david in sweden

Well John B, I don't disagree with you, but I meant that its the sum I thought we might get.......not necessarily how much they are worth. There are lots of deals going through for ridiculous amounts and I can'r see how they can be " worth " £10 £15 or £20 million - but clubs still pay it. I don't think anyone is worth £50 million .......or even £100 million, but at least someone has been considering it recently. If I were a business man I'd ask - how can I recoup £10 or £20 miiion -unless I re-sell them for a higher fee ? The £15 million Spurs paid for Bent last season was a typical example....unrecoverable investment the guy is kass ! As for Surman.......he must be worth at least £2-3 million or so ..with a 25% sell on clause, or a bonus if/when they get promotion. Don't let's sack Rupert Lowe until he's done that deal, it's his style. (The sell-on clause for Crouchie gave us a bit extra didn't it ?)

Surman is on record as saying he doesn't WANT to move, but in this situation we need every pound, and if Reading want him ....then he'll be going for sure. FEE: £2 mill.........or 3 ?? or, something with a loan player involved ?

IMO the Baird sale, while unexpected, was even more remarkable for the fee that we got. Whoever negotiated that really did a great job. I would have thought something closer to £1 mill. I don't think he is really top Prem.class but he's as good as Fulham are likely to get. The Bale deal looked good, and he was OK going into a good /average side (which is what Spurs were then) NOW in a struggling side he's got a problem getting a game. HE looked good going forward (with Saints) but many people saw that he wasn't a top class defender, but as an attacking left-sided player he was exciting. Players don't become top class because they get signed by a top side, as so it was with Bale.

Yes of course, Mike but looking at some of the sides we've put out during the Autumn there were a lot of " former " Academy lads used this season. However, my point was that (unlike) many other CCC players last seasons Academy lads weren't used to playing many games each season, and not anywhere this level. Not even Reserve football -but youth team football.

Absolutely right, but if you consider those we're playing, at least half-a-dozen were Academy regulars last season, playing around 20 games a season and maybe getting a place on the Reserve bench - if they were lucky. SUDDENLY..they are playing two matches a week, and faced with a 46 match season, they can hardly be expected to perform in the same way every match, especailly against some of the bully boy teams in this league. It's just gonna take time, and we don't have too much of that. and worse IF JP goes, ay new manager will expect them to convert to another system and have to use players who aren't suitable. Another " Pearson " would bring in journeymen and 30-plussers and the lads would all go back to the Academy.

Absolutely, I've spent many frustrating years watching crosses go by the far post with no-one in sight. The rare exception was Alan Shearer (in his later career,) who could always pop up inside the 6 yard box at the far post, which was inevitably unguarded and as easy pickings for a goal poacher.

Favourite Goal, don't you mean list of favourites ?. I've always been fond of the long distance efforts; Ivan Golacs rocket from the right wing. Brian O'Neils shot into the Milton goal (though he was JUST inside their half at the time.) Nick Holmes' incredible strike into the same goal and any number of efforts from MLT, but especially v. Blackburn - leaving Tim Flowers on his a** in the back of his net. No sorry - I can't isolate JUST one..and in a way I'm glad 'cos it devalues all the other great goals by players who don't score so often. For the one goal of his career - you'd have a job to better Frannie Benali's.

It all look easy on paper doesn't it.Speaking of which, I'm almost at the end of Constant Paine, and what a good read it is! It is of course, or much of it at least, about Terry Paine's fantastic ability to deliver a cross into the near post and the strikers knew exactly where to run without looking, so accurate was the Paine centres. It's easy to blame our strikers for the lack of goals (who else is there ?) but a lot of THEIR success is down to the service they get. Ron Davies admits he was only an average striker when he joined Saints in 1966, but TP's service gave him so many opportunities to score and he ended up beating JImmy Greaves and Geoff Hurst as leading scorer that season. Even after he was dumped by Lawrie Mac (aged 35) he continued at Hereford and got them promoted by way of the huge goal tally by the almost legendary Dixie McNeil (who was leading scorer in the whole country that season) WHAT CAN WE LEARN FROM THAT ? Old tactics but maybe it just might work...TP says two wingers are a real luxury that no team can afford to play without wingers all. There is no-one to take on defenders and it's down to the long ball up the middle. Surman, or Smith, or Lallana or SOMEONE has to play wide, run at defenders and know how to centre to the near post. As long as McG and Saga can get in the box we're surely get better results than we do know. The real problem is ; everyone likes attactive football and Saints have tried to play that for much of the last 50 years, but the truth is without a few hard men in the defence and a midfielder with a tough attitude; Gabriel, O'Neil, Fisher, Case or Mazza...our Academy Lads don't stand a chance against some of the bully-boy teams in the CCC. The thing that is most against JP's success is that he doesn't understand the tactics/ problems of the division we're in. I like his style of play (there's not enough of it-barely 45 mins. at a time) but it's more suited to the Prem.style and not the tough weekly slogging matches we've had this season so far. Back to basics. One fast winger , playing wide and good centres into the box. If we can't score from that - maybe we don't deserve to be here anyway.

