Robsk II

Anyone working for Nazi Germany deserves terrible things? Is everyone here retarded? Simple minded, reactive fools. What about the secretaries, the plumbers, the hairdresser who cut Himmlers hair? It's inane and insane to go around assuming that the majority were actively collaborating with genocide, war crimes etc. Some active party members had no truck at all with the more extreme elements of Nazi policy; they just wanted a better lot for their country and themselves. They should hang, right? He should be tortured? Christ, what a barbaric country we still are. Torturing him will achieve nothing. No punishment will ever take back any action, and most punishment doesn't even act as a deterrent. Even if Hitler himself had been caught, tortuing him would have achieved nothing but petty revenge. Nothing could ever be enough to'pay' for such crimes, so what's the point? Torturing anyone is against the law, and as people seem to need reminding all the time, it's the sort of thing we rightly deplore the Nazis for. No wonder some people think that the world is ripe for it all to happen again. All you need is a cause that enough morons with no brain, regardless of facts or soherent thinking, will get behind, a convincing speaker and propaganda campaign, and a willingness to resort to extreme measures 'for the good of something' or because people 'deserve' it and we're back in that situation. Torturing an old man is something that most moderate Nazi party card carriers would have considered beyond the pail, yet some of us seem oblivious to this obvious fact. The death sentence, too - why bother? What will that achieve? Nothing. It's a shame he wasn't called to account many years ago, if guilty, but he's managed to have freedom for most of the time since. That's all that matters, and no-one can change that now. Thousands upon thousands of those who were in some way guilty - including war crimes on our side - slipped through the net and most lived perfectly ok lives afterwards, some dying without anyone ever knowing. This is a simple fact. There is no such thing as justice in cases like these. Only lessons to be learned. All this thread seems to demonstrate, so soon into it, is that most people have already forgotten or never learned in the first place. Consider your attitudes, your reactions to the more abhorrent crimes. Consider how many times you have assumed someone is guilty just because they are arrested. If those things all sit comfortably with you, truly and honestly, in the light of what we should have learned from Nazi tyranny and all that has tragically come since, that really concerns me.

No, not suggesting that. Just saying that if it was a clear fact that Demjanjuk was guilty, he'd not be standing trial. I agree that guilt has nothing to do with age, but I would just say that I always think people should be cafeul around the term 'deserve' - first, because we are not always fully informed, certainly not at this point, as he may be innocent (regardless of ID - many workers at camps did have little choice, that is a regrettable fact, and some probably did all they could to get out or have a subtle positive influence. I'm not party to all the evidence, of course, but no-one should be convicted on circumstancial evidence alone, particularly when coupled with a generation revisiting those terrible times in an attempt to understand and gain closure, with few targets left) - and second, who are we to say what people deserve? If he did indeed play a role, does he deserve suffering? Who does that help now? Does he deserve death? Many have died, who perhaps deserved to live, and vice versa.

Be careful with the word 'deserve'.... I saw that program, too, and while I thought it quite good, it, like many other things and people, seemed to assume guilt. I find these types of crime as abhorrent as anyone else, but getting emotive without considering rationality or evidence does nothing to distance oneself from the party that governed those prison commandants and guards. Would you believe that a Jewish conspiracy was trying to destroy Britain if TV told you so - and would you then say they deserve all they can get?

How do you know he wasn't trying to save both?

No, I think the other one is just shrouded in shadow. Two-tone pictures can be a spot confusing.

I love the use of 'would'. perhaps 'could have been', 'may have', 'perhaps would have been', 'it seems likely to me that'.. etc would be better phrasing...

FFS.

I meant the other mods. I have nothing but the profoundest respect for the work you do, sir. But what can one man, mighty though he may be, do, against relentless waves of cretiny? I salute you.

Multiple log-ins? Thought the mods tracked that sort of tomfoolery, like with that Kadeem idiot?

Who said standards were dropping, eh? For shame, Symmonds. For shame.

What's happening today? Anything?

If you look like a paedo... But seriously. I'm sure it'll be fine, provided your documentation is all in order and you're not sporting a crusty mac or sweaty tracksuit avec a charlie chester beard...

We're all ****ed then, right? So what's the point in worrying? Unless you're a virgin. Ponty.

I can't start threads any more - but doe anyone want to play TODAY at 5pm, Cantell school? Please let me know ASAP.

Proposition - anyone who would be interested in playing in a similar kind of arrangement to Sundays on a regular basis on Tuesday nights, 5pm at Cantell school, let me know asap. I have limited posts and no PM, but some might know my email address or facebook, others just.. whatever.

5 goals at least 3 assists... (H) Was quality today, really enjoyed it. Some moves that were better than anything I've seen on a Sunday in ages, loved it.

Me and Ben are in if numbers are OK

I'm a twin. My twin is about to become a parent of some twins, too.

Seriously, are you PAID by EA or what? You always go on about supposedly being a writer for the games industry, yet it seems clear that your writing is poor, and you never, eer show much in the way of objectivity about anything.

Have vague affection for Juventus, FC St Pauli, and Sparta Prague. Been to see Sparta, randomly, at home.

I'd forgotten that this seems to happen a lot. It's been a while, at least. Pure coincidence, I assure you M'Lud.

FYI - I work in a building literally metres away from that, and was outside at the time it happened. I heard it, ran round the corner and was one of the first people on the scene. Luckily, a police car was heading along the road at the time it happened, so was able to react almost instantly. Guy knocked from his motorbike, hard to say what happened but perhaps related to some of the traffic lights in the area were down during a powercut that happened from 11:45ish until I left at 6pm. The guy was moving his limbs occasionally, so wasn't dead, at any rate - was a spinal board jobby anyway, though. Hope he was OK.

Baj had a chat with me, I told him everything he needed to know. EVERYTHING.

Stop pussying about Akeem, get out there today!

What the **** is happening with this week? Are we on tomorrow? I know Ben and I are both around, plus probably that other guy, Tony.