Gordon Mockles

Ladies and Gentlemen In this time of uncertainty and despair, I have to share some uplifting information with the forum. Namely, from the match at Fratton Park last night. Don’t skip past, as I think you’ll like the content. I was due to go to football match last night, for which I was lucky to receive tickets from a Chelsea season ticket holder friend. Chelski v…….The Skates. At first I thought, no chance! I am NOT going to that god forsaken hole. I reflected and changed my mind. I thought, “I may not get chance to see such stars as Chelsea line up” again (and it’s been ages since I watched a proper football match! LOL). Even in a Carling Cup tie, I knew they’d be full strength as they want trophies this year and it would be an experience to sit with Chelsea fans and watch them, hopefully, trounce the Skates. I could also teach ‘em some songs (I’ll get back to this bit). Anyhow, I acquired some tickets. Sadly, my missus was away on a seminar and I couldn’t make the game so I let a friend have the tickets. Her husband and son are both ardent Saints fans and I thought they’d enjoy the game (particularly the son seeing stars such as Lampard, Drogba, Terry, Ballack, BRIDGE, Kalou, Malouda, etc.) Gutted! I missed a cracker and I thought all the Saints fans on this forum would particularly like the transcript of the e-mail I received this morning (My Chelsea friend loved the response and it made our day!) I’m just chuffed my tickets were so well received and her son is still buzzing from it. That’s what football should be about. Maybe one day eh?! [E-mail as follows] ************ “Morning Gordon, Simon and William had a great time last night, they thoroughly enjoyed themselves. Will has a video of Lampard’s penalty and apparently Pompey didn’t have a shot on goal! Chelsea goalie had nothing to do all game and was waving to the Chelsea fans. They especially loved it when the Chelsea fans started singing “Oh when the Saints go marching in”!!! Pompey were crap apparently and Chelsea played like Brazil passing the ball around and doing the odd trick too! Don’t want to rub it in too much Gordon but thank you so much for letting us have the tickets.” ********** BRILLIANT! I’d have loved to have been there, especially after the 4th goal, when they started singing “Oh when the Saints….” Obviously, Saints are my team but Chelsea are the only team in the Premiership (bar the crapper new arrivals) I have not ever seen, hence why I went (and obviously, to see some good football and a team capable of trouncing the Skates was too tempting to pass!! Especially sitting there taunting them) Hope you enjoyed the e-mail as much as I did! CLASSIC! Oh, and I have been going to St Mary’s this year, before the whingers start. Kind regards Gordon

You're dead right, I'm a bit rusty on my company administration processes as it was years ago since a good friend succumbed to the dreaded bankruptcy (in the current financial climate, think the administrators [not on here so much] will be busy!) but, on reflection, that’s obvious. Feel a bit dense for no remembering but such is life. They get as much money for the creditors as poss. Usually selling the assets for a pittance mind. Worrying but, I believe, someone will wait in the wings to mop up before this happens. That’s just my view. Makes sense really (much like with Coventry).

That's really funny. Well done!

Some of your posts in the past have contained some relevance (the Askham debacle and share scandal) and some of your delving merited some interest. However, this wildly provocative post (since that seems your style) is your most ridiculous yet. It sort of amused me as I realise the intention. It is obviously intended to stir up emotions and evoke a response, in no matter what form. I don’t know why (as it’s a football forum and the content is wildly disrespectful to natives of Southampton) but I’ll treat it with the contempt it deserves as you do seem to like attention from these obscure and verbose statements. I'll dignify you a response however (sounds a bit serious, apologies - but I've a point that's close to my heart). Were you born in Southampton? Were your relations and ancestors from Southampton? It’s easy to sit and judge from your chair in front of your pc but, seeing as you were never in Southampton during the war, it’s pretty arrogant to judge. To suggest some tenuous bloodline and link is, frankly, propesterous. Slow day at work? LOL Fortunately, I wasn’t around then either but, unlike you, I appreciate the suffering of thousands of our people and respect my elders and what they went through to give us the life we have today. Sadly, no-one heeded the warnings of Enoch Powell and our country and, once great and powerful nation, has gone to rack and ruin and I believe we’ve seen our best years. But that’s another issue entirely and down to politics and poor governments. For what it’s worth, I don’t think I’d have stayed put in my home if it was in direct line of a German blitz but each to their own. I’d certainly not class myself a coward for doing what any self-respecting father would do for his family – protecting them. Your suggestion that some cowardly bloodline or inherent lack of a tough stance is wimp like is pathetic. Harsh but fair. You’ve obviously not thought things through. I know my Grandfather didn’t desert anyone when he was trekking across North Africa against the formidable forces of Rommel! Anyhow, the relevance of a community that suffered at the hands of a fascist dictator during a world war has no relevance to a…….chairman who hasn’t got a f*ckin clue and his p*ssed off half the fan base (as so many predicted). Maybe there’s some irony in the dictatorship but I’ll leave that for you to decide.

Ahhh, but Lowe and his proxy have not parted with their ‘much revered cash’ because it has not benefitted themselves (they put some money in reverse takeover but purely for a return). Obviously, they would never donate money to the club out of goodwill, or we’d not be in this position. In fact, the only people in recent years that have helped us, from their own pockets, is Crouch (and the Corbett family in the past). Since then, it’s been heads in the trough while our club disintegrates. I’m sure if admin. loomed and a tidy profit on a crumbling football club was available, yet again, Lowe and his proxy would somehow find some money for their own personal gain and some back door to wheedle their way in. It’s happened once, they are sure to try again (Jersey businessman anyone?) If rules or law prevent Lowe, then he’d be sure to be aware of it and have some divisive back up plan. History tells the truth and Wilde was his “tool” (how ironic! LOL) in this example – another could easily be in line for the next “Master Stroke”. However (money men correct me if I’m wrong), I would hope the administrator would take a dim view on Lowe and a good, fair view on the club and realise a solid backer (if there is one) is a more worthwhile approach for the business in comparison to Lowe’s 2 hugely disastrous tenures, ultimately leading us to oblivion (or admin.) Just my thoughts on the matter. Sorry if it was a bit anti-Lowe but I loath the guy. After all, his total disregard for the fans, his ineptitude and barrels of arrogance, his complete incompetency removing Pearson and implementing this failed youth experiment with the unproven Dutchies (and unwanted warranting by being plucked from the great football nation of Dubai!), it’s not surprising he’s unpopular. His smug grin on the television while our club falls apart didn’t win me over!

