Dangermouth

That is exactly correct and has been said to be SFC's 'official' tactic. As many have said, however, this can 'translate' into a 433 reasonably easily and surely what we do require is tactical flexibility - preferably the players would be able to suss out what the opposition team are doing and counter it themselves as they are not playing American Football, but perhaps they do need to have things drilled into them other than the things you think they would need.

Agree. Unless the two wider midfielders compress space and/or drop behind Rom if he gets pulled forward/out of position we're exposing the defence. And not just the wings. That's why I made the comment about us being 'Arsenal-lite'.

I wouldn't consider it OTT: just an incorrect usage of the word.

Glad 'Le Goddard' is on here. Along with the other ITKs of course. I see CP as Arsene Wenger mark IV and thus SFC as Arsenal mark IV so we'll be attractive to watch with a soft underbelly and I don't really care about a 'big name' as such. Just that we win everything. What I am interested in is the 'new direction'. Something like setting up 'partnerships' with other clubs, moving the U23s as they are now along if they're not good enough (Turnbull/Mugabi, etc), abroad (Gazza, possibly Stephens) or on loan in this country and what else? That's much more interesting. Assuming anyone is 'allowed' to say anything that isn't PR-nonsense as seems to be the case, what can you tell us about how SFC now see themselves and how they intend to break into the big league of clubs?

What will be interesting will be seeing Shaw v Targett so we can compare the two directly and Shaw v Cedric so we can see how the latter copes. It will also be interesting to see if Romeu gets isolated a lot again. We'll also have had another week with the new formation etc, so should slowly be getting better with it. I see Turnbull has gone and apparently Stephens is slated to go out on loan abroad (cause he's quite a technical player, I believe) - source, other forums. As for JWP; I'd start him. Because he (and Targett, who is slow, can't defend, tackle well, cross particularly well, kick the ball well - he looks as though he has a tight adductor because he always slices the ball, never hits it cleanly - crosses from deep too much, can't dribble and plays it too safe too often) need to get 6 months' of games under their belts. JWP to start/Targett to be used more sparingly. So do the likes of Reed and Hesketh because we won't really know what they offer if they're not given the chance. If they stay around too long, however, the lot below will come through and they'll be squeezed out. So JWP (and possibly others) have until the end of this year to show they can perform adequately - the gulf in ability between JWP and PH is huge - or otherwise we should get rid so that next year we don't crap ourselves about going to MU because we believe our team is good enough to beat them. It should be as it has done recently.

I've gone back and looked at it. I would concur with Garrett.

Thank you. Puel sounds much better on mute. I don't expect the monotone to change: he's French and that's their diction but I do expect his English will improve as you can tell he will continue to work on it.

See no reason to mention politics. Are you the kind of person who would never forget the one person who looked at you and keep a shrine to them? No? Then perhaps keep it to football. As you say it was one game. It got better when they went down to 10 men like Norwich last year. It had improved from a portion of the first half where it was, as someone described it, 'boys against men'. Against better teams or teams like WBA we are going to struggle much like we did today in places. The shining lights were Hojbjerg who is roughly the same age as JWP, has played the same the same number of games but already is playing at a standard that the latter will never reach (but let's give him another season so we can say he's had 4 different managers to get something, anything out of him), VVD and Tadic. I remain to be convinced by Redmond but he did take his two goals well, even if he did just drift offside for the 2nd. I can't see Clasie getting a game or being effective in that formation in this league, it doesn't help Davis much and Long isn't that good with his back to play as he showed in the first half. I do tend to agree that it does not play to our players' strengths and despite the high number of shots we had, how many were on target, how many were from good positions in the box and how many really good chances did we get? Even if the game did peter out into attack v defence, you would have to say the defence won as the attack didn't score. We won't really know about the formation and CP until they've been tested through the Winter when we have played many league and cup games so let's see if we can do well enough up until mid-February to know what we're looking at. Cedric was **** and I'd wait until then too to see if he can actually play sufficiently well over a period of games to warrant a new contract.

From recollection. Played at Celtic with VVD for a bit. VVD had to carry him. Not rated in Scotland. Stuck in ManC reserves with the likes of Mangala ahead of him. No thanks.

Pedant (or not) alert: It's "Its" FFS. On pleasanter matters. Good stuff. Hope he has a consistently good season making defenders look stupid.

Targett is easily-led and Reed is an obvious candidate to do the leading.

