david in sweden

but that was his Dad ! and HE used to be an England player and one of the toughest defenders in the Leeds set-up with Don Revie in the 1970's. (LEEDS UNITED - Hard but fair !) ....if only WE were all as famous and talented as our fathers. Unfortunately.........the list of father-son duos who have both been successful in football in the last 50 years...... ......can be counted on the fingers of one hand. Are you listening, Nigel ?

Don't worry,Bailey, don't worry, you can't please everyone. IMHO...I think it'll be like this. MW already's employed as a coach so he's just moving up to fill the vacancy. (same as if JP was still here but ...had the 'flu and was off work) If he wins two games on the trot, he'll get the job permanently -- until the end of the season. Then ...there's another "re-think," depending on who the new owners are. If we continue on this downward spiral - he'll be out in a month and we start all over again, but most likely in administration. Anything else I can suggest to put your mind at rest ? what else can one say? COYR !!!!!!!!!

You missed the other threads..he's Hungarian not Dutch !

what a lot of good questions you have .... Shame... there aren't any good answers!

Well thats it then.. when all the Poles go home, it'll be the Hungarians next....... I wonder if .....Ferenc Puskas had any grandchildren...? well, one can hope...

ah well , it was a nice thought ...for a few minutes

you wouldn't believe the number of rich Russians around, as long as you don't ask them where their money comes from ........!! its OK.

Quite right! Wasn't Bent bought for about £18 million not so, long ago ...? in which case if his valuation as about the same...? If Jones is valued at £15mill, or £12 mill . and there is £5-6 mill difference ..? The " profit " would be around £6 -8 million ...if thats the case..then a sell-on clause would look very attractive- wouldn't it ?

Well, wait a minute there Stanley... it might not be SO wrong... this mysterious friendly game ...meant to be a exhibition game for a mystery overseas buyer....was v. aside called Upjest ??? sounded Hungarian to me, and apparantly the December article you quoted was just - that team. ODD TALE; During the 1970's when LEEDS were a top side, but never quite won anything, they used to end up playing Fairs Cup (now UEFA) matches every year and almost every time they ended up playing this side...Upjest Docza (or similar spelling) and who (according to Jack Charlton ) the Leeds lads use to call " uppsy - daisy "!! Wonder if there is money in Hungary to spare ..they are in the EU now, so no problems ( work permits etc, )...if we want to sign Hungarians anytime.

My Dutch isn't so hot, but it suggests that FC Twente, currently 3rd in their Premier League ( behind AX and Ajax) and with a healthy + goal diff. have a surplus of strikers. A permanent transfer would cost +/ - 600,000 €uros..? How much is that in REAL MONEY someone.?

.......Mmm?... not unless you count Denis Bergkamp and Rommedahl...! ...then of course, Ipswich had those two who ran their midfield so well for years.. (names escape me at moment...? (M........... and ???? )

I quite respected DJ, but to be FAIR - he would have due for the chop anytime as we were bordering on the drop zone when he was " relieved of his duties" and given gardening leave. I think we continued to pay him for some months afterwards before he finally left - and Hoddle had proven himself. At any rate, the pressure of being a Prem. manager fighting relegation and also having that court case hanging over him all that time must have been more than anyone could be expected to handle. We would surely have gone down that season had he stayed in charge.

.......and the Doncaster side.....(sorry to mention it everyone) ........are playing Aston Villa to a standstill at present (on cable TV here) 65 mins gone and still 0-0 goalie Sullivan playing great 71 mins. Villa CF on a lone run outpaces the defender ......and hits the bar. WOW ! did Doncaster play like this against us last week? Dons striker Woods hits the angle with a 25 yard freekick and Freidal beaten ... still 0-0 Great performance by Doncaster MOM Dons goalie Neil Sullivan Final score: 0-0 ..they'll never play that well in the replay at Villa Park.

..thats a bit hard, Nick ..if Swansea win the tie, we should give him a medal !