How do you know this Nick? We bring in youngsters - are you that sure they're on an absolute pittance or is it purely the same conjecture you reprimand others for? You buying all the 'Low(e) Road' & 'Wilde(ly) inept' reign propoganda BS?! Do all loans cost a fortune in this league? If we can't pay our footballers, we should give up now. We are, evidently, skint but then…miraculously, we brought in Schneiderlin, etc. for some kind of fee. Plus other wages on injured loans that would have better been served bringing in experience (If Pekhart is to be judged - freakin awful imho - lCan see why Spurs let him out - He's like a gangly Peter Crouch but without the touch or head for goal!) Loans don’t always cost much in wages (we would clearly not be in a position to pay the club fees). I don’t believe that all experienced pros demand mega-bucks (in modern footballing terms). It’s more likely, Lowe is not prepared to sanction anyone other the age of 23 and not pay any reasonable wage due to his own issues. The "we are broke" line is relevant but being abused imho. This is not an anti-Lowe rant. I don’t like the **** but he is controlling our club as chairman and we have now shipped out every decent player we had left so he is answerable. Deal with it! Someone once rather astutely commented (upon the much berated return of Rupert) that "Lowe was useless, got involved too much and a was nightmare with his transfer policy in the Premiership (when we had a small amount of money, but we had SOME) - What the hell will Lowe be like in the Championship with no money whatsoever?"… (other than selling anything not screwed down and absorbing the money into the moth eaten club coffers?!) Well, I forget who posted it but…you’ve got your answer! DIABOLICAL! I do not want to gloat. I am almost beyond caring as it’s too painful to watch. Pearson gone. Any seasoned pros who may have got us out of this quagmire (or glimmers of light) SOLD. The Dutch experiment as most sensible/realistic predicted FAILING BADLY and a make shift team of inexperienced youngsters (who have tried but you can’t blame them – they were not up to the standard and, those that may, cannot be thrust into an experiment like this and expected to carry the future of the club on their shoulders) having their confidence shattered, week by week (when you need old, wise heads to steady the ship – sadly – we have about 2/3 left – if fit!) It was an accident waiting to happen. I hope Mike Wilde’s happy for instigating the EGM and coming back to the club and removing the small amount of stability we pulled from the mud late last season. Deluded fool. Rupert had his last throw of the proverbial dice – now both f*ck off and never darken out dressing room again and pass your shares on to someone that cares about the future of the club, and some group that put fans in the equation and care about the football (and take that complete **** Guy Askham and his cohorts with you). I’ll feel bad for the genuine shareholders losing money, about half of the club (particularly Crouch, the Corbett’s, the fans, etc.) but I will laugh all the way to the pub when Lowe, Wilde, Askham, Richards, Wiseman and co lose their shares. Funny as f*ck! What goes around…. Let’s just hope, as admin approaches, someone steps in and makes an offer that then board have to accept. Knowing them, they’ll try and block that and would rather put us in admin to save face and protect their egos. RIP SFC. Let’s hope there is a new light on the horizon. One which should have arrived 10 years ago - with the Gavyn Davies/Frost consortium (but snakes in the grass - like Askham, esq. put their personal wealth ahead of the club and it’s never been the same since). If we can rid ourselves of these parasites, then maybe we can dust ourselves off from rock bottom and rebuild. Sometimes you have to properly reach rock bottom to start again. I just hope we can avoid admin. and offer the poor fans good times again. It’s going to take a lot to sort out the mess the dreadful boards have created over the past decade and more.

In theory, the idea of bringing on youth is good but it’s not a recipe to success in the manner in which Lowe has so whole-heartedly, naively and arrogantly jumped in the proverbial deep end, disregarding advice and lessons learnt from the past. I feel the St Mary’s board have entirely neglected warnings from predecessors (both staff – coaches and otherwise) and disposed of many of these obstacles. I don’t want politics to rear too much of an appearance but it’s certainly relevant in this case. We have disposed of virtually all our successful players and totally committed to the youth, without a seconds thought. They’ve not even used to the loan system to bring in steadying, older/more experienced pros (I concur, Cork is a good acquisition from what I’ve seen but Pullis and injured players is risky and stupid). I think we need to maintain the academy as it’s the life-blood of our club but the selling off of experienced professionals, such as Davies, Safri, esq. is both rash and fool hardy. Whilst I don’t deny, we have potential rising stars in Lallana, Schneidrlin and possible one or two others (bare in mind the promising youngsters like Cork, Pekhart, Gasmi are all loans), I don’t think thrusting them into a season like the long and arduous CCC is the way to approach it. Well, I take that back – it is good to play them and have them compete but, from history, not to rely too heavily on them as once they hit form, January is here and an offer comes in, they’re sold and you alienate a drastically falling fan base even more. Maybe it’s too late anyway. We all know the youth system is a farm. But, to what cost? We have virtually no-one left and what do we do once our last shining stars have gone? We’re left with…literally – NOTHING! Bare in mind it takes time to bring on the youth and no matter how hard you want someone to succeed, you can’t rush the scholars along and make them step up too quickly – if that was the case, every other club would adopt this ‘forward thinking policy’. For what it’s worth, I think Pearson had a good spirit in the squad and knew the English league and would have done well this season, if allowed the limited resources he requested – look at his start with Leicester. Still, that’s history. Poorvliet seems a good character with a good heart and at one with the youngsters but the games have shown he is adapting to our league (do we have time?) and his tactics may need to be changed as they’re not working and we’ve been easily figured out. I’d like 2 strikers as the current system is not working. We are very weak defensively (as I feared from day one – Surman is NOT cut out to play LB) and we have a lack of defenders and full backs – a huge mistake from the onset and yet another lesson which has not been learnt. Ok, I’m a fan but I feel (and I’m not alone) the full back issue was evident from day one and a stupid gamble (especially relying on Svensson – plain suicide and another lesson not learnt with Michael…again!) It’s proving the case a month or so into the season. I dread the state of the squad come new year. IMHO we totally lack firepower, have nowhere near enough men in the box (i.e. crosses coming in and only Mc Goldrick available, who is more often than not NOT in the area, causing a nuisance). I feel Jan has noticed some worrying trends, judging by statements and a shift in direction and wanting to swap players. It looks slightly desperate – I hope it isn’t. I believe Dave Mc Goldrick is poor and not up to it. I thought this previously but time has proved that. He may serve a purpose playing wide or behind the front man but relying on an unproven striker who had never made an impression or impact previously was stupid. He just doesn’t have that presence and killer instinct, his positioning alone. Could all the managers and coaches before been wrong? Lowe/Wilde seem to think so (or the shadowy Director of Football!) I believe, no offence Derry, you’ve swallowed the BS that Lowe and co have served. I don’t believe we had that many capable players. I believe we have some talent and we’ve a good history, but the system we have requires talented players and it’s a new set-up. I feel we need specialist players in positions, like ball winning, quick and nimble wing backs (Surman couldn’t be further from that). Some players can be moulded but some are just so clearly lacking in the attributes, it’s becoming quite apparent. Still, let’s concentrate on the better players and hope, somehow, Wotte and Jan can fill these gaps but I’m scared someone else is making decisions above their heads…Hockaday, Lowe? Who knows but it’s easy to guess. What the hell was Lowe doing pitch-side on the Sky game against QPR?! He dare not do that at St Mary’s. I thought directors take care of the business side eh?! Let’s hope today proves me wrong on some of those points anyway. COYS!

