dubai_phil

I'm officially a manager (who won Nick!) I'm international (ly based) Not sure of the last bit though, mate and advisor maybe but my ex wife would never concede that I'm in the "good" category (although Paris Hilton seemed quite happy when she went off to work this morning) Yippee - give me 200k a year on a 3 year contract and sack me after a day whoo hoo!

Thanks Tony

Now that works logically except for my one point about "messing before admin", then think about "outside" influences Like I said around 6 names fit the bill, but not many fit all of them

Chill Follow the actual information and the timeline it has been released. Fry states he will contact the other bidders He contacts the other bidders They say EITHER Oh good here is our bid and it is more money than Pinnacle so go tell them to clear off OR they say - Pinnacle are in the driving seat, we do not wish to get in their way and we will not make a bid UNTIL you tell us in writing that their bid has been withdrawn Now READ what was said once more. He made a bid, BEFORE Pinnacle jumped in. Fry did what he SAID HE WOULD DO, and the reply is very specific as is the headline. No, he is not MAKING a bid. the BID that was made 3 weeks ago still stands on the table. The Echo read Fry's statement, they phone up MJ and he answers very clearly that they stand READY. It does NOT at any point mention any NEW bid at this time. For all ANYONE knows, the Pinnacle problem could hit ANYONE making a new bid, Jeez I know you guys think he is thick but c'mon give the moneyman some credit, he can read as well (and probably spells better than MJ) Doggface - you & Tony should be MUCH more worried about the Swiss, do NOT be fooled into looking the wrong way. I mentioned again yesterday that not agreeing was a dangerous risk. IF the Swiss (or Irish) decide they can offer 50 quid more than Tony then he is screwed, and blaming MJ may work to make people feel better on a forum but it won't help them get their deposit back

IMHO there could be one name missing from the original list despite the cr*p i got from some, The leaks originated in the City Somebody waits in the wings. They don't have enough money to do a deal with Fry They could well have been messing before we went into Admin They could well have been looking to do something with the Council They have friends on here who post No evidence it is them but if all possibilities are being mentioned then this should also Now, you can make about 6 names/groups fit into that list, and I am sure as heck not going to speculate as to which one of them it may be, nor even on who they are but I was trying to make a comment more than once on here about being worried, which got (fairly) tarnished because of who I was helping out 3 weeks ago. Point is something's been going on and now MLT has mentioned it

Again, was thinking about this - there COULD be a solution.... There was a delay putting SLH into admin. Now, IF it could be shown why that happened and that admin was "technically" started earlier, then a useful compromise would be a 10 point penalty for 2008/09 season... As for the legal side, I tried to point out from day one that a lot of Wise people had actually been involved, and obviously that was the old legal counsel for the SLH as well as BT's counsel and others (that sort of got muddled up a bit, because of the Barry the Briefcase concepts) Pretty much from Day one I think history will show that a lot of legal expertise has been used by a lot of people. The FL in all likelihood only woke up to that fact late last week and to coin a phrase have been somewhat caught with their pants in the expenses jar. I'm gonna spend the day packing for my trip to Blighty tomorrow and watching egg chasers later, it will be too stressful on here all weekend.