maybe looks good but most of these have been sacked from teams not performing much better than we are.........and besides they'd never work for peanuts as it seems JP is doing. He seems to have some pride, he's carrying the can and I don't think he's openly criticised his players after bad results - has he ? AT least the man is showing some honour, meantime *arry is blaming all his big money Spu*s team for everything and everyone except the Groundsman !

whereas he doesn't speak the Queens English, JP always appears with fighting talk and he hasn't once blamed Rupert Lowe for dealing him the sh*tty hand that he's forced to play........turning the Academy lads into a CCC first team in ONE SEASON. I'm sure he likes the challenge but the home form has really screwed him, whereas our away form is as good as any mid table side. There are other teams in this league who have far more experienced squads than we have, who aren't performing much better than we are. No-one can deny that the absence of Svensson in the back line is surely the reason for defensive lapses, and the fact we had three "class strikers " who went out and loan and didn't perform any better than the lads we used up front is also not gone unnoticed. Thank God Davis is in such good form otherwise we'd be below Charlton. For better or wor*e, I think we'll stick with JP and the same coaching structure, and expect Rupert Lowe to find SOME funds (from somewhere) to find us another striker and more cover at the back. Meantime SURVIVAL this season (given all the above,) would be a real achievement and I would give JP a special medel if he achieves it , 'cos he will have "achieved more" in relative terms in creating THIS team, than would Alex Ferguson - if Man U win the Prem.

'fraid so, it looks like a positive, somewhat sentimental, interest story (wonder who did the interview)..but it beats " I'm glad Watford gave me a lifejacket, because the iceberg was in sight " type of comment, but the next time he's at SMS (if ever) - you might hear the follow-up interview; " I recall the great times I had here as a young player and the help I had from one of your previous coaches ..what was his name ?..that Dutchman. It's still a nice ground, a pity that we beat you by such a big score today !" Having (somewhat cynically) got that out of my system if, by some miracle we survive, and the relegated Watford go down ; I'd take him back like a shot. Best young centre half we've seen since Mark Wright.

Indeed it is, and the loosely concealed " support " from RL is actually the " kiss of death " for the Dutch trainers. I recall the comment from many years ago, whenever a " soon-to-be-sacked " manager was given a vote of confidence by the Board of Directors, he was usually out of a job within a fortnight. Sorry Jan, I really liked your efforts and it's helped the Academy lads develop a lot quicker than they would have done before, BUT.. sadly there was no-one there to put away all those half chances.

Do we mean " IN their prime." ..or " at their peak " ? Good players, really good ones... play on and on, and age very slowly. Terry Paine was slowly going downhill as a winger when he reached 30, but found a new lease of life in midfield after 32 and only left when Lawrie ditched him when he was 35, but still played on with Hereford. Channon got the push when he was 34 but moved on to Norwich and a Wembley final when 37. We got Ballie and Jimmy Case late on in their careers and they were still playing past 37. Goalies of course mature late, Shilton was still top class at 40. As for the young ones; shooting stars like Owen and Rooney looked like young gladiators when they were in their teens but looked burned out already. Sadly, one of the greatest names (George Best) had played his finest football before he was 26...and even MLT had his glory days before 30. For me, Bellamy has never really had a prime, he's moved a bit too often and everyone hopes he might make it - next time. Bit like Dean Saunders and Robert Earnshaw - continues to show promise but have no consistancy. Hoddle is probably right he (Bellamy) might make it if he finds the right club manager to " mother him along ", but I can't see one just now.Tony Adams seems to be recruiting layers he can rehab, or get through AA contacts, but it takes a special talent to do that and you can't have too many in one side.