I hope that Michael Svensson isn't being " used " in this situation, but it sounded to me that Mark Wotte was somewhat shocked by JP sudden exit, and has to say YES to keep HIS job. Without a "buddy" to bounce ideas off he's going to feel isolated. Svensson is the closest we have to a " legend " in the last 10 years. He first signed in the summer 2002....and together with Lundekvam was surely one of the best centre-back pairings we've had in the last 30 years. Also had a few dozens international games for Sweden and captained them on a few occasions. I think he has good leadership qualitites, and is still highly-respected by Swedish fans - even though he hasn't played for several years. How do you GET TO BE.. an " experienced coach " ? An invite to Buckingham Palace ...and next day you're OK for the job. I think this type of situation sorts out those who have talent from those who have got " a name ". Several of the 1966 World Cup side "tried " management....Moore, Peters, Bobby Charlton were all short-lived and only Jack C. and Ball lasted any length of time - but never at the highest level. Recent appointment of: NIGEL Clough reminded me of his famous father, BRIAN, one of the most prolific post war strikers, who horribly broke a leg aged 28 and never played again. Similar case with Steve Coppell, a fine winger who was clogged into retirement by frustrated defenders whom he made fools of every game. Both later put their aggression and enthusiasm into managing good sides. I just wonder if Svensson's injury history may have given him a similar determination to be successful..OFF the pitch ?...we'll see !

EXACTLY RIGHT ANDREW, at least we got to see the current Academy squad get a "real try-out", and see their potential. RL sold JP short by not giving him a few more experienced heads to help out these young lads. Without Svensson, Euell and at least one of the "out-loaned " strikers we're on a hiding to nothing every week. Tough luck, Jan.

You have one of the more polite comments on this thread, though I agree with you. JP is an honest man, who thought he could do the job - but not with the squad he had to use. At least we did get to see the Academy lads perfrom, but they can't do it every match. (not unexpectedly). The irony is - if our away from had been at HOME then we would half expected the AWAY results to look like our home form, however, without Svensson, a " functioning " Euell and - at least one of the loaned strikers -, we're on a hiding to nothing almost every match. I DO like the " Dutch " style of play but the squad we have is far too inexperienced to do it justice. Lowe shouldn't have allowed JP to take on the task without letting him buy in a bit more experience in August instead of trusting to luck with lots of not -so-special loan players. Only Cork was worth keeping - and he didn't want to stay ! I feel sorry for JP - but thats the price you pay -isn't it.

Yes Nick , that was only the start... not forgetting the loss of BOTH Anders Svensson AND Matt Oakley - (if only we'd kept one of them). Mazza got too old. Michael Svensson's later injury was catastrophic as was Marian Pahars demise. We never found a good winger after Fernanades went, and never found a replacement of Beattie's calibre after he left. It's not just a case of giving someone else a vacant shirt number -is it ?

..yes I agree ! ....and where are the queues of fans who wanted to get shot of him last season, eh ?. You can't blame keepers alone for every goal that goes past them, and KD has had more than his fair share of critics before..now that he's playing better than ever...everyone calls him hero. Even in the heady days of the mid 1980's ..when our goalie was a certain PETER SHILTON... we still had a negative goal difference at the end of several seasons, and on one occasion Shilton stood in goal and we lost 0-7 away. Even the VERY best can't avoid criticism. NO, I'm not saying KD is as good as...!!!! I'm glad he's still here. Good thread Big Bald Si ........and well done KD

Agree with that MOM! If that were the case, then why did the club print the big " I love Saints till the death " item on todays OS.? NO !.. that's just a space filler because they're short of adverts on that page. I wouldn't believe the People -if they told me they printed on a Sunday !

......even from this distance, it looks good...except McG has more shots /goals than anyone else in the side. I dread saying he is the in -form player, but he's got most goals. I'd certainly play BWP (as a sub.) 75% of his goals last season came when coming on as change player in the second half. We've got a bit more guts up front with Saga, and I agree, as long as we still have Euell and Skacel we must play them. Either of them has more experience than most of the current midfield put together.

