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Would people think Pardew was better then WGS?

St Marco

By St Marco,
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oxfordshire_saint

oxfordshire_saint

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If we win JPT, Beat Skates in next round of FA Cup to get a League 1 team into the last 8, and win Playoffs to go up to CCC?

 

Personally i think that would be an amazing achievement and in my mind better then what WGS did in 03.

 

If all of that happened, then without a doubt, yes!

 

Obviously though Pardew is working under a far more generous and amiable chairman, whereas WGS had to put up with some bloke who's name I can't remember..........

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converted_saint

converted_saint

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Yes. WGS had a pretty good squad to work with whereas Pardew's had to inherit a load of crap players with a losing mentality and turn them into winners. Yes he's bought players in, but they've been wise investments and the fact that we're even talking about the play-offs, in the semi of a cup comp and in the last 16 of the Cup says it all.

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St Marco

St Marco

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Reason i think that is

 

firstly to get to a final in the fa cup in the PL you must win 5 games. A league 1 team has to win 5 games just to get to the last 8. Meaning Pardew would of won the same amount of consecutive games as WGS in the FA Cup in a single year. Obviously to win 5 from a lower league is harder.

 

Secondly We started the season in a total mess. With -10. To take a team who had been bottom of the league for over a year and take them to the playoffs is a massive achievement, to then win the 3 playoff game is again huge.

 

Thirdly he would be the first person to win us a trophy since 76 if we win the JPT.

 

Finishing 8th in the PL in 03 when the teams were a lot weaker then they are today and getting to the final of the cup is a great achivement, but i would rate what we could do as harder to do at this momment in time.

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CB Fry

CB Fry

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Finishing 8th in the PL in 03 when the teams were a lot weaker then they are today and getting to the final of the cup is a great achivement, but i would rate what we could do as harder to do at this momment in time.

 

 

Really? Can't see anything in the teams that will finish from eighth to twentieth in this years Prem as being any better than any other set of teams from any Prem season in the last ten years at least.

 

And even Man U/Arsenal/Liverpool aren't as good as they have been in recent years.

 

Certainly don't agree that the teams in 2003 were "a lot" weaker.

 

I'd say a good comparison with the 2003 Saints team is this season's Birmingham City. Will probably finish 8/9/10, but there is nothing in that team that is "a lot" better than we were under WGS. Effective, but utterly ordinary.

Edited by CB Fry
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St Marco

St Marco

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Really? Can't see anything in the teams that will finish from eighth to twentieth in this years Prem as being any better than any other set of teams from any Prem season in the last ten years at least.

 

And even Man U/Arsenal/Liverpool aren't as good as they have been in recent years.

 

Certainly don't agree that the teams in 2003 were "a lot" weaker.

 

I'd say a good comparison with the 2003 Saints team is this season's Birmingham City. Will probably finish 8/9/10, but there is nothing in that team that is "a lot" better than we were under WGS. Effective, but utterly ordinary.

 

Well back then prior to june there was no Abromovich, no rich Man City, no money at spurs, moyes had just saved Everton from going down, Liverpool had Diouf as their striker and Houllier got sacked, Newcastle finished 5th and Charlton finished 7th.

 

Think it is pretty obvious the PL is a lot harder now then back then. Just having Chelsea's money changed football alone. (not for the good imo)

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Thedelldays

Thedelldays

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Well back then prior to june there was no Abromovich, no rich Man City, no money at spurs, moyes had just saved Everton from going down, Liverpool had Diouf as their striker and Houllier got sacked, Newcastle finished 5th and Charlton finished 7th.

 

Think it is pretty obvious the PL is a lot harder now then back then. Just having Chelsea's money changed football alone. (not for the good imo)

yes...of course it is harder...

 

:rolleyes:

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St Marco

St Marco

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I think i might have named the title wrong of this thread.

 

What i'm asking people is what is the bigger achievment.

 

What WGS did or what Pardew "could" do?

 

Not be-littling (excuse the pun) WGS. Who is a legend and always will be in my opinion.

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Thedelldays

Thedelldays

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£2m Svensson

£2m Niemmi

£1.5m Higginbottom

£2.5m Prutton etc etc

 

£8m+ is money is it not?

 

Im talking about our cup year not the year it all went tits up

please tell me you are joking..?

 

tell me when at any time we bought a player from a team above us who was one of their better ones..?

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CB Fry

CB Fry

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Well back then prior to june there was no Abromovich, no rich Man City, no money at spurs, moyes had just saved Everton from going down, Liverpool had Diouf as their striker and Houllier got sacked, Newcastle finished 5th and Charlton finished 7th.

 

Think it is pretty obvious the PL is a lot harder now then back then. Just having Chelsea's money changed football alone. (not for the good imo)

 

 

Yeah, it changed it and made the teams in the bottom half of the table a lot worse than they used to be.