Very bigoted and VERY overly defensive, and rude too for that matter. “Chavvy idiots” – that sort of attitude has pangs of other dubious posters on this forum and one which is very snobbish (i.e. flat cap comments, etc.) Colours coming out SD? Certainly fits your profile and outlook, as your “Saggy t*tted sl*gs” comment suggested, some time back (referring to Southampton women did Sundance, old chap!) I’m sure it’s mainly baiting and people posting in an idealistic manner to which they imagine Lowe (or his associates) would purport. I don’t doubt many in Rupert’s circles look down on the “lunatic fringe” judging from past comments but, thankfully, it seems Rupert has decided to shut up this time around and the only talk we seem to get is people intent on stirring it up (such as the trolls). Let’s keep it football or conspiracy eh?! Rather than isolating classes and stereotypes, or defending people from unknown websites. GREAT POST!! Made my morning reading that as it makes me chuckle, the response that is. As you said inspector trousers (TSF super-sleuth), quite a long denial and very overtly defensive (they’d make a lousy poker player! LOL)…does make you wonder, using balanced reasoning, about the response…paranoid eh?! Who are those 1 or 2 posters though? Eh?! Once again, quite defensive Sundance, old chap – the internet is an incredibly large and diverse space, infinite one could say. Some PR or marketing company, having a website containing their contact details, are sure to realise the whole, WORLD WIDE web have access to such details (or they’d not have created the website) but I find it strange you are so defensive over an unknown entity, you should have never met. I expect they appreciated your concern but are NOT as concerned as you strangely seem to be. HEY! It’s free advertising for you, even if the customer base seems not to be your desired target/contingent (possibly beneath what you denote desirable). You could always bequeath the role to someone else… Amusing to say the least. Enjoy the game today, if you’re going!

In my original post I commented “Maybe I should judge Lancashire from games like Eastleigh but I don’t think he’s ready…”. That was meant to read “Maybe I should NOT” (as Oli had a very poor game against Eastleigh, totally lost my point there. Apologies). Slightly crucial typo but the new forum doesn’t seem to allow you to edit posts. Does it allow the function with the paid subscription, anyone? I also think the comment I made “very astute” was poorly worded but I was rush typing at the end of lunch. Not had much time free since, hence late reply. I realise Alpine may not win people over with his negative outlook (me too on many occasions for that matter) but I do find it infuriating when people blindly support a cause when, I feel, a more realistic, less rose-tinted view is better balanced. Only today I was scanning through posts and saw a comment “Let’s face it, if Lallana carries on the way he’s playing, he’ll be gone in January” (or any other player hitting form for that matter). Cynical but perfectly plausible from our club and boardroom history. I don’t see why people have a problem with comments like that. Truth too scary to face?! I was never inferring Davies was available straight away or in contention for QPR. Your misunderstanding old boy! Yes, he’s injured but not out for the season. I was under the impression he was out temporarily but if it is/was longer, then that was info. I wasn’t aware of. I still stand by my statement that selling Andrew Davies was a ridiculous mistake and we are perilously thin in defence (if you consider most of our back up is pretty inexperienced bar the injured seniors - Svensson who has a risky fitness record, Thomas out and Perry who is 34/35…forget his age) A.) As explained to Itchen, I am talking about over the course of the season, not immediately (and, as I understand, Davies only had a temporary injury although he did have surgery in the close season, which I believed he was on the road to recover with. If not, I find it strange that Stoke would have bought him injured – more our style! LOL) I am not sure if you took my words out of context, if it was our misunderstanding or if you’re both being deliberately obtuse. Only you/Itchen can answer that. B.) Not really. You're making assumptions that none of us actually know (hence my "Murky" comment). There is a thing called a contract although players often hold the cards but they ARE obligated to play to the best of their ability (Kind of contentious and funny when you consider things, they’re all in breach!) and are contract bound. We don’t have to sell everyone at the first offer and we WERE deliberately kept in the dark about the Davies transfer details which makes me suspicious. Why else would they be economical with the facts? You may think we’re strong at the back, or have good, strong & adequate cover. Using the word “plenty” is foolish imho. I disagree. Simple as that! I have mentioned 2/3 of our senior, central defenders are out injured (pray we get no more or that really could be game over with the loan window creaking slowly shut) and Perry can’t play constantly. I like Perry and Cork seems a good loan (all be it, short term unless his loan can be extended) but we are ludicrously tempting fate. Sunday's game with Holmes injury and Lancashire's red card is a prime example of the trials & tribulations of the Championship and one which I have previously expressed concerns over from the onset. No doom and gloom - perfectly acceptable concerns and foresight. This philosophy of “total football” may be all good and well but if you’re playing midfielders in defence, play ball winning midfielders who aren’t slow and easily over-run. As Surman has shown time and time again. Ok, I’ll give you that. The original post may have been over-dramatic but it’s a football forum for goodness sake, not Question Time! I don’t see your point. We all know clubs have injury problems. We seem to get more than most or excessively long lay offs for niggling injuries (but maybe that's my perception). Cork is a replacement for Svensson. Ok. But I’d rather have Cork as a full back seeing as that (to me) seems our weak area (where we are constantly getting over-run and figured out). Sadly, we now have a ban and injuries so we don’t have the luxury of playing Cork as full back. We need him alongside Perry (or the chosen CB). As you say, Thomas is injured so he’s not in contention, much like Svensson or Lancashire. Where in my post did I mention about adding 2 further centre halves to our squad? I merely expressed my disdain at the loss of Davies (as many other fans have). Regardless of reasoning, it’s a damn shame and annoying. I think I’ll ignore Weston’s comment seeing as he’s obviously borrowed my book on sarcasm! Still, thanks for forgiving me Weston! ;o) Maybe. Probably. I just sometimes read the odd comment, much like the 'Lallana being sold' thread, and agree with some comments but they are lost with people just attacking individuals without digesting the merits of what has actually been said. It happens a lot but, I suppose, that’s the internet for you. :gib:

