Chez

Pelle has lead the line brilliantly. Looks excellent. Tadic is a player. Those two just need a little more from the others around them. Total domination in terms,of possession. We just look a little lightweight against the long ball.

Think Pelle might claim the goal.

our support has never been huge of course, but London games usually sell out quickly. This therefore just shows how fed up fans are of being overcharged. Maybe clubs like West Ham will take the hint. Probably not though.

he will start scoring goals (which he would have done this season at Saints anyway IMO) and thus be seen as a completely improved player at united. Stay with us and I don't think his progression would have been any less great/obvious.

LVG was announced as the new Man u manager on 19th May and no doubt had been talking to United a while before then. I would guess United first came in for Shaw in January and have continued the pursuit since then, but he only signed officially on June 27th. I guess it all depends on how players are spotted/scouted/signed at united and whether there is committee like we have. How much input is there from LVG? Managers seem to be less and less involved these days. LVG probably was given him rather than requested him. If he didn't do thorough research on him before approving the signing, that would show him up as a poor manager in my book. They need two left backs or left wing backs. If Rojo is only seen as a left sided centre back of a 2 or 3, then they still need competition for Shaw.

http://www.dailyecho.co.uk/sport/saints/news/11191772.Away_the_lads_/?ref=mac Not sure why I give a **** seeing as he jumped ship (can't blame him), but the idea he wasn't fit enough at our place seems a little far fetched to me. He's built to last, that's for sure, but he seemed to have no problems sprinting up the line all day long. Perhaps a little tardy on the return visit a few times, but he certainly looked sharp as hell to me. Ray Wilkins on talk****e suggested this morning that LVG didn't fancy him, but there is not a chance that he was signed without LVG being asked if he wanted him. I'd be amazed if he has changed his mind after a few weeks of watching him before he got injured. If he doesn't can we take him back on loan a la Zaha please? The fact is he didn't play games and the training was obviously pretty light during the WC, and then he had time off straight afterwards to rest???, so it's hardly surprising that he wasn't at peak fitness when he returned to the United fold and was asked to go straight into games a little undercooked. He needed some extra training. So what. I would expect quite a large number of players that were in the world cup have been in the same boat. The only difference here is LVG decided to use Shaw to show the players what a big man he is (and that he rules the roost) by pulling up a £27m new signing in front of everyone. Hodgson seems to be trying to cover he arse here. Rather than admitting that "perhaps they failed to keep him fit during the world cup period, but its not easy when you have some players playing and some not" he has chosen to put the focus on the player. Maybe Shaw does fail to look after himself, I don't know, but he is a young lad and these two senior managers should no better than to be making comments like these. Fergie always looked to take the pressure and focus off the players and that seemed to work pretty well. As I said. If he ain't wanted there send him back.

Wonder how many we will take? Evening game sounds like fun to me.

Likewise. He looked really assured in the games I saw him play, all be it I think they were in the league cup against lower placed opposition. I've seen less of Reed, but until now he hasn't seemed better than Reeves. It will be interesting to see how both careers develop.

didn't think he needed to prove himself physically (whatever that means) in the prem myself. Yet to see anyone muscle him off the ball.

maybe his agent wants an absolute fortune in wages and until he lowers the amount there is nothing more to talk about. Just speculating of course.

and if last season is anything to go by, he will then be outstanding in pretty much every game making it impossible for the once sceptical manager to drop him.

Don't like him but on this occasion don't disagree with him. We could go down. Take five or six of the best players out of any other side in the league and all saints fans would be pointing at that side saying they will be one of the favourites to go down. Doesn't mean we will, but no point in putting your head in the sand.