 

Finishing Eighth in a division with Burnley, Wolves, Pompey, Bolton, Blackburn, Stoke City, Birmingham, Hull City, West Ham, Wigan and Sunderland is certainly no more difficult than we had seven years ago.

 

The Man U treble winning team is light years ahead of the current squad, the Bobby Robson's best Newcastle team would finish ahead of the 2010 Liverpool, Spurs and Man City.

 

If finishing eighth these days is some monumental footballing achievement, how come Birmingham and Fulham are in pole position to acheive it with teams no better than Strachan's?

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St Marco

St Marco

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please tell me you are joking..?

 

tell me when at any time we bought a player from a team above us who was one of their better ones..?

 

This was the table for the amount each club spent in 02/03

 

Man Utd – £32m

Man City - £30m

Newcastle - £22.5m

Sunderland - £16m

Liverpool - £14m

Middlesbrough - £11m

Southampton - £8m

Tottenham - £7m

West Brom - £6.95m

Arsenal - £6.6m

Aston Villa = £5m

Blackburn - £4.6m

Birmingham - £3.75m

Leeds - £2.75m

Charlton - £2.7m

Fulham - £2m

Everton - £1.25m

Chelsea - £500k

West Ham - £100k

Bolton - £0

 

 

We were the 7th highest spending team that year. I think that pretty much kills that whole "we didn't spend any money" argument.....

 

:)

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St Marco

St Marco

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Yeah, it changed it and made the teams in the bottom half of the table a lot worse than they used to be.

 

Finishing Eighth in a division with Burnley, Wolves, Pompey, Bolton, Blackburn, Stoke City, Birmingham, Hull City, West Ham, Wigan and Sunderland is certainly no more difficult than we had seven years ago.

 

The Man U treble winning team is light years ahead of the current squad, the Bobby Robson's best Newcastle team would finish ahead of the 2010 Liverpool, Spurs and Man City.

 

If finishing eighth these days is some monumental footballing achievement, how come Birmingham and Fulham are in pole position to acheive it with teams no better than Strachan's?

 

I disagree mate. Just 1 year later Everton got into the top 4. A club that battled relegation just a year before will never get into the top 4 the following season again.

A club from the lower half will find it near impossible to lodge Man U,Arsenal,Chelsea and now City from the top 4. And then finishing above either Liverpool,Spurs or Villa will be nearly as hard. The 8th spot in the league will always be a spot that is hard to predict because any of the other 13 teams could take it. Where as the top 7 are now pretty much set in stone.

 

The top 8 in 02,03 was Man U,Arsenal,Newcastle,Chelsea,Liverpool,Blackburn,Everton and us.

 

I doubt very much we will see a finished table like that again. Simply because of money. Thus making it harder.

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St Marco

St Marco

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sorry, if you think we spent money in the prem then you are a child who does not remember the prem or something is missing...

 

Can you not just admit you were wrong TDD?

You said we didn't spend any money. The table shows we were the 7th highest spenders for the year....Spending more then teams like Arsenal,Chelsea,Spurs etc..

 

We didn't spend as much as we should have done the following season, but that we weren't talking about, as mentioned countless times.....

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Thedelldays

Thedelldays

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Can you not just admit you were wrong TDD?

You said we didn't spend any money. The table shows we were the 7th highest spenders for the year....Spending more then teams like Arsenal,Chelsea,Spurs etc..

 

We didn't spend as much as we should have done the following season, but that we were talking about, as mentioned countless times.....

how much did we spend on wages..? how much did we spend on quality..when was the only time we bought a player who was doing well in a team consistantly above us..? when did we have the money to do that..?

 

we did not..we picked up cheapos and bargins..

 

Neil FUKING McCann is all you need to say

 

£8m over a year in the prem in nothing...NOTHING...in relative terms..pardew has probably spent MORE than the rest of the league put together...not to mention the wage bill

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TopGun

TopGun

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Can you not just admit you were wrong TDD?

You said we didn't spend any money. The table shows we were the 7th highest spenders for the year....Spending more then teams like Arsenal,Chelsea,Spurs etc..

 

We didn't spend as much as we should have done the following season, but that we weren't talking about, as mentioned countless times.....

 

Facts pass TDD by generally.

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St Marco

St Marco

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how much did we spend on wages..? how much did we spend on quality..when was the only time we bought a player who was doing well in a team consistantly above us..? when did we have the money to do that..?

 

we did not..we picked up cheapos and bargins..

 

Neil FUKING McCann is all you need to say

 

£8m over a year in the prem in nothing...NOTHING...in relative terms..pardew has probably spent MORE than the rest of the league put together...not to mention the wage bill

 

Again does that not boil down to the people who were running the club?

Did WGS not bring those players in?

 

Everton the season before were about to go down, finally finished 15th (we were 11th) and spent a massive £1.2m on players in the summer and finished 7th. If you think one of the bottom clubs can pay £1.2m after battling relegation today and then finish in europe the following season then i would love to see that.