It IS because we wanted to or Lowe would NOT have offloaded Pearson and replaced him with youth coaches (Poorvliet, Wotte, Hockaday & Henderson) and targeted nothing but youngsters, while offloading just about every single senior pro. Don’t give the worn out money line as the kids still need paying and no-one actually knows the full extent of the situation (like with Andy Davies departure). Most senior players were aware they each had a price and if offers came in, they’d go. False economy that it is. I’m not attacking the 'youth policy' decision (though I don’t agree to the stupidly risky extent to which we have executed this policy), merely highlighting the abundant dangers that now seem to be rearing their rather glaringly obvious head!! We are skint, that’s for sure. BUT, we could have still assembled a sensible balance of youth and experience, without breaking the bank, and used the loan system to bring in some steadying, more experiences stalwarts. I believe Pearson had this sensible plan and cared enough to leave a list or plan. It’s just that it was probably thrown straight in the bin! Still, that's old ground but I had to respond as your comment was just plain wrong...yet again! As for the Mills, Blackstock comment…isn’t hindsight a wonderful thing eh?!

After that challenge, you can't contest the red card. Late & stupidly wreckless! Our defence was bad enough with the marking for the opening goal but that challenge was plain suicide. Some on here expressed concerns over inexperience (me included), more worrying in defence (where we need experienced heads). I think this incident proves the serious cost of such decisions. A sure sign of over-enthusiastic, inexperienced youngsters making mistakes. I just hope the lads have a quick & steep learning curve & my pre-season concerns are all misfounded!

Pearson did very well to keep us up with the clueless bunch he inheritted. Why can't you acknowledge that?! You struggle to give him credit for his great start at Leicester. Strange view point. You say he has the better squad in the 1st division but the same could be said 4 Saints post Premiership relegation (when we floated just above the bottom) with Burley & look where Burley's demotivational & disasterous tenure got us!!! Tell you what, since you're a keen advocate for this 'we're broke/selling' policy. Let's wait until Jan, see what clubs want our only promising youth potentials, then play the stewards, pay 'em a tiny wage to cut costs..it's getting that way (in our defence alone)...forget about the competency & competition of the squad!! Makes sense to some eh?!

I’m actually 110% behind Alpine here. I realise loads on this forum seem to hate negative talk (living in denial about the state of our club?!) and many love to get on the backs of Alpine (or anyone remotely negative) but I do feel this thread is very astute and, CLEARLY, obvious to all and sundry which is why it makes it even more ridiculous we sold Davies. We kept off interest from Surman and people say the bank made the decision but we are deliberately kept in the dark and I refuse to believe ALL that is suggested on here. I was fuming upon hearing the news of this transfer. We only have half truths and murky rumour so it’s hard to form a solid reasoning. However - One fact remains (regardless of reasoning) – selling Andrew Davies was a ridiculous mistake and one which has plunged our club into massive uncertainty and trouble (not that we had enough!) and left us ridiculously exposed at the back. WE COULD ALL SEE THIS HAPPENING. Within a month of the onset isn’t good but it’s early days but intensely worrying. We are now without Thomas and Svensson and having to rely on unproven kids (certainly at this level, in defence, is suicide imho). Anyone with half a brain knew this would happen and we have numerous links and threads on this (which I commented on). When we are having to rely on a kid loaned from Chelsea, it’s concerning. Especially as Cork is only here until January. Maybe I should judge Lancashire from games like Eastleigh but I don’t think he’s ready. Dangerously risky to find out, but we have no choice now due to the decisions made by our board and management. I am quite worried about the QPR game to be fair. Anyhow, I hope all the forum members that watch the team in pink and red don’t all jump down down Alpine’s throat as it may distract the grounds staff (who may inadvertently lose control of the lawn mower, swerving into the advertising hoarding and knocking you off your fence!) I’ve not read all the responses yet but can see it’s started already. Alpine may have a negative outlook but LOOK at what they club have produced in recent years – being negative to be realistic (I don’t always agree with every point but it seems Alpine sometimes has a fair point but gets largely ignored cos of the single-minded bigots!) is NOT necessarily being wrong. It’s just not being deluded or in denial. Think before you post.

I hope the c*nt fails miserably, Scotland fail to qualify & the press finally get on Burley's back & give the p*ssed up waster the criticism & abuse he so thoroughly deserves! Not one for kicking someone when they're down or ganging up on a bandwagon but that t*sser completely mistreated our club with his inept & carefree incompetence & we still suffer with the legacy & remnants of cr*p he left behind. So, I won't feel a shred of sympathy when he, & his fellow sweaties, are crying into their empty tumblers of Glen Morangie!

