Frank's cousin

Possibly best to close? The OP was a wind up - fun ny tyo some, not so to other, depends on your sense of humour, but it it seems to become something quite different. There are obviously issues here that are perhaps not really part of the forum debate?

Think its also a simple case of relative fitness, some players simply dont perform wen its two in a week and that upsets the balance... Pards needs to use teh squad with more imagination - rest players who need it and play a few on the fringe who are hungry and fighting for a place - same week in week out can breed complacency as well as adding to fatigue...

BUt Alps the problem is that you see these results as unacceptable BECAUSE of the points lost during those first 10 games - had we had two points per game average all season (as we have had this year ( we would now have an extra 11 points with a game in hand) and would be in a play off place should we win it- beacuse some of thos epoints would have come against teams above us in those places now) Had we not had such a bad start, then the bad results such as those against Tranmere would be seen for what they actually are - anomolies due to a variety of circumstances that EVERY team suffer even during a very good season - its why Leeds and Norwich have lost and drawn games that on paper they would have been expected to win. I am not making an excuse for the defeats, but just pointing out that you defining them as 'unacceptable' is based on the context of the early season bad form - WHICH has been put right. Had we not had that bad form at the start, then the context of these defeats would be entirely different... that is all anyone is pointing out, not making excuses.

Alps... I dont think anyone thinks it will be 'easy' or guarranteed next season...but with all things considered, the squad that has been assembled has shown in the last 3 months or so Promotion form (even with the odd poor result as ALL teams have). IF and we know its a big IF that form and confidence can be carried forward to next season and the squad held together, it suggests we have have alot to look forward to. I dont thyink that is naive or happy clappy, but based on a reasonable assessment of the last 20 odd games - ironically some feel we have been inconsistent Because the bad results stand out like a sore thumb, yet the form over this period if duplicated from teh start of the season next year WILL see us promoted automatically. In the mean time fans are just happy that after a period of woeful results, we seem to have made a vast improvement in results (albeit against a lower level of opposition) - and not playing bad football either but a good pragmatic mix of a passing game and direct approach that seems to be working in this league. Reasons to be positive no?

I think we need another of your 'converstations' with the NC and ML... to clarify all the best bits the last was was golden! ;-)

Clappy thing... excellent post. Most spent the last 5 years (or longer) desperate for a return to old values, community spirit and being proud of our team... have we not got that back now? I think we have and we have also made good progress and should all things being equal be in with a very good shout of success next season...not guarranteed, but certainly something to be anticipated with positivity, not fear... as we all know this is one of the few sports/games in which the side the play best dont always get the points - which is wat makes this game so darn unpredictable...

Once again, a satirical dig, which was actually not that harsh, has been blown up out of all proportion - come on, we should all be a bit more laid back about this... Come on GM do your worst about me... have moved to Scotland so only get to about 3-4 games a year now.. what does your wit say about me and my posts? ;-)

Surely, that while debate is based simply on what your own personal expectations are - If you believe (we are led NC believes) that the investment made should demand a play off place, that quite rightly you will currently not be best pleased and quite 'negative' about the situation....If on the other hand, your years of being a football fan have led you to understand that simply spending money and even with a good manager does not equal guaranteed success over night, and believe that progress made slowly is more sustainable than rapid quick fixes, then this pragmatism tends to see these fans happy with the progress made to date if not the inconsistency of results... you takes your pick.

All depends on your expectations - very high and despite good results such as Walsall, NOorwich and Hudersfield, there will a shed load of dissapointment after Tranmere... mostfans I thin have gone from having expectations of consolidation and mid tabel rebuild at the start, having had most of the optimism knocked out of us after the previous seasons, and after the first 10 games thought that that was afir ambition in a rebuild season. BUt as is typical and RIGHT of fans when we see the improvements and also game sin which we excel, our expectations are rapidly reevaluated - hope afterall is the biggest factor in football, its what drives fans to keep going back year on year despite what happens - and so when we see the way we 'can' play, anything that fails to live up is dissapointing. This is, if I compare how I felt at teh start of the season, eg if someone had said top 10, but in reality playoff form if we had not had the -10, I would have taken it and been more than happy.... but having now seen waht we ARE capable of and not just on a 'good day' but because of teh players we have and the investment we have made, I must adit I would be dissapointed if we dont make them...but not so dissappinted that its worth a chnage of manager, far from it - the progress we have made in the performance level means he has more than justified a real go next season...IMHO

I dont necessarily disagree with the sentiments, but the reality is that all sides do lose now and again in unexpected results... and this is a side that we know still has a bit to do in term sof getting consistent results - and even then do we expect to go through a season without any defeats? - we should remember that the 2-3 defeat we are likely to get until the end of the season are not what is the real problem... that was the the first 12 games or so that have left us with too much to do.. ... its ironic that given the constand problems associated with the club because of the hire em fire em that lOwe was in to, and everyone criticised, that some are not prpared to give a manager the time to make it right?

100% agree. I think its opnly natural that when we show a bit of form and hand out 5-1, and 5-0 thrashings, that there is dissapointment when we dont get the result, but we should remember that its about the long term and the progress we have made is pretty solid and clear to see, and that for me is teh mostimportant thing so far.

