trousers Posted 18 September, 2008 Share Posted 18 September, 2008 Firstly, apologies for a new thread on the general subject matter of "why are we struggling" but I felt this one need a bit of homing in on treatment.... Here goes... There's something I don't understand.... When I came back from holiday at the beginning of September there was a sense of euphoria in the air following reportedly superb performances and results against Derby and Birmingham. My question is, what are the players and/or management doing differently now to then? Or is it a simple fact that Birmingham and Derby were so bad on the days we met them that it led us to think that this new set-up was working despite the pre-season cynicism in some quarters? If the answer is: "the other teams were bad" then what happens the next time we beat a half decent side...? Will we get the usual "that's grand, we've turned the corner again" or will there be a little less euphoria the next time we win two on the trot? So what is it? Something has changed? Or Birmingham and Derby had an off day? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Master Bates Posted 18 September, 2008 Share Posted 18 September, 2008 Go back on holiday and we'll start playing teams off the park again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BotleySaint Posted 18 September, 2008 Share Posted 18 September, 2008 Confidence probably. We lost a few games, turned in a bad performance and heads have dropped. One or two defeats can be taken if you play well. But everyone eventually has a crap game - its how you pick yourself up from it. Ours was Blackpool. We picked ourselves up by losing 4-1 (not so good) and scraping 2-2 draw with Ipswich (which is ok). Then hopefully, rediscovering our confidence by thrashing Barnsley this weekend :-) The loss of Lee Holmes and the drop in form/injuries of Michael Svensson doesn't help either. Both are, on their day, our best players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hypochondriac Posted 18 September, 2008 Share Posted 18 September, 2008 Youth players are always inconsistent. Even in these games there were some worrying moments and Davis had to make quite a few good saves. I still don't think we will get relegated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
whizzpop Posted 18 September, 2008 Share Posted 18 September, 2008 Think the loss of Svenson has been obvious. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoccerMom Posted 18 September, 2008 Share Posted 18 September, 2008 Hang on - Svensson didn't play against Brum in the League Cup. Got to agree with Hypochondriac. Don't expect instant results or miracles, but we will come good in the end. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint_clark Posted 18 September, 2008 Share Posted 18 September, 2008 Because they underestimated us. Bit off topic, but JP said in the program that he is "sure we can be the best team in this league if we stick to our principles and believe, believe, believe". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hypochondriac Posted 18 September, 2008 Share Posted 18 September, 2008 Because they underestimated us. Bit off topic, but JP said in the program that he is "sure we can be the best team in this league if we stick to our principles and believe, believe, believe". Rubbish. We played really well at times and for large periods played Brum off the park. It had more to do with our good performance than them being pants. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scudamore Posted 18 September, 2008 Share Posted 18 September, 2008 Because they underestimated us. Bit off topic, but JP said in the program that he is "sure we can be the best team in this league if we stick to our principles and believe, believe, believe". I just clicked my heels together three times...i'm not sure anything happened though... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint_clark Posted 18 September, 2008 Share Posted 18 September, 2008 Rubbish. We played really well at times and for large periods played Brum off the park. It had more to do with our good performance than them being pants. I'm not saying we didn't, but in every game i've seen the opposition has played good football too. I think the standard of football on a whole in this league has been underestimated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scudamore Posted 18 September, 2008 Share Posted 18 September, 2008 Rubbish. We played really well at times and for large periods played Brum off the park. It had more to do with our good performance than them being pants. Quite. And how could they have underestimated us when they'd played us the previous week? They knew full well what we're all about...just couldn't cope with it...was glorious stuff that night people make no doubt about it... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BotleySaint Posted 18 September, 2008 Share Posted 18 September, 2008 was glorious stuff that night people make no doubt about it... Totally agree. It is all that's keeping me going. We could play like that! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scudamore Posted 18 September, 2008 Share Posted 18 September, 2008 Totally agree. It is all that's keeping me going. We could play like that! Which made it all the more surprising when the passes started consistently going astray last night...previous seasons i almost expected us to give the ball straight back to the opposition (i've been to games where stringing three passes together seemed impossible) but that really hasn't been the case of late... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BotleySaint Posted 18 September, 2008 Share Posted 18 September, 2008 Which made it all the more surprising when the passes started consistently going astray last night...previous seasons i almost expected us to give the ball straight back to the opposition (i've been to games where stringing three passes together seemed impossible) but that really hasn't been the case of late... Against Brum there always seemed to be options for people on the ball to pass to. Easy options. Playing close together in small passing triangles and good variation of backwards and forwards passing. I've missed the last couple of games - but is it that people now don't want the ball/responsibility? Confidence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint Martini Posted 18 September, 2008 Share Posted 18 September, 2008 When you look at our first goal yesterday its shows we can still play like that. The problem is, the players forgot how to do it halfway through the match. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