I agree with that Andy, After having a loan player like Jack Cork who then moved on - " losing " any good player is the same as them breaking a leg (!) namely, they aren't there to select. If we sold anyone and made money, it would help our financial survival which is the primary concern this month. Even if we had players like the classy, but injured - Michael Svensson or the highly paid but equally invisible Jason Euell - where is that man ? We might just as well be without them as they are no good to the club unless they are out their giving their 99% every match. However, I don't see RL changing his manager - where else could he get anyone for that price ? We probably paid Doddsy more than JP is getting. Any new manager would demand money for players and import his veteran cronies from his past life. Most of the unemployed managers around are on the dole for one reason. They could only manage ONE club, usually the one they started with and since then they've all been utter failures- name who you like; One hit wonders - all of them ! ..........and certain not to be any use to us right now. I think we have no choice but to stick with JP - Rupert Lowe would surely not sack yet ANOTHER manager.! I'd be prepared to see almost anyone leave just now - except Kelvin Davis as I don't think either of the other lads are any sort of replacement for him.

Am inclined to agree with you. If it was down to heart and commitment to the club Nick would be top of the pile. The only Southampton-born player to have captained the side on a regular basis, FA Cup winner and third only behind Channon and Paine for apps. BUT...you could say that Doddsy had the heart for it but let's face it neither of them has really set the Confrence sides alight.

I'm sad about it as well but this is the first reasonable assessment of the situation. JP was given the task and no other options but to use the Academy lads. Bravely 'though they try, they are no match for this league bully boys who come with an organised game plan to shut us out. Someone has to take the blame and it wwon't be Rupert Lowe, JP's situation doesn't look good - does it ?

the whole idea of a first team WITHOUT Ron Davies is ridiculous! Although both Paine, Channon and MLT have scored more goals over their 16 YEAR careers with Saints, Ron's goal tally of 134 in barely 6 seasons is fantastic by comparison, and he must surely be the highest scoring no.9 (an out and out CF) and second only to the legendary Bill Rawlings in 1920's. How can he be omitted. I can only assume the poll has been voted on by many fans who are too young to have remembered him.

......might well be the case, but I was only suggesting a trial for old time's sake .... it's not always a case of being a bad player, it helps a lot of they are happy at the club and he clearly wasn't at Derby.

Well I thought that but with so much having happened in the last couple of years, it might easily have been overlooked. As someone said later, Rupert Lowe tried a lot of ways to keep him, maybe someone should drop a word to RL....especially as he (RL) would have to OK any eventual signing, he might feel inclined to let JP know about Andrej's past.

...has apparently been on loan from Skonto Riga with DERBY since july, (according to a short piece in Team Talk) (but hardly played at all) and is being released by new manager Nigel Clough. Thinking back a few seasons the lad was a star player in our Academy ranks but was refused a visa to continue his stay in UK (and with Saints) -because of a controversial clause in Home Office rules that seem to apply only to US - ( but not with players who were going to join Man U or Arsenal.) Have no idea how he has progressed but if there is ANYONE surviving on the SMS staff who remembers this fella and can tip JP - he must be worth a look I recall they always said he did have a soft spot for Saints.

YES and look who's above us ! Chelsea ..only - £736 million, Arsenal a "poor " second with -416, and Liverpool with - 350 million . Why ever do we call them the " rich clubs " ? It's only money their directors have conned out of some stupid bank, and however do they expect to pay that back ..or do they ? Just how many rich Saudi oil men are there to go round ?

Agreed, but I still get back to my two favourite topics; statistics and ... luck. ..of the SIX home defeats, FOUR have been by only one goal margins. one goal in these games would have given us 4 more points instead of NONE. ..of the SIX drawn games, one more goal in each game would have won it for us giving us 12 points more. Totalling 16 points more (would be 42, thats 8th spot-presently C.Palace) and in shouting distance of a play-off spot, as our away record is already BETTER than half the other teams in this league. NOW is the point in time that everyone mails back and calls me an idiot, by saying that we ought to be in 8th spot.. I'm not BUT according to the FA website Saints (despite their low goal tally) have had MORE SHOTS ON GOAL than almost everyone else in the division. In fact McGoldrick has one of the highest counts of shots. YES -we have poor marksmen, although " inexperienced " would be a better word. IF LUCK has any part in football, which it obviously does, then at some point in time the reverse situation will help us. (I'm still sounding stupid to some of you,) because this rational isn't going to change the table now, but with better luck -we will turn it around, wait and see.

RUBBISH ! ........you tell 'em Andrew, its........ FOOTBALL !!! (only don't tell the Americans that,) they think .......... but it's really rugby.

...........and even Jimmy Melia and Bruce Grobelaar (from an earlier era.)