Nineteen Canteen

Have been going through some of my old vinyl and sorting it alphabetically. Reminded me why back in our day we didn't need games consoles to keep us in our bedrooms for hours on end just the Dewey system and a healthy collections of LPs. Anyway I came across some of my original Groundhogs albums and it seems some of them are worth a few bob - who needs a SIPP? Blues Obituary and Who Will Save the World from the Mighty Groundhogs seem the most valuable and no doubt the 30 year old sellotape repair to the gatefold comic insert to the latter can only enhance it's value. Hogwash remains a favourite though and the briliiant 3744 James Road. I also came across a Greenslade album. Someone please enlighten me, Block 5, maybe my best bet as to wtf were Greenslade? I almost came across it literally as inside I found a nostalgic copy of Parade obviously hiidden in a Greenslade gatefold safe in the knowledge no one would ever go there including me it seems. Bit annoyed really as it beat Womans Own hands down not to mention the occasional copy of Custom Car I was able to purloin from my Brothers bedroom.

Watched a 1970's cultural masterpiece yesterday afternoon on C4. It really portrayed life in Britain in the 1970's and how as a nation we were dependent on the nuclear family, the stereotypes, the message that Britain was as pure as the driven snow and our humour was more Chaplain than Marx but we were already well aware of the fight against pollution. A fine piece of cinema and hunting through the awards I'm surprised this fine film full of kitsch and pathos did not receive a single gong.

I agree completely perhaps the thread should read will our slim play off chances last till the derby and do our fans really care about the two critical league games in between or has the focus of their attention permanently turned eastwards?

I haven't felt myself for a while.

I think you'll find that you read my post and missed some reasonable points prefering to concentrate on my past support for Lowe when in the absence of new buyers he was IMO Hobson's Choice from 3. I would no more sugest Lowe is better than Cortese than I would suggest you have an opinion of your own and serve only to mock those who offer a reasoned argument. You are correct in saying Mr Cortese's piece was not the most humble (an understatement if there ever was) and neither should it have been but neither did it have to be so self-aggrandizing as Saint Bletch so expertly captured the essence of his rhetoric IMO. Dubai Phil recently suggested that the best CEOs have two ears and one mouth and should manage their companies using those valuable tools in that ratio. IMO, Mr Cortese may have a wax build up in one ear as he is obviously hearing / reading what the Echo are reporting and IMO no doubt encouraged by the loud vocal support of a 100 or so passionate fans blinded to the underlying implications of banning the local press. The Echo are still I suspect selling many more thousands of their paper and receiving hits on their internet site than the vocal acceptance of everything the club are saying. Good times which we now have or in bad, we must have a free press who are able to comment and inform as they see fit otherwise should (I believe that is an unlikely should) occur in the future the first we hear about it is a message from the club.

Not just the MK game that will be swept away in a sea of pompey bile but our faltering league progress. Had it not been for the Pompey game the Brentford match would not have passed in whimper and we would be discussing extensively the Stockport and Exeter games. Given our league aspirations and their lowly status these are must win games not the Pompey game. By Valentines Day some of us may wake up and find a critical stage of the season has past us by unsuccessfully in a blue malevolent mist of our own making.

Good post. As usual people's willingness to take things at face value astounds me. On the one hand we refuse to accept the line from the Echo as it's one sided and yet Mr Cortese issues his statement and it's taken on board like it's the 5th Gospel as oppose to just his report on proceedings. Can both sides be right? Probably because sometimes IMO the answer lies in what is not communicated publicly. As Duncan points out none of us know our new owners personally and like us and like big corporate companies they will have a public and private persona / agenda. The spat between Murray and Cortese needs to be sorted to stop these stories from surfacing and distracting the fans and more importantly the club from the great work they have done to date. IMO banning the Echo is a PR disaster and if any of us were in a position where you felt wronged by an individual or company and had the opportunity and ability to fight back in a legitimate way, would you? Murray's style maybe wrong but the initial principal that we want our paper to report on our club good and bad remains a prerequisite.

+1 I would also add to Gingeletiss post that I don't think for 1 minute that those voicing concerns are not grateful for their involvement but neither should that be used as an excuse not to challenge matters that concern some of us. The Honeymoon doesn't last forever and requires hard work and commitment from both sides and occassionaly things will go wrong that shouldn't be ignored just because of their investment. Lets not forget an investment that is being designed as a vehicle for a decent return on that original investment and to protect it they have a duty of care to us as fans and we need to continue to prove our support which we are doing to encourage them to stay. That does not mean we need to be compliant little people when a decision goes against the grain in my IMO, Messrs Cortese and Liebherr are not acting charitably they are businessmen.