So what are we really saying? 1. There is some sympathy for the fact that given the turmoil of the summer, as FANs we can understand the stuttering start... 2. However, perhaps our record in the first 10-12 games was still below par given everything considered and the investment we had - 2 more wins in this period and we would be 4-6 points better off and perhaps more in touch with a playoff place 3. I do think that the -10 had a psychological effect - it wa slike a milstone and we didstart to pick up form when we finally got passed the 0 points - coincidence? - But its also the managers job to remove this thinking from the players - but do we expect a manager to be a pscychologist as well? 4. New arrivals in Jan - have bedded in rapidly - a testament to their quality and If you look at our record in the league since Jan 1 2010 its: Played 8 Won 4 Drawn 4 Lost 0 = 2points per game average (which is promotion form) 5. There has been some inconsitency in this run in terms of quality of play but not all can be put down to the pitches we were playing on although it is a factor - I would say a par record for this squad should be Played 8 won 6 drawn 1 lost 1 = 2.37 points per game = championship winning form - so we are below par 6. We need to learn to play on those pitches - QUICKLY - managers Job 7. Cortese expects the par score relative to the investment - so naturally dissapointed 8. It is definitely frustrating when we see a side who can play so well, not perform despite still averaging 2 points a game since Jan 1 - If we had had that form since the start of the season we would be 2 points off the playoffs with a game in hand (given the -10) 9. (not factoring in the -10) Average for the season to date = 1.68 per game Average for the season Aug-Dec = 1.58 per game Average for season since Jan 1 = 2 points per game So there has been a big improvement this year - but its NOT enough as we were playing catch up due to poorer start to the season Longwinded I know but I guess the question is - Are you happy with form that is 2 points per game? Some will say yes - because its bloody good, others no...because we are on catch up so its not enough... Our season was it seems fecked by the poor tally up until Christmas, not the current form - we are frustrated with the current form because despite 2 points per game, its not enough to gain that 6th spot given where we started from so I can see why some have an issue with Pards... How you feel about his performance will I guess depend on how much slack you cut him during the first half of the season and whether you think that the investment and quality of the squad should be enough to guarrantee playoff place despite the -10 and thus feel he has not delivered? Personally, as I mentioned above, I think if we miss out on a playoff place by more than the 10 points, we will not have fulfiled the potential of this side and thus Pards as manager needs to take that responsibilty... That said, I do think he has demonstrated enough progress and an eye for a player, that he does deserve the chance to to take us into next season where automatic promotion is the only target.

There is some fair logic in that... I better sit down... ;-)

Do you think though that there is some truth in the bedding in periods - the first right at the start of the season and then post Jan? I think we do have to cut Pards some slack for the start of the season - we did not hit the ground running and given the turmoil we had been through, that was fair enough, but the investment since means that as you say, the expectations from the clubs management are high as they should eb and we were stuttering a bit. My opinion on the away grounds thing is simple - LEARN to play to the conditions, even if it means hacking up one of teh pitches a bit at staplefield and using that before away games and adjusting things tactically. With teh squad and investment we have had, draws and losses away can not and should not eb blamed on teh state of the pitch. Interested to hear your thoughts on this.

Think the truth is somewhere in the middle..(fence sitting for Alpine ;-)) - I think its only natural that given we were so darn pleased to still have a club, that many felt it would take a while and would be satisfied with mid table given the -10 point start.... BUt consider the NC rant for moment - we took 8 games to win (yes there was undoubtedly that non pre-season rationale), but hasd we won just two of those games, possibly three that ended in draws and we would be sitting on an additional 6 points and be in my book favourites to get a playoff spot right now given the form.... The money invested in both players and in the manager (Pards will not have come cheaply given his prem experience) is huge for this division and so rightly expectations from NC/ML were set very high - perhaps higher than we as fans thought possible or perhaps fair to Pards...yet we have only lost 6 games this season in the...read that again 6 losses out of 30 odd games - but a few too many draws are why we are so far behind the playoff places right now - so YES Pards has done fantatsically well, has bought wisely and has us playing attractive football and turned us around - YES he deserved the credit and the praise, BUT we must remember our squad and form suggest a playoff place iand its only the odd lapse that has meant we are still some way off... YES we need to learn how to grind out extra points on soggy turnip fields, churned up by eggchaser and cows, but we should with this squad be up there. For me I will judge this as a successful season if we miss out on the playoffs by less than 10 points - the deduction - that would be fair as depite the heavy investment, on level terms automatic promotion would have been unrealistic given the timing of Pards arrival, but a Playoff place should be expected given teh investment and quality we have - so anything more than 10 0points off the playoffs come season end would for me be dissapointing.... Next season there will be no excuses - automatic promotion should be the only target, with a playoff place a dissapointing consolation prize. BUt Pards has done more than ennough to deserve the chance to lead us there. That would be my message to NC.