This is the LAST "good " side we can really make GOOD comparisons with ..like McMenemy's 1984 side and the earlier promotion side. I think the real problem was that for various reasons that 2003 Cup Final team had " peaked " as a squad. Some key positional changes were needed and Gordon wasn't there to make them. The procession of his short term successors didn't know the squad and made short term (mostly) poor changes. BT, Niemi, Svensson, Mazza and Bridge were on top of their game and really good. Lundekvam (earlier an impeccable player together with Svensson) had his life's nightmare game against Theirry Henry (who wouldn't ?) and it took a whole year for this very likeable guy to get some real confidence back again, but we had no reliable replacement meantime. As for the rest; both Telfer and Ormerod - tireless and brave - were never really upto the top standard. Neither Anders Svenson or Matt Oakley, two very different midfielders, proved they could do much better - in other sides that used their qualities properly - and Chris Baird (our MOM in Cup Final) for many people (supposedly Doddsy replacement,) didn't get a real chance again for another two seasons. He would have been even better had he been allowed to start the next season instead of rotting in the Reserves. YES hindsight is great but managers with vision are few and we 'ain't seen too many of late. Despite the terrible run of results, for me the jury is still out on JP. What kind of side MIGHT we have in the second part of the season - if we could sign another ageing Ballie, or Case or Rodrigues (to help the young lads) before the end of the month, Rupert ?

........which is precisely why neither Burley or Pearson played so many of the lads in the first team at any one time............JP has had no choice. He got Rupert Lowe and no transfer funds ...and the blame for bad results when in fact the lads he's using are doing their sometimes, limited best !

Absolutely right, Chez. The problem is that players like Surman, are on the way up and haven't really " impressed " everyone enough yet. In 1-2 years he'll be closer to his peak, but it still won't get him in the World Cup squad (!) - unless he's with a top Prem. side, by then. Fans are quick to judge on a bad game or an indifferent season..what a good job we didn't listen to those who wanted to get rid of Kelvin Davis !!! When we look back at a whole career it's easier to judge, but on a month to month basis there are some fans who would sack the whole team three times a season. As for GILLETT......He looks tough in the tackle, despite his lack of height and muscle. (Hope we don't get managers in the future who look at the lad and say he's to short for the team.) ...not to make the criticism of Lawrie Mac too personal, (because I respect him) but he must have been sad he let little guys like Kevin Phillips and Dennis Wise off the hook when one considers their later careers - because we never got anyone else with their qualities - except maybe Ballie, but that was at the tail-end of his career. GILLETT has potential, (IMHO) and we need to keep him AND Surman. You can afford players like Schneiderlin to bring a bit of classy midfield play to a good side, at present we are struggling too much...and just now he's TOO young. I'm sure he'll have a great future - if we'd had him in the post Cup Final side, when changes were being made he's have shon like a star.

Won't get lost on details in your piece..... sandwich saint, .......but I agree with you about OAKLEY. The manager of the day..(who was that BTW ?) decided that he wasn't 100% after his long lay-off and only offered him a one-year contract, and so he went. Don't blame him either. Though hardly world class, I thought he was the sort of dependable type we needed in midfield. Maybe lacked the versatility of Nick Holmes, or the ****y aggression of Steve Williams - but he was good enough at the time. BUT my lasting memory of OAKLEY will be the continuous criticism he got from some fans who really didn't want to like him. I'm sure that had he been a fans favourite, he might have stayed and then he would have fared better. Instead we got Prutton, who - when he wasn't injured - was serving out suspensions (though 10 weeks was a bit much IMO and helped relegate us). Good to see SURMAN on a short suspension, (WHAT ! ..not because we'll lose him for ONE game,) but the fact that he's got enough yellow cards to show the fans that he's playing hard, in the thick of it, and got the refs. attention, as well as the guys he "stopped ". All our best midfielders didn't have " suspension-free " careers, either. Huxford, Walker, Gabriel, O'Neil, Case, Mazza - but they did their job.