sadoldgit

Two non surprises this morning. 1. Batman did not announce the news of this attack on here. 2. Sour Mash stands up for right wing extremism.

And the way that any deaths are recorded have been changed so only those that die at the scene are recorded as part of the stats. Any that die later in hospital are not recorded as a fatality as part of the fire death stats making it look like these fatality numbers are falling.

As more and more information comes out about the tragedy at Grenfell, perhaps hypochondriac would like to explain once more about how socialism is apparently dangerous and capitalism isn't. The Tories are not going to come out of this well (especially the landlords who voted against the legislation that would have made these building safer). If there is any justice, this dreadful Government will not last much longer and this disaster might just have hastened their demise.

And tanks on the streets no doubt? Tell me, in all of the socialist Governments that we have had in this country, how many have committed genocide? How many people has Harold "Dangerous" Wilson taken out with an AK47? You really do have a very peculiar world view. You probably weren't born when we had the 3 day week. Tory Government and total chaos. Now that was "dangerous."

To be fair to hypo, he does come out with some corkers. If I have realised that Corbyn was going to mobilise the tanks if he had won the election I would never have voted for him! Mind you, not quite as good as his assertion that my view on Muslims is not as valid as his as I don't have any Muslim friends but his wife's uncle is an actual Muslim. Priceless. Now get back over the to the terrorist's thread and answer those questions, there's a good boy hypo.

Yes of course there are people here who want Labour in power. Don't you look at the number of votes cast? Good to see you shoe horn in more xenophobic comments into an election thread too. You are nothing if not consistent. We would be buggered if it wasn't for immigration. And as for your buddy hypochondriac and his ridiculous comment that "socialism is dangerous" - here is a quote from a well respected broadsheet a year ago - "Capitalism eats itself when too many get left too far behind to consume its products." Just as "dangerous" as socialism it seems.

MEPs are elected are they not? Do you know how much unchecked legislation has been forced upon us by unelected commissioners?

Socialism is dangerous? Seriously? It might be different but it is no more "dangerous" than capitalism. No surprise to see what side of the political divide you are on. Hopefully this current sham of a Government will fall apart soon and we will be rid of this dreadful PM. Let's get a bit of "dangerous" politics in, save the NHS and stop pandering to the stupidly rich.

What have the Government of the Day been doing for the last several decades if they haven't been running the country?

This will upset Hypochondriac and Katie Hopkins... http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/20-million-muslims-march-against-isis-arbaeen-pilgrimage-iraq-karbala-a7436561.html

Good to know that girls who have sex with multiple partners are still slappers and blokes who do the same are still lads. In the uncertain times we need things to rely on.

I have to admire your propensity for bouncing back time and again despite nearly always being wrong. The irony of your avatar always makes me smile too.

In the past the media, especially the tabloids, have played a big part in elections. Is it good to see that changing now and the influence of The Sun and The Mail is hopefully on the way out. The trouble is one lot of brainwashing gets replaced by another and Twitter and Facebook campaigns are on the rise. As for people not thinking for themselves, there will always be a large number of voters who are spoon feed garbage that they are only too willing to believe just because it suits their agenda. You only have to look at the people who believed that the NHS was going to get £350m a week after Brexit. Advertising works. That is why it is a multi million pound industry. You will no doubt come back and challenge this, so I'll just add a couple of quotes concerning specifically tabloid newspapers in America by H.L Mencken. "No one in the world, as far as I know, and I have searched records for years, and employed agents to help me, has ever lost money by underestimating the intelligence of the great masses of plain people." And "Because plain people are able to speak and understand and even, in many cases, to read and write, it is assumed that they have ideas in their heads and an appetite for more. This assumption is a folly." Could explain why UKIP did so well up until Brexit!

Hypochondriac - when you have finished compiling your list (should take you zero seconds) can you also please finally answer my question about why you don't pick up the resident Islamophobes and xenophobes on their posts but you do have a problem if someone has the temerity to support normal Muslims? I have asked you the same question several times in the course of this thread but you seem to have trouble answering it. You started off pretending that there were no Islamophobes on this thread (even though they are pretty obvious) and then when they were pointed out to you you seem to want to pretend that they don't exist. Not once I have seen you challenge them yet you go to keyboard meltdown if it is suggested that normal peaceful Muslims have nothing to do with the deranged idiots who carry out these atrocities. You like to bang on about how they need to do more (not easy if you haven't got a clue who these people are and what they are planning) and that this is all down to the religion. Sadly you missed one of the most telling quotes of this whole sorry mess given by a guy who witness a terrorist attack at a tube station - "You ain't no Muslim, bruv." I suspect if you had been standing next to him you would have piped up with, "But he is, he really is." So then, you homework for this weekend is to answer the question above (finally) and to provide a list of the apologists for terrorist actions on here.