Correct, he would need to sell us first. Unfortunately, Mr Cortese does not give the impression that he is the type of character to cede on his decision regards the Echo so the spat that has caused this discussion to escalate is likely to continue and that cannot be good for anyone when love it or loathe it the Echo IMO occupy the higher ground on the original issue. We have a free press in this country and it is something we have fought wars over to protect and IMO it is an error of judgement on the part of the club to ban the Echo and they need to give in and move on.

That's fair enough Wes but the point I was trying to make was is Mr Cortese as indispensible as some our making out and if he moved on I am sure you'll agree that Mr Liebherr would be able to recruit an equally impressive and demanding CEO. I didn't really want or expect an answer to my question. It appears from his statement today that without Mr Cortese , Mr Liebherr would have never pulled us from the mire and I got the impression that should Mr Cortese leave in the future then Mr Liebherr would not want to hang around either. That does make Mr Cortese indispensible and in the absence of a statement from our actual owner I think a genuine cause for concern. We love a quote don't we so here's an apt one from W.Somerset Maugham: 'It is bad enough to know the past; it would be intolerable to know the future' Perhaps we should all stop analysing and fretting and enjoy the ride for as long as it lasts.

IMO its not the use of his paper that is an error of judgement but more to do with the style/tone of the articles where Murray maybe getting it wrong. On the other hand it is a major error of judgement IMO by Cortese to try and control what is published in the local paper as alleged and it is in all our interests that anyone in the media have a freedom to report and comment on what is in the public domain. Giving Solent local media rights basically means they have full access to matchday commentaries and such like and reporting to us what they are told by the club. What Solent are unlikely to do IMO is to challenge or investigate things like the decision making at the club, the pros and con's of transfer activity, and so on. There is a principal at stake here and regardless of Murray's style at the moment IMO he occupies the higher ground and Cortese's silence is an error of judgement on his part IMO. Mr Cortese has served us very well, better than we could have dreamed of in fact but that does not mean he will get it right 100% of the time and maybe this is one of those rare occasions looking at it from the outside in.

Should we be worried by this? On balance the answer has to be yes IMO and I am concerned by the self-congratulatory tone and an ego even bigger than the one before has seemingly landed. Had the article been written by an independent source then I would take a lot of comfort from what is being said but Mr Cortese gives me the impression that if he doesn't believe in god then god believes in him and as rhetoric goes, 'self- aggrandising' is a very good way of putting it. The last thing we need is another impenetrable egotist at the helm of the club especially if Mr Liebherr is only investing at Mr Cortese's bidding. What Mr Cortese has orchestrated at the club is miraculous but I would suggest he could not have so readily acheived that success without Mr Liebherr's substantial backing whereas Mr Liebherr I'm sure could find another Mr Cortese and one that would be a little more magnaminous about his achievements. It is disappointing that whilst recognising the speculation about the approach of a 'big club' in Italy and wanting reassure the fans of his intentions to stay at Southampton he did not consider it worthy to mention the banning of the Echo, which to some remains a concern because of the underlying implications, perceived or otherwise, that banning the press suggests. I firmly believe in the freedom of speech and to try and manage what gets reported as appears to be alleged is worrying and Mr Cortese's somewhat conceited message does nothing to allay those fears IMO.

Is it solely down to Mr Cortese or the financial backing of Mr Liebherr? Do you think for example that Mr Cortese could have saved the club this time last year without the financial backing and saved the plc and its creditors and shareholders from their losses? I have worked for a few chairmen who could also have performed well in Mr Cortese's role without any debt to service or post takeover hostilities to overcome. If he moved on it would be a loss but not an irreplacable one unless he persuaded Mr Liebherr to do likewise.

Pathetic or not that is a matter of opinion but would you prefer not to know about what appears to be a strange action taken by the club? Not giving the local press access to the club surely fuels the fears of those voiced by Fitzhugh Fella and others. Murray has stated the facts and why has he had to restate them today? IMO Mr Cortese is fuelling the issue by remaining silent and that will only encourage conspiracy theorists. Bottom line if the media aren't given free reign to report on club related news we are reliant on being fed stories only the club want us to know and therein lies the rub of no longer being a publicly owned club and the point FF has made from the start. Is his point valid? Depends on the owners of course and so far I can only see positives and a long term commitment from Mr Liebherr but blocking access to the local paper is highly questionable IMO and perhaps Mr Liebherr needs to step in because the club can do without any bad press especially when in the main it is not warranted considering how far we have come in the past 12 months. The Echo have stated their case surely this will only be resolved by Mr Cortese letting down the drawbridge with or without comment. In the meantime I remain interested in what the Echo have to say, if anything.

