sadoldgit

Still a little ray of sunshine I see. You are going to look very silly next week.

I could well be wrong but didn't we finish runners up in the old Div 1 with a blue away kit?

Do you know that for sure? Other clubs were linked with him last year too. Perhaps Celtic were not prepared to sell him last year?

Loyalty points have got nothing to do with it. I just hate it when people make up rubbish in support of their own agenda. I don't recall Lowe ever owning the club therefore why should he put his own money in? Took the club into administration? Wasn't that the banks doing? Picked loads of crap managers? Some yes but plenty of good ones too - no mention of that though so that was well balanced. Taking money out of the club? Embezzlement? Never saw any evidence of that. If he took what he was entitled too what is the problem? I am sure people running football clubs get far less than the players they employ. As for Lowe keeping is appointments - how many managers have we had since he left the club? No one is beyond criticism, but if people are going to criticise, use facts not things that they wish were true. We also stayed in the top flight of English football on crowds of 15k - no mean feat. The current owners also seem to think that running the club his way is the way to do things (ie self sustaining model) so perhaps he wasn't totally wrong? The people he worked with at the FA said he was a visionary. Again, perhaps we wasn't total crap. Plenty of clubs of ours size get into difficulties so again, to say that it was all about Lowe is complete nonsense. Of course he made mistakes. You show me a CEO/Chairman who hasn't. The wrecking of the club as you put it didn't totally happen when he was he. Plenty of well intentioned people had a hand in that when he left the first time but that get airbrushed out of history for people like you with a blinkered agenda. You really need to get a balanced view. I think you will find that very little in life is as black and white as you need it to be.

Christ you really do not get it do you? We did not f-ck anything up. Toby decided to go to Spuds full stop. When are you going to stop rewriting history to suit your own sad agenda? You really ought to go and support another club.

Utter tosh. Strachan, Jones, Souness, Hoddle were not bad managers. And where do you get that he made a fortune out of the club?

We signed decent players last year without European football. The Premiership is still a big draw.

It is easy to support a team that is winning. The true test is the support when a team is struggling - and that is when they need the support the most.

I am with you on this. I didn't really expect us to go through after last week and the number of players we had out. We clearly don't have a lot of strength in depth but we do have a lot of players out and hopefully a CH to come in. I am sure things will improve once the likes of Bertrand and Clasie are fit but it still only August and to write us off now is very premature. There is still a lot of football to be played and we have played no where near our best yet.

It is still August. We have a squad decimated by injuries and sickness and short of one CH. It is a bit premature for an autopsy.

David Armstrong. Nick Holmes. Alan Ball.

Because life was so much better in Division 1. We still have two cups to play for and we are still in the Premiership. Man up. There is a long season ahead.

I think we need to grow a pair. Last season we exceeded expectations big time. This season so far we have been poor. Nobody died.

He has had an operation. Perhaps that has put a bit of a crimp in his day?

The principle is the same though. They haven't kept hold of their best players.

If it is going to happen either tomorrow or the weekend would be good. If we win tonight it will add to the feel good factor. If we go out it will help deflect some of the disappointment. Also a speedy exit after Celtic's loss would be another kick in the teeth for them so a few days grace would probably be in order.

So having just said that you don't know Vics state of mind, here you say he clearly isn't happy???

They may not have used the word happy but that doesn't mean that he is suicidal and gagging to leave does it?

There have been various snippets from ITKs but lets try this another way. The release that he was unhappy came from Spuds. How do you know that is the case and that he is unhappy?

I know that some of the posters on here will not like this because it doesn't suit their agenda, but I think - at the moment - that we have an owner, a Board and a management team that have a great deal of integrity and that they are all pulling together for the good of the club.

So when the club says he is happy to stay and a release from Spuds says he wants to go, you believe the Spuds PR machine?

There is a vast difference in picking up the club on making mistakes and slagging them off for mistakes that haven't actually been made. But hey, if you want to believe that the manager and the Board are a bunch of liars then so be it. Lets have a little look at Charlie Boys examples shall we? 1. It is quite possible at that point that Ron had been told that they couldn't reach a deal. 2. He said he had had a conversation with Toby and Toby had said he wanted to stay. Toby's Dad was saying the weekend before he moved to Spuds that nothing had been agreed. I suspect he knew around the same time that we did that Toby had decided to go elsewhere. Why would he say that Toby was up for joining if he knew damn well that the papers would be full of Toby with his Spuds shirt the next day? 3. He welcomed Gaston back and said that he had a chance to stake his claim and guess what, he got injured again. So maybe, just maybe, that changed the situation a bit? 4. Again, if he is told something by his medical staff and something changes, that makes him a liar? Also don't forget that the guy is Dutch and English is not his first language.

No he didn't, he said that we didn't have to sell. I don't recall him saying that no one would be sold. Feel free to check back and find the quotes and I will apologise if I am wrong.

Maybe he just isn't fit enough? Only just returned to training after injury hasn't he?