Wes Tender

70s Mike and Jam I'm encouraged to hear that there are others who feel the same way about this. I suspect that if it were polled on here, most would agree that the current system for queueing is both annoying and unfair. I have considered this at length and although the system that you propose, the Disney type barriers would be a solution, in practical terms it would require the erection of temporary barriers before the ticket booths opened and then their dismantlement afterwards, as they would otherwise be obstructing the apron in front of the stadium. Surely it would be quite easy and inexpensive to take a ticket number from a dispenser on the wall and for the booths to have a speaker system to announce which booth was ready to deal with the next customer? As I said, that way it would free people to visit the shop, or wait in their warm cars until the queue got closer to their number, instead of just standing there like Wallys. I'm pleased that the club will be looking at this thread to gauge fan opinion, so if there is anybody else out there who thinks along similar lines on this issue, we might get them to instigate some changes for the better. Presumably, unlike the re-arranging of the sitting areas, there is nobody out there who does not think that the existing queueing system is perfect and doesn't need alteration?

Exactly. What do you reckon? Have you ever queued for ages and seen others in queues either side of you get their tickets before you, even though they arrived some time after you? Bloody annoying. Also, if it is obvious that the wait will be some time, some might prefer to go and spend some money in the shop in the meantime, instead of standing around in the cold. Could be good for business for the club. They could open up a small stall selling hot refreshments with tables and chairs to sit in while you wait. Another potential revenue stream.

I will clap him politely. It was a privilege to see him play for us and I for one am grateful to him for the service he gave us.

24 carat comic genius! I particularly liked the suggestion that as they couldn't afford to run their website that they should employ the services of a town crier to desseminate the news, provided that they could find a suitably preposterous looking individual with his own hand-bell.

On a totally unrelated subject to the siting of the away fans, but definitely something that needs addressing, is the queuing for tickets. Standing in the cold wind for an hour yesterday illustrated the problem well for me. The problem is the same as the one that main Post Offices used to have. They would have say half a dozen queues and you had to guess which one to join. Naturally the shortest one you'd think. Often the wrong choice, as sod's law dictated that the people in all the longer queuse only needed stamps, whereas those in front of you needed to renew driving licenses, pay television licenses, pay into various investment accounts and collect their dole / pension and ask stupid questions about what-if scenarios. By the time that you got to the front of your queue, everybody else who had entered the Post Office after you had been served long since. The same situation exists in the queues for tickets at St. Mary's. Yesterday, although there were clear signs above the queues I had selected that half-season tickets could not be dealt with there, as there were trainee staff, inevitably there was somebody who complained of poor eyesight and didn't see them. He had been waiting an hour and insisted that he should be served immediately. So everybody in the queue behind him had to wait ages whilst he bought his half-season ticket from a trainee. Presumably he also then bought his ticket for the Pompey match too. Then inevitably there were those who produced 5 season tickets and wanted them all to be together, could they pay for these two separately etc.? The solution is simple. Rather than having just one queue with a "herding" area of barriers, which would be difficult to put in place and produce an obstruction on the apron, the easier solution is to have people take a numbered ticket. As soon as a booth becomes vacant, the number is announced. That way, everybody will be served in turn and it will be completely fair. What are people's thoughts on this? It should not cost too much to set up and would only be needed for peak ticket buying times.

I'm pretty well in front of you. I bought my two at 2ish today and the ticket sales took forever, standing in the cold wind. I'll have to remember to disinfect our seats in Block 42 for the next home game after the Pompey match

What is the club losing? Credibility? Maybe, although most are quite happy with how things are. The Echo's credibility has arguably taken the much bigger hit, although I'm sure that many would argue that it didn't have much credibility to lose in the first place. I'm guessing that the Echo circulation figures will decrease as a result of this, but consider it a reasonable enough assumption to make, as a large enough percentage of its readership is comprised of those who buy it to read about the Club. If it turns out to be true that the circulation figures do in fact fall at the moment, it is going to be difficult for Murray to blame the fall on other factors, so he might be placing an extra burden on his shoulders through this.

Again Bletch, fair comment. But if Cortese isn't savvy as to how "things are done" because of his more secretive banking background, then it is up to the Echo or anybody else indeed who wishes to do business with him to try and understand that. If Cortese wishes to do business with others, then he must be the flexible one with an understanding of the way things are done with his potential contact. I'm not sure whether anybody on here has the actual concise position as to whether the Echo is banned temporarily or whether conditions are attached. Seemingly it will last until either Murray makes it up with Cortese, or the thing just fades away naturally over time. It wouldn't surprise me though that Murray is ordered by the Newspaper Group's chief Executive to try and mend fences, as he has undoubtedly been appraised of the situation by many on here and will realise that circulation figures can only take a knock unless the Echo makes it up with the club. Regardless of the rights and wrongs of the situation, Cortese is under no such obligation to make the first move as arguably the club has nothing to lose by it, having numerous other media outlets available to it.