Who gives a toss about their 'profile'? They have to terrorise opposition defences, score and create a ton of goals which will be especially important this year as lots are likely to be scored by the Manc teams as well as others, stay many years, not be an arse, etc.

Has anyone who commented after this actually read the analysis? It sounds good but how it plays out is another thing. I have tended in the past to agree with the claim that: Better players = better likelihood of success as I think have most. What I do dislike about it is that our best goal threat can/does become ineffective in it and that JRod needs a run of games at this level. He wasn't great according to many who posted here when he first arrived and had to grow into the team and with 10 mins here and there and playing for the U23s he's just being wasted. If course, some people expect him to suddenly become a revelation after 10 minutes, but ... . In that case I'd rather just sell him and Austin so that they get game time which they need and we don't have them sitting on the bench as I don't consider that either are or will be particularly good as a substitute and I suspect they'll not be happy about it. If JRod does go out on loan as someone has said, but said it should be the league below, why that league? It won't develop him: he's past it. He'd need to go to a taxing league abroad (France, Germany) and the chances of that are slim to none. As a further comment on Austin he has 2 goals so far as has Redmond in 1st team games, but one has played much more and in a system that gives him the ball and plays to his strengths i.e. it allows him to dribble at opponents and the changes of formation (this also includes RK's tenure) do indicate that LR's comment that 'We play 433 throughout the club because it allows the greatest flexibility and possibility to adapt to and change into other systems quickly and easily" made some years ago was rubbish. The only thing that happens is that (at least) the 2 senior teams mirror each other as this is likely to make switching from the lower to the higher far easier for reasons which should be obvious. It also undermines the comments stating that while the manager may change, other things remain the same. As this is Saintsweb I will (have to) explain that by saying that if we now have a system that relies on quick players up front as opposed to a target man e.g. RL/GP then we do require different personnel which in turn affects both future recruitment and means we are left with players that might be or are 'redundant' and so they remain out of proper contention for the first team and this mirrors the old situation where a manager effectively determined strategy/playing style/recruitment heavily. Let's see how we do against Man U in the Friday game - I wouldn't read too much into Watford based on what their forums have had to say although the interesting thing to watch out for will be how/if Materazzi changes formation as it seems he likes several and will change this during a game to suit. One of the more interesting ones is 343 with the only constant being that he likes 3 at the back and then splits what happens above that line. Finally, for those interested (or who watched a lot of French football), what systems are deployed there, how effective are they, how effective were Nice against the different systems, how good were they against the good/better teams, how good against defensive teams and how would they have done had Ben Arfa not had a blinder? The point being that while PSG would do very well were they to play in the PL, they wouldn't walk it like they do in France and if they'd drop off given how Nice =/= PSG if we had brought over last year's team and transported it into the PL how likely is it that it would have fared as well as we did? This does have to ignore the difference in the standard of player somewhat but does include it at least indirectly in that (we assume) overall the standard of player in the PL > that in Ligue 1.

See no point in going on a 'cup run'. More games for nothing. Win something or just don't bother. Winning things in sport does a lot to enhance the team/club so all this competing crap ultimately doesn't cut it. The article is poor. Consortium's mega-post is a novel at over 30 000 words and doesn't say much in the end. I think he tried too hard with it.

Guess Schneiderlin will be bench-warming a lot then. For those who know, how good is Pogba and how much is he likely to win Manure games? I think Shaw coming back is probably just as helpful to them.