Think you are right but I guess its complex with the owner also being creditors etc... and their only assets being players. As I understand it, and if someone knows the rules here wouldwelcome input, the players are only sellable assets if the club is in administration, but if the club is 'wound up' by the courts then their contracts become null and void and thus they have no value. Surely then if no buyer comes forward before Monday who can guarrantee the HMRC their cash at the very least, and demonstrate that they have sufficent funds to keep the club as a going concern, then that would be it.... in which case their best bet would be some creditors to step forward and demand admin before then which would buy them some time, and enable them to sell players outside the transfer window to maxmise the return to creditors and improve their chnaces of finding a buyer. I know many complained that 'we should have stayed at the dell' and spent the money on players rather than SMS, but had we done that would we have been as tempting to ML? The issue pompey have is that even in admin, their only assets are players and the name... so it will need someone who has a real interest in seeing them rise from what will be an almost impossible position. For me, Storrie and Redknapp have alot to answer for. Its all very well blaming the 'owners' for saying yes, they were simply loaning more cash to the club, on the hope of a return given the 'success that would come', but STorrie must have known the consequences as would have Redknapp, so why did they do it?

All too true... but here's a thought, is this desire to spend beyond the clubs means driven by egotistical owners/chairmen/managers or in part by fan pressure for success? Its not that long ago that we were giving our own board (all of them to some degree) a kicking for NOT spending to maintain our PL status (then CCC status) or for 'pushing on' and showing ambition, at a time when the finances were not bad and we were living within our means? Yet because we came close to the brink, the one good thing to come from all this is a more balanced an reflective approach to spending - as a fan base I think we are now more cautious and more realistic of our timetable for realising our ambitions... but for how long? HOw many seasons before we forget where we have been.... afterall Pompey were in the Crap only in recent memory - before Mad Milan came along - yet most of their fans al got swept along on the road by Redflapps and his cup run based on his alledged 'ignorance' of the impact his purchases were having...

TBH whatever happens on Monday they wont dissappear - the vultures are already circulating - those 'in discussions' will wait until the club is in admin before making a decision - does anyone know what happens if the diectors/owners place teh club in admin before monday? will this offer them a stay of execution as its more likely a buyer will be found when in admin who will then guarrantee the HMRC their cash, take the -9 points now as relegation is a certainty anyway and then rebuild with the parachute payment next season... I know there is a huge amount of schardenfreude about all this, and on the service I am not sympathetic because their directors/owners and Harry all have themselves to blame in their total incompetence in attempting to buy success, but the real fans do deserve better - not the moronic lot whose hatred for us outways their love of their own team, but real fans who have been there throughout their turmoils of the past and will stick by them in the future... I do not want them given a helping hand by the PL, as that would go against the principles and integrity of the game - admin , points deduction and a new owner who lives up to their responsibilities to the fans would be the best outcome for all. Afterall, do we want them to go tits up without the opportunity for revenge of the 4-1? These rivalries are what makes the game in this country - not the PL and the CL, but the history of clubs like us and pompey and a huge number of others...

Oh FFS, stop whinging about the coach price... we are going to Wembley - one of the few clubs that will have played in a final at the old Wembley, Cardiff and the New wembley! 8 months ago we were desperate for the club to survive, fans were donating cash, we were told teh club needs to live within its means so, so do you really begrudge your club maybe £50k tops in a profit on the coaches? Come on we should enjoy it.

Probably, but what I find incredulous (and this would be teh same for ANY other club), is why so many seem to becalling for sympathy for their plight!! FFS, they have themselves to blame by spending way more than income to try and buy success...just because they are in the prem should make feck all difference... jeez

Always better to sit on these things for a few days and then reflect - Though we showed that we can play a bit - James pulled off some good saves, but our finising was good league one standard - theirs was premiership against a solid but League 1 defense, so not a surprising result. I think we showed a lot of commitment for 80m minutes or so than ran out of steam chasing teh game so the scoreline reflects that, but we were easily the better side up until the 1-2, then its was a more open even affair... had it gone to 2-2 who knows, but I am proud of teh way they played and thats the most encouraging thing. We now need to try and keep that desire and hunger going into the last leg of the season. If we played like that every week we would get a playoff place - thats what Pards need to be getting them to believe and I hope the lads are not too down beat - we will get our chance for revenge at some point and I would not bet against us. So chin up lads, our performance deserves a positive response from fans, and just because it was pompey, does not mean we should treat it any worse than any other defeat in my book. Let them have their moment in the sun if they truely feel that beating a L1 side means that much to them... It simply shows how far they have fallen if thats the case, and I bet that deep downm, although they wont admit it, they know they rode their luck. More chance of Harry admiting he should shoulder alot of the blame for their overspend than their fans admiting that though!

Nope - that must have been the 1st Teb Bates Trophy against B Munich - they folk stand in the isles!

Pancakes 'Sgt Peppers LHCB' album cover... class that was.

The premierleague wont let them fail - too embarrassing for the league - they will get a hand out to get them to the seasons end....

Thing is I think Cortese looks at this as a matter of principle - its not about the 'seriousness' of the story, but about not doing as they were asked - so trust is broken down. The Echo should just have held fire as asked and then they would have enjoyed the trust and thus possibly exclusives in the future... Once again some **** made the wrong call and is now trying to get symapthy from their journo pals.