Having slept on all the shenanigans of yesterday some thoughts. The FL can do what they like. It's their ball, if we don't like it they just take it home. We don't agree, then they will not allow us to play in the League next season. Yes we will then go to court, but how long could that take? Sheff Utd's case took two years. Would we wait two years without football just to prove a point? The comments about the Right of Appeal - simplistic example - you cannot appeal a booking, and Darren Fletcher missed the CL final as UEFA rules on red cards are different from the PL rules, their rules. More to the point, going back over the past weeks, there were rumours of problems with the Pinnacle bid, they then ran out of time. I believe that those rumours could well have caused Fry to make the decision NOT to extend exclusivity. Now Pinnacle are faced with the possibility that Fry could accept a higher bid from somebody else, after ALL that work and cost, that is one HELL of a risk to take - WHY? Now THIS could be an interesting scenario to get out of this catch-22 - Pinnacle have spent a LOT of money, including their deposit. Their deal effectively falters because of the FL. Now IF Pinnacle then lose out, THEY are in the position where they are not bound by FL rules, BUT have been damaged by a decision which is effectively not justifiable under UK corporate law. IF they owned the club, and went to court claiming their letter was illegal, then the FL simply refuse to let them play in L1. BUT IF they are beaten by another bidder, then THEY would most likely have a REALLY strong case for damages in action against the FL..... Their court action then would not harm the club, they would likely win, which would then leave the FL in an even BIGGER mess of damages and suddenly the new owners of the club have a situation where the FL have been proven to have acted illegally (which CAN actually happen - remember the Bosman ruling). In this scenario, Pinnacle could claim their costs back and compensation and the 10 point deduction could be proven in court to be illegal, but WITHOUT the club facing sanctions itself. Now, THIS places the FL back into a very difficult position, and my guess would be that their lawyers may also work it out. Their ONLY solution would be to ensure that Pinnacle DO in fact complete the purchase on Monday and to PRAY that nobody else comes in before hand. Tactically it would mean that we could expect to see a whole set of media/PR/legal statements coming out over the weekend. Own the club - cannot sue - lose the club - sue and have a dead cert win... Simple summary - Pinnacle can do this, but we as fans should go find tin helmets and kevlar underwear, it needs to be a very hard-ars8d game of brinkmanship leading up to that meeting, and likely needs some help to play the bad guys to push the FL into a compromise. Interesting weekend. LAWYERS - Sharpen Your Pencils!

And what happened to the mysterious Irish who popped up for one day? IMHO big tactical error by Pinnacle, if the Swiss/Irish offer more now exclusivity is past one has to again question why it took so long to get to this stage. Wages next week doesn't give them or Fry much leeway Yes there is a strong legal case, but Pinnacle should sign the non legal action letter IF they want the club. if they DON'T sign it then that is probably more worrying....

I cannot believe that Pinnacle can walk away simply because of the 10 point issue. I am almost certain that the Sales Pack information would have stated that the club was liable to a 10 point penalty next season. So again we are back to the dynamics, and one question has to be asked if it REALLY goes wrong. How was the deal structured and by whom? I am pretty certain that Pinnacle's bid was strutcured to fit what they were asked to do, not necessarily what they first thought they were GOING to do. Tony Lynam et al are probably having a bad evening, but I wonder who else is having an attack of the cold sweats at the moment What a fookin mess

No. It is the detailed structure of the bid not the people, that is the hold up (and by that I don't mean the finances, simply just how each bit is actually split out) I am sure it is something a good Insolvency Practioner working with a good Barrister and a decent politician can solve.

What is Fry's job? get the best deal for the creditors. You want to buy Saints tonight - just bung the cash to BT tonight and make it 50 quid more than Pinnacle - technically Fry would have to accept that UNLESS he makes a statement extending But see my post above, I think it is highly unlikely anyone would bid with this issue unresolved, so if it is solved then Pinnacle would be able to complete. If it isn't solved then the structure of the deal may have to be changed and a certain Administrator and his legal counsel could have a lot of egg on his face - so again - unlikely

Hmm who had Tuesday in the sweepstake?

Again, I honestly don't think it is as simple as the "10 point deduction being given back" The FL have to give the playing club the licence to compete. The way that offers were requested for the club stated that 10 points was an issue, so the hold up is NOT simply about getting the 10 points overturned late on a Friday night. It will be a much bigger legal mess than that. The FL have to accept the structure of the deal in order to grant the playing licence. Their previous decision will IMHO make it actually impossible for the to accept the structure. I am sure this is a big catch-22, not about them being simply obstructive. To buy the club it needs to be done like this (oh and the 10 points come back) To do it like this the FL cannot grant a playing licence because they already made a ruling that this was not how it was set up when the old pre admin operated. This won't be about emotions, it's gonna be costly, legal and could take time I also cannot see how Fry could ask for new bids as they would have exactly the same legal problem as it is his structure, so he has to go back to his drawing board and re-package things Oh and there wasn't ever a problem in the exclusivity eh? Think you just found it. lol there are lots of problems in this sort of transaction

Pinnacle are taking one hell of a risk after all that work. After exclusivity ends, all it would need would be a cash deposit into Begbies account of a cash amount more than their total cash amount and they would be toast, UNLESS they have managed to sweet talk Fry. The trouble with THAT is if it is more money then he is duty bound to oh FFS this could go on for months