Please refer to the anlogy of the drowning man and explain what the difference is between him and us. Others might have saved us, but they did.

They did save the club. If they didn't buy us, the possibility was that we might have ceased to exist, or have had to begin again in the Blue Square league. Granted that others might have bought us, but there is no evidence that it was nailed on. It is like somebody is drowning and they were rescued by a passer-by and saying that they were not saved by that passer- by, as there were other people around who might have done it.

1) Do you really believe that they had no idea what the third division means? The income comes from promotion back to the Premiership. Because of our low standing in the third division, they were able to buy us in the bargain basement. 2) These people live in Switzerland. It is hardly the Tropics in Winter, is it? 3) It was a five year plan. Don't you listen? 4) Please tell us all what your own particular qualifications are that enables you make that judgment with such clarity and certainty. We all wait with bated breath. 5) Doesn't even warrant a response. I'll leave it to you to attempt to justify your remarks, if you can. 6) Again, I'd be interested in any evidence that you can provide to justify that. None at all, is my conclusion. Season ticket sales up, decent extra income from JPT and FA Cup runs, no stadium mortgage, no debt, super wealthy owner. It would have been a better wind-up if you'd come up with something with a little more credibility. Must do better next time.

I don't disagree with anything you say here and it's fair comment. But the reason that this is all being debated is because of the souring of relations between Cortese and Murray of the Echo. So in the interests of balance, where you've expressed your opinions about Cortese, it would also be interesting to know your thoughts on the way that Murray has behaved. Because IMO he has been petty, vindictive and childish. Not good traits in an Editor of a local rag, eh? It takes two to tango, so Cortese's recent actions must be balanced against the background of possible provocation from Murray, something that we might not have all the facts for, any more than we know the background for the departure of Oldknow. Because Cortese's relationships with Oldknow and Murray have not been convivial it might infer that he is a difficult man to get on with, or it could be that he doesn't suffer fools gladly. Personally, I don't care much either way, so long as his relationship with ML continues to prosper and that ML remains content to be our owner. Like you, I'd much prefer to look at the bigger picture of what he does to affect our success as a club rather than concentrate on the petty bickering.

Thanks

You're entitled to your stance, of course. I'd come at it from the perspective that Murray needs to sort out the problem with Cortese ASAP. The club has far less to lose from this spat than the Echo and purely on the basis that the Echo has behaved like a spoilt brat and thrown its rattle out of the pram does not incline me towards looking at them sympathetically.

See, this is exactly what Shurlock was referring to in his excellent post, which couldn't express more succinctly what my position is. How do you know that Markus's wealth wasn't contructed without the help of Cortese? You don't. Cortese is a high profile banker and almost certainly gave invaluable investment and financial advice which increased ML's wealth. I would expect that the relationship between the two men has been forged because ML places absolute trust in Cortese and his advice. And if you have any reason to believe that Cortese wasn't instrumental in bringing in ML as our owner, again, let us know what hard evidence you have to support your assertion. Furthermore, if you have any evidence that if Cortese were to leave, then ML would merely appoint somebody else to take his place, then also give us chapter and verse about that too. Few consider that Cortese is God, but the vast majority are extremely grateful for the part he played in introducing ML to the club. If you and Nineteen Canteen find it in your nature to be naturally suspicious of everybodys' motives, then that's up to you. But please accept that others are also entitled to adopt their own positions without being sneered at if they choose to adopt the standpoint that they will prefer to give him the benefit of the doubt over some regional newspaper hack with a Napoleon complex. Lastly, "decent football agent" is an oxymoron. There aren't any. Cortese will have acted in the best interests of ML, knowing that what is good for the club is also good for ML, himself and us. An agent would proceed with the primary objective of looking after number one. Also, I very much doubt that many football agents would have the ability to run the club as a business on a sound financial footing. I would expect that if he needs advice on footballing matters, Cortese would seek it out from those whose opinions he respects. He has already made it clear that a director of football might well be an option.

Yep, the one to the Chief Executive seems to be a good one. Anyway, far better that the man at the top gets to hear about it.

I don't agree that the Echo have the moral high ground on the original issue. It is by no means clear as to the exact circumstances as to why Cortese and Murray fell out, but one only has to observe the childish, petty vindictiveness of Murray to form an opinion as to whether he is suitable to hold the position of Editor of a local newspaper. With freedom of the press comes responsibility to report with accuracy and impartiality. We didn't fight the wars for a free press, we fought for freedom of speech. There is a subtle difference. And I disagree with your opinion that the club made an error of judgment and need to give in and move on. The error of judgment was the Echo's. It is they who need to give in and move on, as it is they who need access to inside information to boost their circulation. Instead, the longer this goes on and the more they set out to antagonise the club and its supporters, the lower will their circulation fall.

