buctootim

The hands poke you in the eye when you get make a call as well

Does the cabinet / shadow cabinet really need to be 31 people? Im pretty sure they only ever used to be 13 or 14.

Its a pity the referendum has precipitated this challenge now. Ideally it would have been in a year or two, giving time for some strong unifying candidates to have emerged. None of the candidates filled me with much hope last time.

Way off. Any Conservative leader who triggers article 50 will only be able to rely on a fraction of a fraction of the electorate - and will be unelectable. Conservative supporters are only around 40% of the electorate and of that 40% 42% voted to remain - so only c23% of the electorate can be counted on to vote for them. To win an election they'd need to attract another 20% from other parties. It isnt going to happen. It will be fudged. Leavers wont get what they wanted, in fact next to nothing, but we will still have lost growth and credibility. congrats.

True. Im uncomfortable about some of his disloyalty - he should never have taken the job if he disagreed with Corbyn so much. I cant work out whether his father will give him an advantage or not. Working class cred, out of touch 'toff' or dangerous left winger? .

Lot of truth in that imo. By October, having peered over the edge and heard about planned job losses, support for Brexit will have ebbed into less than half. The leaders of the parties will be looking to the looming General election, knowing Triggering Article 50 will alienate the majority of the electorate.

The referendum was round 1. Another 14 rounds to go yet.

Benn has got to be a leading candidate for the leadership surely?

If you're upset with that, you ain't seen nothing yet. Wait till Brexit Boris gets into reverse gear.

As Whitey says 1) it was very close and 2) it was only advisory. Its perfectly reasonable under those circumstances to expect no major constitutional change without another vote - or at least a general election with clear manifestos before any implementation.

Its citizens. Has been since 1982. You didnt vote by any chance?

Give it a couple of years after a load of job losses and a fudge deal you'll hate and you'll be claiming you never really supported Brexit.

Dont need to - former chairman of the Tory party has the stats to prove it. http://lordashcroftpolls.com/2016/06/how-the-united-kingdom-voted-and-why/

I think one of the main reasons for the different results in London and Scotland is the media. Both have different and much less biased media. In the London the ES and Metro are the major papers, run by the guy who runs the Indie and in Scotland the Daily Record and Scottish versions of nationals have totally different editorial lines.

No - but there should have been some kind of 'honest, decent and true' standards applied to the campaign. We're going to end up like Norway - if we're lucky and they are magnanimous - everything the same except we dont get a vote.

Probably because the EU impose tariffs on Malaysian imports - that place where he makes his British vacuum cleaners.

Yep. What did it was realising that although there were good arguments for leaving it was only the fu cktards who were supporting leave and that there was no talent capable of making it work.

Well there's you, Wes and Sour Mash just on this thread. Must be enormous numbers.

Doesn't look scripted to me. An American addressing a British audience in Britain using a British word. Who'd have thought it possible? http://www.bloomberg.com/politics/articles/2016-04-22/obama-says-u-k-would-be-back-of-line-for-trade-deal-post-brexit

Seriously? We've swapped certainty for business with absolutely no idea what the future will bring. You reckon there are business CEOs who will be thinking, "I didnt want to invest when I knew what was happening but now its a leap in the dark I think its the time to risk my shareholders cash" He'd be out on his ear before the end of the board meeting.

Exactly. some form of associate membership could have avoided all this. I imagine the MEPs will be out once we formally withdraw, although the UK commissioner stepped down today as his position was untenable.

Germany needs Greece to continue in the eurozone because if they return to the drachma it will collapse against the euro and make Greece's euro debts impossible to service. Greece would have to default, that would bring down the German banks who lent them much of the cash, cost Germany tens of billions in bailouts and probably trigger recession in Germany. The situation with Britain is utterly different. There is discontent with the EU in lots of countries - just as there are groups in every country unhappy with their government - but its a minority. Nobody else is going to leave, they are still queuing up to join. We are uniquely badly led and informed.

Its simpler, but the power imbalance is greater. Even if it were 'quick' we're still talking a year or more, probably two to three. Thats a horrendous amount of time of uncertainty, fatal for investment. Companies abhor uncertainty because it msakes business planning impossible. They'll go elsewhere.

According to Tory MEP Daniel Hannan Cameron was offered a semi detached Associate Membership but turned it down. "Things could have been very different had the renegotiation resulted in a new settlement, one which allowed Britain to step away from the EU’s political institutions while remaining in the market. That deal was on offer, even from the most hardline Euro-federalists. Jacques Delors called it a “privileged partnership” for Britain; Guy Verhofstadt “associate membership”. Early in the process, I urged the Prime Minister to aim for such an outcome. He was, as he usually is, both honest and charming. That wasn’t the kind of deal he wanted, he told me. If it was what I wanted, I should ensure the election of a Conservative Government, thus getting the referendum, and then vote to leave. " http://www.conservativehome.com/thecolumnists/2016/06/daniel-hannan-today-for-once-we-can-choose-our-own-future-outside-the-eu.html

A disaster stopped from being a an utter catastrophe by the kindness of a German?