Agreed that our right wing is lacking. I would like to see Dyer played more to build up his fitness and stake for a starting first team place. He looks threatening and has the pace to benefit this new system, just needs to train and practice on his weaknesses, like his crossing. With Holmes wide left and Dyer wide right, and Lallana in the hole, I feel we’ve got a decent attacking triangle. The striker just needs more support and not to sit so deep (or, if he doesn’t, he needs more support from Lallana & co) as we’ve been seriously lacking men in the box to get on the end of the crosses. I’d be interested to see, if only once or twice, how John manages up front with Mc G sat in the hole (or just off the front man) or alternatively Pekhart up front (with Mc G supporting/running off him). We certainly need to use our right wing more, balance the shape of the squad out, and to have men in the box (which has been seriously lacking) to catch the crosses, be a nuisance to defenders and SCORE GOALS (Too often we have had a pronged attack – i.e. a “V” formation – wings pushed forward [by either of the corner flags] – with the central players/striker sat deep, nearer the centre circle than the goal mouth!

(Continued)... Do you not think Jan would be happy and positive whoever he is given, regardless?! He seems that type of person (he’s hardly going to say they’re crap!) I’d like to think he (or Wotte) has identified areas of weakness in the squad and subsequently brought in players to assist but the quotes and statements Jan (himself) has made suggest this is NOT the case, it’s as though he’s been given the players (which would explain Pulis who, I feel, is a waste when we don’t have the capacity for waste – as they board so vehemently stated with the glut of senior pros we have shipped out). I can go and get links but I don’t think I need to overstate my point. I hope your optimistic, balanced view is right. Truly I do. However, the Lowe getting credit comment I have previously mentioned – he’s a lot to do to win favour back. Rightly so imho. I won’t just be verbose for the sake of it, so I will leave it there. Football and sport is more interesting than politics. However, I do feel that many are ENTIRELY JUSTIFIED in questioning WHO IS SIGNING THE PLAYERS as this is paramount to the future of the club. It needs to be a person with a good, football brain and good judgement and in conjunction with Poorvliet and his plans. I pray Romain, Morgan, Pekhart, esq. are a success and we’re able to sign the decent loanees, if successful (we’ll no doubt sell them as soon as they hit form and the gain the subsequent attention of clubs feeding of fthe meagre CCC clubs such as Saints). You give the club too much credit. What evidence suggests the signings have been “brought in have had a large amount of input and thought from JP and Wotte”????? The manager who picks the squad has commented on most new players and seems to have a distinct lack of knowledge. He didn’t even know much about losing his best players – ludicrous imho. Big Kev wouldn’t put up with that! LOL I like Jan’s candid, honest approach because it doesn’t cover things up, which more street-wise managers often use as a tactic. However, it does throw up some concerns to us fans. Considering the foreign loans we brought in, I agree with you in that possibly this was a result of input from JP or Wotte. I can’t be sure but I’d like to think so. Gasmi and Pekhart may have been brought in to add much needed fire power and competition for places. Jan states his desire to play midfielder in full back positions, yes. But, it would be much better to have ‘ball winning midfielders’ and players suited to marking, tracking attacking opposition and breaking up the play. Already this season, we have been exploited on occasions and most clubs are yet to notice our new system. We started well, but teams are wising up (hence Blackpool result imho) and I am concerned we are easy to figure out. As I have stated elsewhere, I love some of our slick passing and movement but I have concerns a.) If our young lads can sustain it for 90mins and are physical and strong enough b.) What happens if the opposition shut out Lallana, Holmes and Gillett (our playmakers) c.) If we are run ragged down the flanks against Surman, etc. and teams exploit this weakness d.) We need more firepower and more presence in the box (2 striker possibly) to get on the end of crosses and to get into danger areas to test the opposition, not pass into nomandsland. I’ve typed enough. Over and out. :smt109

Ridiculous! Comparing World Class footballers, such as Robinho and Ronaldo, with 2 unproven youngsters is ludicrous. Stupid even! In the example of Pulis – he has not made an impact or held a place (at 24yrs old) in any of the teams he’s played for. In fact, he’s been shipped around from club to club (on loan) and not really figured much in his father’s team. That doesn’t bode well for his demand in the starting eleven. Obviously, previous managers may have been wrong and overlooked the lad but do you honestly think ALL of those managers have been stupid & short-sighted & he’s really a super-talent in the waiting?! Look at the FACTS. ACTIONS SPEAK LOUDER THAN WORDS! Your analogy and comparison is so ridiculous your point has been totally completely obscured. If you knock that huge chip off your shoulder, some of you Lowe supporters may actually realise not everyone has been banging on about Lowe or individuals, just the management as an individual body (I avoided using names in parts of my post, amongst others). Let’s face it – we are a football club, run by a football board (apparently) so criticism and questioning, especially during such a ‘revolutionary’ metamorphosis is par for the course. When Rupert and Michael decided to come back, they knew what they were in for, hence why they sit behind the scenes and aren’t particularly vocal (not that Michael ever said much). I think people would still post criticism of tactics, systems, managerial decisions & transfer movements regardless of who ran our club, whether it be Lawrie Mac or Ronald Mc Donald! That’s football. If you don’t believe that, read any other football forum in the country (even the top clubs!) You have to face facts before you get over-defensive and sit on your Shetland Pony – Lowe isn’t popular and, due to historical events, probably won’t ever be. That’s life. You make your bed, you lay in it. Maybe, just maybe, if we won the league or gained promotion, had some money put in by (maybe by some of these cohorts who have benefitted so greatly from the club) and improved our bare knuckle youth squad (and share holders and past and present board members contributed), then maybe the fans would start to forgive and forget. However, I can’t see that happening. We live in hope. For the record, I like Poortvliet but I believe he’s a positive guy and would say he’s happy whoever he was given because, it seems quite clear, he is a yes man. That doesn’t make him a bad person. He’s probably one of the few people that would tolerate such a job in such trying circumstances. From my perspective, I thought we’d have been ok with Pearson (but let’s not get started on that, another contentious point done to death! Time moves on…) but now we have Jan & we all wish him success. It seems Nigel’s doing ok. Won 3-0 yesterday & top of the league. Well done to him. “Saint's sign players by based on requirements and finance” – really?! We didn’t last season and seem shy in the defence this time around. Why have we no recognised full backs or, at least, tackling/ball winners?! We have midfielders in the position (bar Cork – a loan). However, it’s good we tried to sign (apparently) Gerrard – a defender. We need a left back. Even Skacel would be an improvement as I think he serves a purpose in the position, he was very good there in the Derby play offs. If you’re sticking to the facts and not taking a totally one-sided point of view, you should consider we played some slick, excellent passing football first half against Birmingham for a PERIOD but they sorted their tactics second half, closed down the playmakers and totally run riot down our flanks and should have scored more were it not for some great last ditch defending and good stops by Davis.