70's Mike Posted 18 September, 2008 Share Posted 18 September, 2008 Derby were at the end of a sh*t run, Brum did not care about the Cup Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legod Second Coming Posted 18 September, 2008 Share Posted 18 September, 2008 I'm not saying we didn't, but in every game i've seen the opposition has played good football too. I think the standard of football on a whole in this league has been underestimated. amen brother. This is not the bruiser's league the fan on 606 last night claimed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy Durman Posted 18 September, 2008 Share Posted 18 September, 2008 Hang on - Svensson didn't play against Brum in the League Cup. Got to agree with Hypochondriac. Don't expect instant results or miracles, but we will come good in the end. Svenson didn't play, but you had Thomas the tank instead, plus Birmingham did not play there strongest team Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chez Posted 18 September, 2008 Share Posted 18 September, 2008 Firstly, apologies for a new thread on the general subject matter of "why are we struggling" but I felt this one need a bit of homing in on treatment.... Here goes... There's something I don't understand.... When I came back from holiday at the beginning of September there was a sense of euphoria in the air following reportedly superb performances and results against Derby and Birmingham. My question is, what are the players and/or management doing differently now to then? Or is it a simple fact that Birmingham and Derby were so bad on the days we met them that it led us to think that this new set-up was working despite the pre-season cynicism in some quarters? If the answer is: "the other teams were bad" then what happens the next time we beat a half decent side...? Will we get the usual "that's grand, we've turned the corner again" or will there be a little less euphoria the next time we win two on the trot? So what is it? Something has changed? Or Birmingham and Derby had an off day? Both opponents had bad days at the office. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danbert Posted 18 September, 2008 Share Posted 18 September, 2008 A clear case of supporter histrionics. Win a game and Maradona is not fit to carry our kit bag - loose a couple and suddenly the day of judgement is at hand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
St Landrew Posted 18 September, 2008 Share Posted 18 September, 2008 Some of the football I have seen Saints play this season has been excellent, and I'm not easily pleased. But some of the defending has been naive. That is going to be the case with less experienced players. But young players can be quick learners. I have always found the opinion of those that think, that the quality of the Championship as a whole is low, quite confusing. Some of the better, adventurous stuff would be capable of beating a Premiership team on any given day. But the established Premiership team would eventually do the Championship team over a season. It's why each are where they are, of course. Saints are uneven. The defence is sometimes porous, the attack wastes chances, and during a game the midfield occasionally gets overrun. But we are only half a dozen games into the season, and I believe Jan Poortvliet has the ability to get this squad playing well for 85-90 minutes. If he can do that, then I see a reasonably stable season. In any case, there's no point in contemplating the outcome if he can't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legod Second Coming Posted 18 September, 2008 Share Posted 18 September, 2008 Some of the football I have seen Saints play this season has been excellent, and I'm not easily pleased. But some of the defending has been naive. That is going to be the case with less experienced players. But young players can be quick learners. I have always found the opinion of those that think, that the quality of the Championship as a whole is low, quite confusing. Some of the better, adventurous stuff would be capable of beating a Premiership team on any given day. But the established Premiership team would eventually do the Championship team over a season. It's why each are where they are, of course. Saints are uneven. The defence is sometimes porous, the attack wastes chances, and during a game the midfield occasionally gets overrun. But we are only half a dozen games into the season, and I believe Jan Poortvliet has the ability to get this squad playing well for 85-90 minutes. If he can do that, then I see a reasonably stable season. In any case, there's no point in contemplating the outcome if he can't. I agree. I said in another post that if you have players doing the right things for 80% of the time, it is much easier than if you have only 80% of the players doing the right things. One thing that all young footballers suffer from is inconsistency. Even Theo, love-him, put in some stinkers. That's what happens when people are learning their trade. Naivety is also a factor of youth which sometimes forgets the conventional wisdom with humbling results. What is clear to me though is that we are either winning, losing or drawing 'as a team'. That bodes well for the season. There is no doubt in my mind it WILL be hard. At times, watching will be frustrating and heart-breaking. But THAT is football for the masses. I find myself watching now like a father, rather than a pure fan; willing people to do well not waiting for their inevitable failure. I cannot tell you what that is worth. At times against Brum and Derby (and even QPR) our play was breathtakingly good. To expect it always to be as good is also naive. Above all though, I am encouraged that the manager sees the flaws and knows full well that we are far from a diamond necklace. We have some roughly hewn stones and with luck, perserverence and a little more support, by Christmas we could be looking at a sparkling young side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SoccerMom Posted 18 September, 2008 Share Posted 18 September, 2008 (edited) Svenson didn't play, but you had Thomas the tank instead, plus Birmingham did not play there strongest team And your point is? That without Svensson we weren't fielding our strongest team, either? we had seven of the same starters, they had six, and Phillips played the whole of the second half. League Cup: Soton - Bialkowski, James, Thomas, Cork, Surman, Gillett (Mills 60), Lallana, Wotton, Schneiderlin (John 56), Holmes, McGoldrick. Brum - Doyle, Parnaby, Ridgewell, Kelly, Murphy, Agustien, Carsley, O'Connor (Phillips 46), Owusu-Abeyie, Bent, McSheffrey (Mutch 46). CCC Soton - Davis, James, Svensson, Perry, Surman, Gillett, Schneiderlin, Lallana, McGoldrick, Holmes, John (Thomson 69). Brum - Maik Taylor, Parnaby, Ridgewell, Martin Taylor, Murphy, Larsson, Nafti (Jerome 37), Carsley, O'Connor (Bent 66), Owusu-Abeyie (Phillips 76), McFadden Edited 18 September, 2008 by SoccerMom Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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