I actually sent of an email to the Chairman and Chief Executive which hasn't come back unsent yet. Unless it does, the email address of pdavidson@newsquest.co.uk seems to be correct.

I suspect that as the website doesn't give email addresses, the thing to do is to write to the Chairman & Chief Executive, Paul Davidson http://www.newsquest.co.uk/people2/pdavidson/ or the Regional Managing Director John Banks http://www.newsquest.co.uk/people2/jbanks/ Otherwise, I suspect that it is quite possible that their emails might be pdavidson@newsquest.co.uk and jbanks@newsquest.co.uk If anybody cares to send off emails to those two and report back whether they are returned as incorrect address or not, then if they're OK, I suspect that they will be bombarded by us telling them what a tw*t Murray is for alienating a large percentage of their local readership.

An interesting question. I believe that Cortese could have had a decent stab at saving us from administration had he come in instead of Lowe and the Quisling right at the start of last season. The main reason for this belief is that I don't think for one second that he would have dismissed Pearson for one. He certainly wouldn't have had the bizarre notion that he ought to have appointed a couple of Dutch non-entities inexperienced in the British game at this level and play the youth team as the first team. The other reason why he might have made a better job of it then Lowe and the Quisling, is that he would have had a far better chance of gaining some unity amongst the fan base. It was generally accepted that the level of attendance required to balance the books was about 17000. I believe firmly that the reason that we did not achieve that attendance was down to the unpopularity of Lowe and Wilde. Cortese runs a tight ship financially now without splashing the cash too wildly and I believe that his prowess as a top banker would have helped us keep an even keel. Also, his background might also have been very useful in assuring Barclays that the club was in good hands. If he moved on, I have no doubt that in all probability Liebherr would sell up, unless he gets the fan bug badly, like all of us. We had better hope that it doesn't happen before we are back in the Premiership.

This is the comment of somebody totally and utterly blind to the situation that we were in and what brought about our very survival. Did you not read what Cortese said? ML only got involved because of him. Get it? The likelihood is that if Cortese were to leave, then Liebherr would too. And if Liebherr left, we certainly wouldn't be able to replace him with somebody of a high calibre. Still, Liebherr won't score thirty goals a season either, so let's replace him with a chairman who can, eh? Sometimes I truly despair about some of our so called fans.

It's getting a bit worrying that Lambert is going off the boil and that Barnard might not be able to pop the goals in for a game or two and start to lose confidence. Lambert's goals are increasingly from set pieces rather than open play. But the problem has to be the midfield. The signing of a midfield general becomes urgent and I hope that we will get in one or even two midfielders of quality before the transfer window slams shut. It is useless having a decent defence and some good strikers if the service to them is lacking. Brentford's midfield outplayed ours for large parts of the game and it is a travesty that our man of the match was our goalkeeper. Thank God for Kelvin, or we could easily have suffered a heavy defeat.

Exactly also. IMO this is something that we might see in a positive light. Apparently Nicola has been on the periphery of football finance previously and now he has actually been active in running a club, serving an apprenticeship of sorts. His interest in football having been writ large when he swapped from being a big hitter in the banking world, clubs that he might have been associated with on financial matters could see some advantage in maintaining a connection with him. Whether the association was because of possibilities of us becoming a feeder club, taking players on loan in return, or just because they consider him to be a good asset to their boardrooms doesn't matter either way. If it is more than just a rumour, it would be useful experience for him and the fingers that he has in other pies might well have some benefits for us.

I agree totally. Winning against us is hardly going to be a greater incentive for their fans to go to see any more Premiership matches, even if they start winning a few, as they can't fill the stadium as it is and us having twice as many to the last round's Cup match was an embarassment to them. They couldn't argue that their stadium was not big enough and that they filled it, it was half empty. And it's ridiculous to think that beating us would bring unity to them, any more than it would unify us beating them if this match was played when the Lowe / Quisling regime was still in charge. The disunity in their ranks is caused for similar reasons to our disunity; there is massive uncertainty and worry caused by too many managers and too many owners in the past year or two and the distinct possibility that their club could cease to exist. Eeelpie: No, I don't disagree with your summary of the order of importance of forthcoming events. But I have absolute confidence that by the end of the season we will be be either in the play-offs, or pretty close, rather than just avoiding the drop.

As I get older, my eyesight is not as good, (like most refs ) so it is more difficult to recognise players when we have been constantly changing the team around andI haven't been able to recognise players by their general appearance or style. It occurred to me recently that it might be good idea to listen to the match on a radio whilst simultaneously watching it. Then one would not only be able to know which players were instrumental in the build up play, but also to make one's own judgement independently.