Taken too much quality out of the side. Without that little edge we are are going to find it tough to beat teams. I don't agree with those that have been posting that we are almost as strong as last year. No where near as strong without Lovrens high quality and fast distribution. No where near as strong without Shaws penetrative long fast runs down the line and no where near as strong without Lallanas wizardry. I'm not convinced by JWP. Wanayama is a beast but we were incredibly show and boring with him in the side. Without the pace of Shaw and Rodriguez everything is played out in front of teams, and without Lallana and Lamberts subtle build up play we end up hoofing it. I am certainly a bit of a pessimist, but going into the season I thought we would be fighting for survival and having that miserable outlook at least prepared me for the worst. So I am not surprised by yesterday's display or outcome. Just hope things come together. Rodrigues returns for example, as one player really can change the balance of the side for the better.

I thought mentioning lack of pace was banned on here? But I agree with you. Defensively he doesn't put opposing players under pressure because he is too slow to get close to hither. He does make interceptions or tackles. That is my only criticism of him though and I suspect if the rest of his game keeps progressing then this element may become less important as it will be all about what he can do rather than what he can't. Right now though I'm not convinced he should start games.

The difference between the two seasons? That little bit of individual quality (by Shaw at their place) which has left our side. I keep reading that "we are almost as strong as last season" on here, but the truth is we are not, and that reduction in quality will have an effect in lots of tiny ways throughout the game that will all add up to just not quite winning or nit quite drawing some games.

Strange player and the totally polar opposite opinions on here show that. I like facits of his game. He has genuine pace. but he hardly ever seems to put it to good use. he has real composure with he ball at his feet. that composure seems to disappear when chances come his way. he has scored some terrific goals. some of the misses beggar belief. he is strong. he doesnt seem trusted to play with his back to goal. i dont think i have seen a player in ages that has had me stumped as to whether i rate him or not. maybe played week on week out up front he will shine. but not many players do after they are dropped by united. having said that oshea looks a far far better player at cb than he ever was at manure at rb and cm so maybe its just a settled position that is needed.

Won one. Drew two. Lost seven. Our record in prem games with Davis and Gazza between the sticks.

I'd quite like to see a thread on here showing all the cartoons from the various fanzines over the years. I didn't keep a single copy of any I bought so can't start one. Someone indulge me.

I know its pointless discussing it, but that's what a forum is for. Hull trying to get Rhodes with the Long money. I wonder if we will be comparing them for the next three years? I'm a big fan of signing the best from the league below, is Rhodes the best available from the championship (he certainly cored goals) as I haven't seen enough of him since his move from Huddersfield.

best player on the park against Spurs.

Could not agree more. Having players that can dribble can make a big difference both in attack and defence. Being comfortable on the ball and actually wanting to keep it no matter what pressure they are under enables the side to keep the ball, slow the game down (or speed it up if need be) and stop the ball from coming straight back at our defence. Lallana did it brilliantly for us, getting the ball all the time, keeping it, running with it (not just passing it) dragging players out of position and opening up space elsewhere. You also need dribblers with pace to stretch teams and put fullbacks on the back foot. Losing Shaw will hurt us over the season, but that blow could be softened by bringing in Townsend. A side needs pace and runners beyond the ball. When Rodriguez got injured that was lost from our game. Again Townsend can help with that.

Whenever I've seen Townsend on the box (mostly the UEFA cup games) he's looked pretty good. He dribbles well and his pace helps turn defence into attack. He is willing to get to the byline and shoot with either foot (although he's a genuine leftie). He does go up the odd blind alley, but equally he excites. Having said all that I loved Chicken George and Michail Antonio so perhaps I am not to be trusted here as I love a pacey winger that gets me off my seat even if too often I have to sit back down again without seeing an end product. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GWdYcH0kCMk

Are we being used to help Townsend get a fat new contract from Spurs, or indeed is Townsend being used by Spurs to bring us back to the table regarding Morgan? I suspect either way we won't be able to pin this one down.

you won't find a single WBA fan willing to give him any sort of recommendation. Complete and utter waste of money is the likely reply should you ask them about his loan there last season.

I agree it seems like a Koeman's call, but will have been based on advice from people within the club. A very poor decision indeed.