If Jan is happy after watching the performances of Surman played as full back, then I am seriously concerned about his judgement and credibility. Don’t get me wrong, I quite like the bloke (Drew too) from what I have seen, but I am seriously asking questions if he doesn’t see our lack of established defence as a concern. Am I not alone in thinking our flanks are an obvious weakness (as they were from day 1) and an area we seriously need to tighten up?! Just the second half against Birmingham alone would have had me frantically scribbling in my notes, thinking tactics and formations, defensive duties and roles within the squad. Maybe Jan really has not choice and has to use what he has – but that is not totally the case as 2 injured players have been brought in through the loan system so there is no basis to say we did not have the wage bill to support bringing in a left back. Make of that what you will. Who is making the transfer decisions?! Certainly not the man responsible for the squad selection, management and tactics which, I feel, is ludicrous. Obviously, I am an arm chair fan and no little about football (as so eloquently inferred by the perpetually misfiring Professor yesterday! LOL). I didn’t feel the need to respond against a poster of the fore-mentioned ilk (although the irony of his moniker was amusing). It would clearly take too long, and be a fruitless task and waste of time, explaining the fundamentals to the fore-mentioned gentleman. http://www.saintsweb.co.uk/forum/showthread.php?t=1162&page=2 (it's mentioned enough on this thread) Surman is NOT a defender, he's slow, doesn't track back, continually gets outpaced and over-run, leaving Svensson and Perry dangerously exposed. Drew' passes a good ball but he is an attacking minded lad – he is wasted in a full back position. IMHO, Key assets of wing backs are tackling and pace, being able to bomb forward and change defence to attack (must like Bale did). This Dutch system may yet work if we have the right players, not just making do with what we have (or are given). That seems the crux of our problem, along with having sold the last of our established talent, leaving the youngsters with few steadying heads (bar Svensson and Perry in defence) marshalling the rest of the open field. Euell showed that last night in the reserves. How some can just sit on their fence and swallow all the sh*t they're spoon fed is beyond me. Don't you have standards or would you still smile and clap as we fell from division, to division, to obscurity? No, just me then!!

Considering the date, most agents, club staff & managers (or chairmen!!!) would be in their offices & making phonecalls to frantically conclude transfers before the transfer deadline at midnight. Seeing as our great leaders have sold every player not nailed down to the subs bench (& we're left with the dross seniors no-one rightly wants), there's not really much established talent left so it's no surprise it's quiet!

Indeed. I am pleased to see Gasmi arrive, if he recovers quickly and offers us some much need attacking prowess (which we so clearly lack – we can’t even spearhead attacks or have a striker to get in the area for crosses) then this is a good thing but am I not right in being extremely concerned over this injured player transfer policy?! Ok, we have NOT signed the player on a permanent and his recovery is, reportedly, being funded by Strasburg. Fair enough. But it seems crazy to sign injured players. I thought Pullis was bad enough – a poor quality player no-one wanted, plus he’s injured. Ridiculous. I judge on face value but I have to listen to what I am told from fans who supported the teams Pullis played for as they were only giving their honest opinion which wasn’t glowing in praise. I am curious as to who is making these stupid decisions?! Surely we are broke and can’t afford to waste the wage bill so every decision is key. Right now – I’m not seeing too many wise decisions. I don’t want to turn this thread into more, incessant, Chairmen or Board bashing but, ultimately, they are responsible for our club and, after the ridiculous Delgado affair, do this club ever bloody learn? It seems arrogance is again in abundance as the board do NOT seem to listen or ever learn. Look at last season – we had no defensive cover, were nearly relegated and this season….same situation. I am not being negative or doom mongering – I am stating clear and obvious concerns based on cold, hard fact. I don’t want to hear the worn out “bank manager making decisions” line as he, clearly, is not running the entire club and someone is making these football decisions. You don’t need to be Hercule Poirot to work out who!! It certainly isn’t Poortvliet, judging by his bewildered press statements and total lack of insight into our players and transfer movements. Maybe it’s even Wilde – who knows?! Whoever, he needs shooting. I find this trend extremely worrying as a manager should decide and pick his team, know their strengths and weakness and what he needs to do to address obvious weaknesses and strengthening vital positions. Right now, I’m not seeing a lot of sense (bar Cork who we have until January). We need full backs. End of story. We have done since day one. Burley was an idiot. Jan, I feel, is not (but he doesn’t have any power or influence with our board. - i.e. he IS, as many predicted, a man with a very tough job and purely a yes man from my observations). I am glad we have loaned in Cork (I would have liked to have seen him play Saturday but that’s the manager’s choice). I feel the kids draughted in to play defence aren’t up to it. Surman has proved, in each game, he is certainly not a full back and leaves us stupidly exposed time and time again. Who else agrees? He needs to be replaced and we need to find a suitable left back. Surman is slow, attacking minding, NOT defensive minded AT ALL and I have seen him frequently get caught, he doesn’t track players back and doesn’t have the reading of the game (Defensively) to mark wingers or forwards and this was exploited massively second half against Brum. Blackpool too to some extent. His slow defensive reactions and lack of pace leave our centre backs dangerously exposed, and he’s not a natural tackler/ball winner. If we signed one or two positions, these are the most critical. FULL BACKS. There is still time but I don’t hold hope or it would have been done by now. Anyone with half a football brain would know and address this glaringly obvious issue from the onset (and I fathom to understand why we have not). It’s suicide. No plainer language than that. After Saturday’s pitiful effort and watching Birmingham previously, it seems abundantly clear to me (as my previous concerns strongly stated – we desperately need full backs). I agree, we also need a forward as we lack fire power, totally (Gasmi is an attacking midfielder, good competition for Lallana imho, if fit and peforming). Playing one up front is a mistake imho (I’d play John with Mc G running off him) but that’s another issue. I was dubious coming into the long, arduous CCC season with our heavy reliance on children (I didn’t expect it to be 99.5% kids) but I thought I would reserve judgement until it had started. It has started, and we are showing glaringly obvious frailties. I love our youthful determination and slick passing (when we do), compared with the lack lustre, pitiful displays from the aging pros last season (happy to pick up a pay cheque, minimal effort). However, We are seemingly too easily muscled off the ball and seem to lack a plan b. Jan doesn’t have time to learn – the season is upon us. We need older heads to settle the youngsters and offer support and assistance and much needed steel and experience. I thought we would use the loan system to address this obvious problem and bring in experience (Vignal for example) but it seems the management (notice I’ve avoided using Lowe’s name for a change) have other plans and have ENTIRELY relied on the kids which, I feel, may be too much pressure for young, inexperienced football brains (booing on Saturday was harsh and stupid – fans take note. We are not Cardiff [who also booed Jones]) Time will tell. Let’s hope I am wrong. I loved some of the passing movement in the earlier games but we need fire power and we need full backs. I hope we address the problem as it’s a long season. Am I right in thinking we have a few more weeks to secure domestic loans?! (It’s just the foreign loans that cease along with permanent transfers at midnight) Come on Saints – address the weaknesses. If we can afford Gasmi, I am sure we can afford a full back (and I pray we offload that moody, belligerent f*cker with an attitude problem – Skacel) I’d be shot of Euell and BWP too but no-one, except possibly Luggy, wants them. Speaks volumes to me. Another Burley Blunder. His dreadful enigma will haunt us for longer yet. Don’t waste our wage bill on players we don’t need or don’t cut the mustard. If Surman takes a knock (not that he should be played in LB), what cover have we got? You know our injury record and fondness for physios to keep players out for ages. Mental. Good luck with the injured new boys and I hope they recover quickly. PLEASE, someone, bring in a half decent left back and stop playing Surman there.

