promised as well as a CDM - instead they hung him, and ultimately the playing squad, out to dry - sending them off for half a season with a sieve for defensive midfield, and a bunch of blunt wooden spoons in attack. I still don't personally understand how as a fanbase overall, we seemingly expected to stay in the premier league whilst starting Che Adams and AA up front, Ely / Aribo / Walcott as wingers/attacking mids, and Diallo and AMN in central midfield... That just isn't a thing. And yet, Ralph had us 3 points off 12th with that squad, with our makeshift selection of blunt attackers somehow sitting 13th for xG, and truthfully 15th for goals conceded isn't that bad... Neither of those stats sits you in the relegation zone, it was our 18th for goals scored thats seen to that. But he also had bad injuries to contend with (KWP, Lavia, ABK, and Tino), as well as having to gel a lot of young and inexperienced players this season (something Jones should be getting some benefit from), and not to mention having played all the best sides in his 15games. Just for reference, Jones' tenureship has seen us drop to 15th for xG, and 19th for goals against. We're now 17th for goals scored - technically a slight improvement, but actually we're level with Notts Forest on 17 goals each. Only everton and wolves have scored fewer. So jones' has had easier games, a prolonged period to work with the players, and we've very clearly got worse. Also in defence of Ralph, he never had Ings properly replaced by the previous owners (or SR), and then he didn't even get the 20year old sporadic loanee broja replaced, he lost his defensive Midfield lyncpin in Romeu which was bound to upset the side's balance, and then he lost his replacement in lavia with no cover seemingly provided - all of which meant he had to either play Diallo or AMN as our anchor, or sacrifice our best player attacking/creative player in JWP as an anchor man... To justify his sacking, as a fanbase we must have deemed him to have been doing appallingly against the expectations to warrant sacking? So i can only assume we were expecting the side to be top 10 or chasing europe?!?! Esecially when you consider the above mitigations. In his last game with a fully fit squad he beat chelsea and we played superbly - but that ofc was the last game Ralph played with a Lavia. The weak before that we comfortably outplayed united and we were very unlucky not to win that game imo, let alone lose it. But with a full strength squad, let alone proper backing this january, its extremely unlikely he'd have taken us down... I would have backed him for midtable with a striker and CDM cover in the summer... Maybe ralph suffered because of how good the team played when they were full strength and had a quality striker at the top end... For periods he had us playing like a European chasing team - some happy memories there. Its a real shame, because if we'd kept him we would very likely have stayed up - even if he was starting to show the strain of the fans turning and the good backing by SR. Now the writing really is on the wall, and unless the manager situation and fan toxicity is resolved PDQ, we're staring into an abyss. Anyway, it is done now, and Jones is certainly a car crash that the fans have entirely united against. I agree we could certainly do worse that reapproach ralph - Presumably we are paying his wages at the moment anyway? 😆🤣 But whoever we turn to, it would take a miracle to turn this squad / season around now. As a fanbase we will badly need to be more realistic for the next manager. We turned on a manager that would have kept us up, and then we've given his replacement (not that he is very likeable) no real chance... And now we have a unanimously toxic atmosphere amongst the fans and a fractured dressing room... There are precious few managers in world football who could turn that around...

Not a chance in hell i fear Clarke, not when you add in our Jan signings and DCC (who you neglected). We're in the shit if we go down. Would maybe have been okay prior to the panic buying this january, but SR have really scatter shat the toilet this past month - so when we go down with their beloved hand picked manager, we'll have a huge set of wages and transfer fees to cover... The result will be that if/when we go down, there will be massive player churn - we're living beyond our means this season and that will have to be cut hugely to meet championship revenues and the EFL's FFP regulations. People seem to be forgetting the circa £80M loan against the club as well... We were planning on adding value to our players and selling them for a profit... not covering for relegation's drop in incomes.