 

Pardew has spent a lot of money in terms of the league we are in. But in 02/03 so did WSG as the table prooves to you.

 

And no team will do what Arsenal did again, that is not an indication of how crap the league is.....It shows that the gulf in class between the top 4 to the top 7 is nowhere near as much as it was. Some other clubs have become better, due to....money.

 

Look at the table for 02/03. Man Utd the champions of that year played 38 games and lost 5. They have lost 5 of their 20 games this season already! Liverpool lost 10 of 38 and have already lost 7 of 20 this season. Arsenal lost 6 of their 38 in 02/03 and have already lost 4 of their 19 games this season.

 

Just more proof to show how hard the league has become.

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NickG

NickG

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If we win JPT, Beat Skates in next round of FA Cup to get a League 1 team into the last 8, and win Playoffs to go up to CCC?

 

Personally i think that would be an amazing achievement and in my mind better then what WGS did in 03.

 

if...

 

 

yes that probably would be more of an achievement(s)

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CB Fry

CB Fry

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I disagree mate. Just 1 year later Everton got into the top 4. A club that battled relegation just a year before will never get into the top 4 the following season again.

A club from the lower half will find it near impossible to lodge Man U,Arsenal,Chelsea and now City from the top 4. And then finishing above either Liverpool,Spurs or Villa will be nearly as hard. The 8th spot in the league will always be a spot that is hard to predict because any of the other 13 teams could take it. Where as the top 7 are now pretty much set in stone.

 

The top 8 in 02,03 was Man U,Arsenal,Newcastle,Chelsea,Liverpool,Blackburn,Everton and us.

 

I doubt very much we will see a finished table like that again. Simply because of money. Thus making it harder.

 

But we're talking about eighth. And Birmingham and Fulham are more than likely going to finish eighth. Meaning that clubs like us can still finish eighth.

 

Fulham finished seventh last season. Blackburn finished seventh the season before. Bolton finished seventh and Reading eighth the season before that, in their first season up.

 

Eighth is a perfectly achievable target for a very good, well organised, professionally managed "average" team, if you see what I mean. And it is just as difficult/realistic as it was in 2003.

 

Your Fulhams, Readings and Blackburns have/had players like Konchesky, Zamora, Danny Murphy, Dave Kitson, David Dunn, Zoltan Gera, Stephen Warnock, Kevin Doyle. Not world beaters, just steady pros - the equivalents of our Beattie, Marsden, Neimi and Bridge.

 

If the top four have got stronger then the bottom eight have definitely got weaker.

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Scudamore

Scudamore

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Really? Can't see anything in the teams that will finish from eighth to twentieth in this years Prem as being any better than any other set of teams from any Prem season in the last ten years at least.

 

And even Man U/Arsenal/Liverpool aren't as good as they have been in recent years.

 

Certainly don't agree that the teams in 2003 were "a lot" weaker.

 

I'd say a good comparison with the 2003 Saints team is this season's Birmingham City. Will probably finish 8/9/10, but there is nothing in that team that is "a lot" better than we were under WGS. Effective, but utterly ordinary.

 

I looked at the Premier League table the other week and thought what a load of sh:t there was in there at the mo!

 

Burnley? Hull? Wigan? Fulham? Stoke? How the f::ck Bolton ever managed to establish themselves as Perm team i'll never know. And Portsmouth? F::ck me sideways...how has that been allowed to continue? Not much longer now though thankfully.

 

People will no doubt get uppity when i mention us taking our rightful place back in the Premier League but that's how i feel!

 

Of course i think it's a generational thing mind as there'll be kids growing up at the moment that certainly don't consider Saints to be a Premier League team. But then kids are stupid.

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John B

John B

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I looked at the Premier League table the other week and thought what a load of sh:t there was in there at the mo!

 

Burnley? Hull? Wigan? Fulham? Stoke? How the f::ck Bolton ever managed to establish themselves as Perm team i'll never know. And Portsmouth? F::ck me sideways...how has that been allowed to continue? Not much longer now though thankfully.

 

People will no doubt get uppity when i mention us taking our rightful place back in the Premier League but that's how i feel!

 

Of course i think it's a generational thing mind as there'll be kids growing up at the moment that certainly don't consider Saints to be a Premier League team. But then kids are stupid.

 

Well there are clubs like Newcastle Leeds WBA Middlesboro Nottm Forest etc waiting below dont forget

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Scudamore

Scudamore

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Well there are clubs like Newcastle Leeds WBA Middlesboro Nottm Forest etc waiting below dont forget

 

I don't forget! And whilst with team like Leeds and Newcastle i don't necessarily like them. I think they should be in the Prem. Obviously it doesn't quite work that way though!

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The9

The9

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If we win JPT, Beat Skates in next round of FA Cup to get a League 1 team into the last 8, and win Playoffs to go up to CCC?

 

Personally i think that would be an amazing achievement and in my mind better then what WGS did in 03.

 

Yes, people would think that, but they'd be a bit simple.

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