One more thing. Where is that list of people on here who support terrorists and extremism? Ta.

Once again you make a stupid claim that not having a Muslim as a friend means I cannot have an opinion about Islam or terrorism. How old are you? 6? I am not morally superior that is another figment of your imagination. Nor am I safe in any ivory tower - another of your strange views. I am disappointed that there don't appear to be any Muslims on this site or if they are, they are not inclined to come on and support Islam. As that is the case other posters have had to do so on their behalf. Sadly a number of you seem to think that all Muslims are responsible for the actions of a murderous minority. They are not. Nor more than you, Sour Mash or Batman are. Oh, and I had a very long chat with a former Colonel in the British Military Intelligence last night. He has served in Northern Ireland, Iraq, America and Hong Kong as is hugely experience in dealing with terrorism. His exacts words were "you never beat terrorism with the military, you always end up having to talk with them." I know, as the resident internet football forum expert on dealing with terrorists you will find this hard to swallow, but I think I would listen to him before I would listen to someone with multiple sign-ons on a footie forum (eh Sweercorn? xx).

So no list of apologists then? And just because in your world someone who says this has nothing to do with peaceful Muslims seems to be some kind of apology for the deluded murderers, it doesn't make it so. Not once I have I made any attempt to apologise for these crimes. As for your view on Muslims. Did you or did you not say thank goodness that your wife isn't a practising Muslim? That would seem to indicate that you wouldn't have been comfortable with her if she was a practising Muslim would it not? Then there are the constant attacks on my posts. All I am saying is that normal Muslims are no more responsible for these murders and attacks than the rest of us but you seem to jump down my throat whenever I make that point. You constantly seek out my posts and have a dig but you leave Sour Mash alone. Why is that? Because quite clearly you share his opinions. You are the joke. So much so that you keep clear of another website because you know you will get ripped apart there as usual. Why did you jump to the support of Katie Hopkins when I raised her point about Muslims not doing enough? You were straight in on her side. Not one of us knows how much information Muslims pass on to the security services and just a few weeks earlier there had been a march in London to protest about the extremist attacks, but you decided to side with her and have a pop, again, at normal, peaceful people. You might not be as extreme as Sour Mash (again, why do you never, ever challenge his posts?) but you are right up there with Batman. Please don't pretend you don't have a problem with Islam. Your posts here show that you clearly do. As this is my last post today I'll take the time to also reply to Sour Mash (as it is a stupid point that you have also made in the past). Just because I am not best buddies with a load of Muslims, it doesn't mean that I cant have an opinion about the situation. As I said before, most of us here do not know a single Saints player but it doesn't stop us having an opinion about the club or the team. It is reducing the debate to a child's level. I don't pick and chose my friends from some kind of diversity hit list, do you? As for knowing Muslims Sour Mash, are those the ones you have put in hospital?

LOL. Bizarre, even by your standards Batman.

You, Sour Mash and Batman. So where is your list? You seem to more confused than usual. On another thread one minute you said you hate Diane Abbott then next post you changed your mind. Off the meds?

Ok. Provide a list of names of everyone here who is an apologist for these murderers.

http://www.independent.co.uk/voices/kabul-isis-explosion-attack-no-one-minutes-scilence-a7767341.html

Yes you are. And what difference does it matter what type of clothes you wear? Unless of cause you are looking for yet another reason to slag off a faith that you hate.

How unlike you to twist something to suit your own hate filled agenda. And for you and your Islamophobic/xenophobic buddies who keep saying that Muslims aren't doing enough to condemn the atrocities, this letter has just been published from from Harun Khan, Secretary General, Muslim Council of Britain.. "I am appalled and angered by the terrorist attacks at London Bridge and Borough Market in my home city. These acts of violence were truly shocking and I condemn them in the strongest terms. Muslims everywhere are outraged and disgusted at these cowards who once again have destroyed the lives of our fellow Britons. That this should happen in the month of Ramadan, when may Muslims were praying and fasting only goes to show that these people respect neither life nor faith. My prayers are with the victims and all those affected. I commend the work of our emergency services working hard to keep us safe and cope with the ensuing carnage. As ever we urge everyone to assist the authorities so that these criminals can be apprehended and brought to justice." Clear enough for you Sour Mash, Batman and Hypochondriac?

Indeed. What we are doing is clearly not working and we need to do something different. A change in foreign policy would be a start. Corbyn can do no worse and I can't understand why some people believe that May is our only hope when she and her like are part of the problem.