I wouldn't complain some of us have purchased more than 1 season ticket since the move to SMS but also is right someone who buys a half season ticket today is given the same rights as a fan who has held a season ticket for over 5,10,15,20 and more years without a break?

Was it Cancer? No that's not funny is it.

Exactly - and we have long forgotten what this season's objective was and for me that was always early safety from relegation and a top 12 finish with the foundations for an assault on the automatics next season. If this dreaded 5th round tie takes the players focus away from the bread and butter stuff as commented by Dune then our outside chance of promotion this season will be gone and we could even blow the JPT semi final 5 days before the Pompey game. What has been a good season will for some soon lead to disenchantment because of what they perceive to have been under achievement. The league is vital and as I opined at the time the JPT has already been an unwelcome distraction and Pardew should have played a second XI in those games to protect the fitness / hunger of the first team. Our fixture pile up will now I fear be our undoing and we still remain closer in points terms to the relegation zone than we do the play offs. (Now that is whats called as going off thread - sorry about that)

I wouldn't worry we are always going to be a more attractive proposition than Pompey so if that nightmare happened I'm sure are arms would be outstretched to Master Gadaffi.

Another reason if one was needed why it was a disaster of distraction to draw Portsmouth in the 5th round and far better for us to march on against a Reading or a Derby whilst they were dumped out by a Chelsea or a Villa.

If the Echo were misrepresenting Mr Cortese do you think he is the type of character to let that lie? Or do you think the Echo could afford to go out on a dangerous limb and publish a story that wasn't true? I can make a personal judgement based on what is in the public domain as it has been published in a newspaper and is allegedly not simply based on slanderous hearsay. If the Echo have it wrong then I would not like to be in their shoes IMO. Likewise, if I was Mr Cortese I would not leave it long before addressing any potential misrepresentation of the issue.

LOL and in my experience it would have meant for a more enjoyable match day experience sat next to some scrawny but mouthy 'wicked' hoody who struggled to identify a single Saints player. 2 tickets for ST holders should be made compulsory and increase that allowance by 1 for every continuous 5 years a st has been held. Lets reward real loyalty.

Pretty damning from an experienced journalist and given the fall out between the Echo and the Club, the former I expect have to be absolutely spot on with their reports for fear of going under from expensive legal proceedings. Banning the local paper to report on non football related charity events is churlish in the extreme but by the same token the Echo are clearly proud of the fact their football coverage hasn't suffered so why should the reports on charity events? Neither Murray or Cortese are covering themselves in glory and it comes across as both petty and childish which is surprising given Cortese obvious intellect. On the face of it we should have no problem with him sitting on the board of a Serie A club provided we don't become a feeder club or a rest home for a bunch of underperforming overpaid players without any passion or desire to play for our club. Far-fetched? Probably, but so was the notion we would be taken over by one of the world's wealthiest men.

Is Libya registered with FIFA? If it is and whether we like it or not then Storrie and Co are well within their rights to approach who they like. We can't exclude individuals because of the past atrocities of their country or relatives over which they had no control at the time. Otherwise countries like Romania for example would not be in the football federation and many others and likewise wealthy owners from these countries. I predict there will be many wealthy football club owners to come from China in the future and we can only guess at their potential human rights violations from their past. Seems to me this has nothing to do with Gadaffi's son and more to do with the saving of Portsmouth and we would be up in arms if Richard Branson rode in and saved the day. As for Mike Porky Parry he is paid to be sensationalist to encourage listeners to call in otherwise he has no show. It wasn't so long ago he was extolling the virtues of Storrie and their hospitality when he was as an invited guest of theirs at I presume a home game with Everton.

Last time I had my thesis analysed I collected it myself. I suggest using one of those foil trays Chinese takeaways use. FOC.

Excellent post and completely agree with it's sentiments. I come from a family where my Grandad use to attend both Saints and Pompey home games cycling down from Romsey and then Winchester to attend games either side of WWII. My Mum and Uncle are both avid Saints fans in their 70s and both will comment positively if they hear Pompey have won. I don't share that philosophy but neither do I share the vitriolic and absurd hatred that exists that at times makes the Rangers / Celtic rivalry seem harmless. This game whatever the result will damage our season and AP will have his hands full managing the media and ensuring his players don't look beyond the next game. I wanted us to progress as far as we could in the FA Cup and be one of those few team in League 1 who reach the last 8 or even 4 and a home tie preferably against Reading and the Derby would have been far more enjoyable (I too will be crapping myself at the thought of losing) and less damaging to our overall objectives.