Only able to see the highlights - propaganda (showing replays of missed half-chances) which suggests the club were trying to make the game look good. From what people have said on here (and the thread itself) the 2nd half seems to have been entirely forgettable. Ignoring possession, can anyone who went answer a couple of questions? How many clear-cut chances did we have? Where were they e.g. outside the area, in the middle of the 6 yard box etc, who did they fall to and how good were AB? Does the system mean that chances are likely to fall more frequently to e.g. S Davis than C Austin. The same but for half-chances. How much sideways/backwards passing is there? What type of team were AB - what I want from that is to know how many of the teams we will face in the league will play in a comparable fashion (e.g. short, quick passing and moving the ball on the deck, no crossing, etc)? Did any of the under 23s look any good/better than they have done previously? What about Targett (I wasn't happy with the comment Puel made in his interview when asked about Bertrand - it seemed very short and dismissive and then Puel went to talk about McQueen/Targett in the same breath as though they were comparable to Bertrand which plainly they aren't). Is there any indication that working with young players is a strength of Puel and that they are/could be capable of playing a stint of games if required? Who does the system not suit (e.g. Clasie, Austin. Tadic) and is there any indication that they could learn to fit it and play as well as, if not better, than they did last season? The usual caveats apply regarding Austin of course. I have the impression that Redmond flatters to deceive i.e. the end product isn't there and isn't likely to be. Were there any definite indications that this might not be the case? Hitting the post (btw) confirms my point rather than disproves it so anything along those lines won't make be sufficient. What are the weaknesses of the system e.g. even though we can have a good back 5 does it look as though we can be troubled by play behind the wing-backs, aggressive pressing, teams sitting deep, the defence being isolated and overrun by a quick counter (e.g. Leicester)? How did the pace of the game compare to a PL game? How is that going to affect the system that we play? Likewise, how will the midfield cope against greater numbers/more power and pace that is prevalent in the games we'll play? How is the midfield likely to function when the quite obvious cross-field balls to the wing-backs get snuffed out far more often than they seem to have been to date? Any other comments?

True Geordie's good cause he don't give a ****. Suggest you do the same (or keep the cock ups for your bloopers roll).

I find it interesting that an at best half baked rumour has made so many of you both so very insecure and apparently ready to fall on your swords because if it has been said by a 'source' it must be true. How do you even manage to have a ******* without being shown how to each and every time and having your hands held? A large number of people do really come across as being too incapable of even functioning and there's no hint of irony in what you say which indicates, to be honest, that you're pretty useless people. There are a number of comments to make about said 'rumour' , but the sensible thing to do is to simply treat it as such and ignore it, but sense seems to be something wholly outwith your capabilities to comprehend let alone exercise. I think the most sensible thing that the mods should do would be to simply lock the thread. It only seems to serve to support those with incontinence to continue to fail to do something about said condition. * Or is this the origin of the word 'bedwetter'?

Does a higher coefficient mean that though? We got done by Midtjelland last year and their coefficient wasn't better than ours. I don't think it matters what pot as we'll play a good side (pot 1) a pretty good, but beatable side (pot 2) and a not so good side (3 or 4) and if we want to progress we need to beat them all at SMS at the very least anyway.

Same here. You can tell that because the BBC are 'pushing' games at every opportunity as they do with so many things that no one gives a to$$ about.

Being the highly-intelligent, well-read and considered poster you are no doubt you will know everything that's been said on this forum in the last couple of months regarding the recruiting process and also in the past followed other pronouncements in e.g. the press that have indicated how it is the recruitment of players is carried out thus ensuring that you have identified one individual in a set up where it is continually stated that no one individual is key who is key and provided them with such a status that the company that employed him let him go and allowed him to take the keys to the kingdom with him. As an alternative, those of us who read can take on board the (presumably agreed) facts that the club do not act in that manner, that they scout a large number of players, that a decision regarding the prospective employment of playing staff is carried out en masse but with some input into the process by the team manager as has been evident by a degree of skewing of recruitment towards players who formally played under the current manager albeit that that can still exist under the current methods employed above because the methods are somewhat more comprehensive than your, dare I say 'knee-jerk' reaction, that the loss of one part of a machine to another club is not necessarily here nor there, that despite the team being crap against Groningen that that will not necessarily be the case throughout the year (we do all hope that), that having seen Hojbjerg it is quite clear he already is a good player and that Redmond undoubtedly has very quick feet (I think what's in his head is what counts with him), etc (it's getting boring repeating things that should be common knowledge assuming people actually can read this forum/other sources and be able to even do the basic thing of keeping it in their vacuous heads) and don't see the loss of one person who left for a massive increase in pay as the end of the world because (go back to the top, re-read again and repeat ad nauseaum). There are also indications from the ITKs (and a possibly new, genuine one) that a new player or two might yet arrive, a number of the u23s are to go out on loan and Jesus loves you. Ok, I made the last one up.

If you've seen anything of Hojbjerg and know anything about football you can see very quickly that even now he's a very good player and in no way a 'downgrade' on the card-magnet and sulk-merchant he replaced.

If he's a "Bayern reject", can we sign another 10 please?

They've had more chances, better play, the best chance and it's only since they're down to 10 that we've really pushed on. Against the calibre of team we will face we will struggle massively and do poorly if this level of performance is replicated throughout the season.

Against marginally better opposition and we look dog turd.