Seeing as we only have Cork until January, that could be tricky (unless we're lucky enough to get an extension). Don't mean that to sound sarky. Svensson will need resting from time to time so I am unsure. Thomas is back up but, seeing as we lost Davies, it's a tricky one. Not seen Cork enough but I feel he'll be better served as a full back, seeing as we're thin in this area (well, thin in defence imho) I've a feeling, with injuries, Wotton will be draughted in and I pray Svensson stays injury free as we could struggle once the season starts to take it's toll. I think Perry will be a main stay alongside Svensson, who will be rotated and the use of the youth, gradually, alongside Michael. What natural position is Lancarshire?

Firstly, I’m a Saints fan, not an anti-Lowe poster (but you can give me that label if it makes you feel better, sat up on your perch). Vociferous – Well, I do go off on a tangent, and in excess length, at times so I can live with that. Part of may make up as a person. Regarding Lowe - I just don’t like nor trust the bloke, nor Wilde. I think I, amongst others, have more than enough reason, reflecting on track records and using my adult skills of reasoned deduction. Not much irony in our current success of a couple of wins – it’s a long slog but I’m as happy as any if we do well and I like our new found passing movement and optimism (I’m happiest against knocking out Brum after initially losing – that says a lot about a manager and the team’s character imho). Overall, comparing our play to the totally unacceptable tenure of that drunken imbecile, Burley, is foolish. That was totally unacceptable and I never let my personal expectations for our club slip as so many did. Maybe I have higher standards but wanting "reasonable football" isn't that much to ask. Agreed - it's been absent since we were relegated. However, regardless of what happens at SFC - It won’t change my views but Rupert or Michael Wilde. I still don’t trust them but that is football politics. Boring. My dislike is, of course, my choice, my opinion. Simple really. As for verging on paranoia about PR plants, it’s a thin line at times and I certainly read, digest and read again (between the lines, not just the nice comments) and there is certainly a suspect element to TSF. If you chose to label that paranoia, then that’s your misguided view. There are idiots, there are clever people, there are bulk standard fans, there are die hard fans, there are arm-chair fans and there are wind up merchants (like that odd Scooby character people seem to delight in dignifying with a response – suppose it does entertain on occasions) but there are certainly some people with a surreptitious agenda and there is a reason for that. Maybe you can’t see that or chose not to, or it’s easier to criticise me while you sit on your fence. Regardless, it doesn’t REALLY matter. In fairness Alain, from most of your replies in the past, you’ve disagreed with my opinion. That’s fine. Your choice. Feel free to oppose my opinion or challenge away. It is a football forum. . If you don’t like the strong words I utter against the board or management (from our rapturous levels of success), then you’re welcome to continue your mildly patronising histrionics! Makes me chuckle you talk about arrogance though, considering your French moniker and the content of your reply. Overall, I’m enjoying the football but I’m not about to start blowing Lowe’s trumpet. I’ll leave that to Scooby, Sundance, Buctootim, Nick, your good self and the others ‘Lowe types’ that are happy to forgive and forget (it’s funny though and not me being contentious or avidly anti-Lowe but I seldom meet as many pro-Lowe’s in the pub, at the game or out in the “real world” LOL) Forgive and forget – not me. I just won’t but I have different principals to you but I will enjoy the football. Also, I don’t mean to bring up all the tired and worn out Lowe this, Lowe that cr*p. It’s been done. However, you did challenge some of my points so I feel it’s only fair to reply. Let’s hope we do get some good news and some success, maybe one day a takeover (but I won’t hold my breath). I just don’t like parasites you can’t shake off. Enjoy the game Saturday!! COYS.