Think NSS is right, a lot of work was done by lawyers before any bids were received, so that the new owners are buying the shares of SFC Ltd. SLH IF it had any assets would be a separate deal within the deal where the buyer is buying them. Remember the comments at the time that the FL said one thing because of their rules, but UK Corporate Law said somthing a little different. I think it is likely to be that Fry & some very serious legal brains had this up their sleeves for some time and the FL are probably trying to find a way out of their own mess. They won't be happy, other clubs won't be happy, but it would be bl**dy funny if they have pulled that off

Anyone seen the remake of "The Taking of Pelham 123" yet? Almost as good as the original but not as tense as sitting here waiting. (Denzil is great but ain't Walter Matthau) At least didn't have to press F5 in the cinema

Question - I thought the FA/FL regs refer also to ownership - the actual beneficial owner needs to be known? Maybe that's the hold up, just getting that done

When the dust settles I think you may be about half right. My pure guess would be that there wasn't actually a closed down deal with a backer when they started. My guess is that their man was "sort of OK" but had not actually committed, and that the Pinnacle guys spent the first two weeks putting together all the real details of the business plan. Again. I would guess that they probably sent all that off to their man last week and the figures matched the "sales pitch" so they got the green light, so the rumours and speculation were probably technically correct - the money man wasn't nailed down, but he was "on board" With a go-ahead possibly being given only last weekend that would have left a great deal to be done in only 5 working days, hence the rush, the sudden leaks of Crouch & KK as manager, and the worries yesterday from the likes of Doggface that they may need an extension. I would expect that the discussions with Fry about getting any extension would have been a nightmare, probably because Fry would have expected them to be a bit further forwards, and he probably had a nagging fear that he could be left with the wage bill again next week. As I say, hopefully it's all sorted now and they can give us an update to get us away from the computers to at least get some lunch today! (And that is just analysis and an opinion and is as likely to be wrong as it is right)

Knowing our luck, we'll probably find out that our new owners are some weird offshore company, Super Saints Cayman Islands or something, and then we'll find that the FL are happy with them being a beneficial owner and have an NDA that means we don't ever get to find out. Alternatively of course it could be Allen Stanford.... knowing our luck But in reality, fingers crossed for today, as the wage bill next week looms and Pinnacle need to be able to pay that, Fry won't have time for any more games

I REALLY hope it is all completed tomorrow, there are some very large bills due for payment in the next week or so, last month's tax bill will be due and next week the wages are due, it won't give much leeway for Fry if it doesn't happen so fingers crossed.

Little buggers were a hive of activity quaffing down extra bananas and double cucumber portions, pumping a few weights and doing the rock climb maze, now they seem to have gone and bloomin well inverse hybernated, just when they were needed. There is a technical Tortoise term for it - hybernating when it hits +45C rather than the -45 up your way. So you missed the other one? - bending down very low to find something that wasn't all that much use first time around then Clue, it wasn't stooping down it was more "hidden dragon" ish, but hey only a day ahead of the press - it's actually just the time difference you see TSW tour contiunues apace this evening, Seaview was rocked, Bullfrogs & Jaegers were quaffed so just a quiet one tonight, and BOY is there a load of dirt on Nickh's team talks and tactics

Correct It's premature

Tuesday?

It will come down to confidence. Fry will be concerned that 21 days has not been long enough. There have been concerns raised during the process (that got shouted down on here) but the BT people close to the action will have a much better handle on what those were. Fry cannot take a risk at this stage, their will be major payments due to be made, more salaries & PAYE that should by now have been covered by ST sales. So, asking for an extension and being given a hard time is a concern. Fry must be absolutely certain in his own mind that the deal actually WILL close on Tuesday, because with major payments due, he might not have time to find somebody else. So, our opinions count for nothing, it will be down to Fry. It has appeared he is not the easiest to deal with so IF Doggface is correct, then the Pinnacle guys may have a battle on their hands

This is really bad, 5 pages so far and not one dissenting voice - who's gonna be the first to post KK Out!?!?!?!?!?! :-) So, the Crouch rumour also appears in the media (as in the enigma code breaker just for St Billy). Will go find the bottle of bubbly I got to celebrate our survival and may just put it in the Fridge ready for tomorrow's press conference when they sign everything and pay the cash across.