Yep, and then the “I know best/over-ruling medical staff” with Delgado but it’s old, worn out, news (won’t get Um started although he’s now gone remarkably quiet and probably had enough of the infiltrated forum plants). Being realistic (I know that’s a scary world to many on here) - We’d not be in the league and situation we are currently in IF our board and chairman had some brains and ambition for the club previously and didn’t just “Make do” as Saints always had (and used the club as an ego and business playground). Inspirational…….NOT! Let’s just survive, put no money in, not care about the FOOTBALL, sell our best stars/up and coming youth, turn down potential gems due to having to pay more than a pittance and we’ll survive…….survived before, we’ll be complacent, it won’t affect Saints – we are a small club, we have to sell everyone, we’ve been in the top flight for……..OH SH*T! We’re relegated! Still, that’s history now. Nice to hear Jan now aim higher and give us a target and motivation, if they’re not hollow words. We’ve always been a club of mediocrity and we need big leadership (not Lowe and Wilde I may add) and big characters and leaders to change things, and an appetite for success and ambition. We’re playing better football now and I hope we can sustain results. I’m mildly concerned about transfer policy (but not overly as we have NO MONEY). Relevant but done to death (i.e. Lowe signing players). These are the problems we WILL encounter with Lowe and Poortvliet, Wotte and Hockaday as ‘yes men’ but there’s not a lot we, as fans, can do about that (and we knew this would happen). I’m sure some of the PR plants will come up with some “flat cap” nonsense but the more astute posters would be wise to keep on topic and totally ignore the inflammatory baiting. We have to swallow and take what we’re given. Sadly, many fans have chosen enough is enough after 5 years of constant bad news and battling in the boardroom, resulting in the unpopular duo of Lowe and Wilde returning and all of our remaining professionals of any worth sold. You couldn’t have written it any worse but the football is our true shared passion and, maybe, if we perform well and produce “GOOD FOOTBALL” then hopefully fans will come back (again, I understand if they chose principles seeing as some feel the duo have come back for ulterior motives, I’m avoiding political talk as it’s boring). Let’s have no sl*gging off of the stay away fans though (seeing as many that post probably criticise from their pc but don’t attend themselves) as they do have reason. I don’t deplore that as they’ve every right to have their principles and stay away. Yes, it hits the club coffers but, from the historical actions of the guardians/boards of our club, they’d be massive hypocrites to chastise those very fans after what they’ve been served from the self-serving ambassadors that purported to caring about our club. OOPS! WENT OFF ON ONE THEN! Apolgies. I’d definitely like to see another player, I’d have preferred a left back or versatile left footed/centre back defender but seems not to be happening. Another midfielder, an attacking back up for Lallana (as Euell seems out of favour and is pretty dire imho) or a Berkovic style player would be ideal but in an ideal world…………. Looking forward to Saturday – quite a lot! These are the teams we SHOULD pick up points against (and failed drastically under that imbecile Burley!) COYS

Yeah, don't listen to the fans who actually watch him play - listen to the chairmen or staff who say what they're told or what they want us to read. Utter b*llocks! The happy clappy, swallow whatever they're given brigade are out in full tonight. For you information, there's a reason why Pullis has not played much for Stoke...because he is CR*P! Forget nepotism, look at the stats so many on here like to do (despite not always telling the full story - like with Pearson), read his track record, read reports of games he HAS played in, performance notes. There's a reason he's not really made it so far. It's because he doesn't really have the talent to break through and step up a level. I realise some players slip through the net but do you honestly believe he's deliberately played like blindfolded monkey with a gammy ankle for a reason? Nope! Me neither!! Dutch Youth Team professionals cannot make a cr*p player good and I think it's a silly move, if true. He'd have been noticed and picked up if he had any discernible talent. Sorry boy, but the hard facts of life. I also heard Peckhart is like Rasiak - Hope they don't mean slow, clumsy and lazy. I was keen on a new striker so will judge for myself. I want trust my Spurs supporting mates just yet but I hope he isn't another cart horse - we need more pace up front!!

Not really. People are very much jumping the gun and getting very carried away. I'm all for criticism when needed but never forget credit where it IS deserved but this is certainly not the case yet. I’m dead chuffed for the result although I only read reports so can’t judge more than that. Face value and all. Not one to be negative for the sake of it but a better test will be tonight (after being outdone tactically last time v Brum – big test for Jan to change shape and counter City as they totally outdid us 2nd half while we had no forward players) and after Blackpool will be interesting (who I consider a mediocre CCC team at that). Frankly, one win against a struggling side who are clearly out of form and class (away or not) does not constitute the amount of over the top excited rants. It’s lovely to read, don’t get me wrong, and I truly don’t mean to be a kill joy as it does deserve praise, just a bit more level headed and more realistic. If we win, then play well against Brum Saturday then I’ll be joining in but it IS early days and Lowe has certainly not done enough to merit much applause. He had a hell of a lot to make up for, unless memories are short and optimism thoroughly misplaced. Still, let’s wish ‘em luck (I’m yet to check the Derby highlights). I’ll be there in the Chapel Saturday, sadly not tonight due to family commitments. COYS and let’s hope Saints are a bit more physical tonight, don’t tire gone 70mins and get roasted down the flanks constantly (maybe Cork can help and Surman can tackle and not leave us exposed). We really need to have learnt QUICKLY and be much more imposing this match. It’s a steep learning curve and a crucial one. Changing the subject – I saw an interesting article today from Mr ‘Auto Trader’ Madejski (very relevant and all too familiar) on player wages and the financial structure of CCC and football in general. Good to know others struggle and even Newcastle didn’t sell out Saturday. Has the football bubble finally burst and WILL the wage ceiling collapse (following wage packages like Frank Lampard – crazy for 5 years plus or whatever it is on 150K. I’d not pay a 35 year old 150K a week! Especially Lampard! Shows what a good agent can do eh?! Ridiculous!) http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/paulfletcher/2008/08/madjeski_right_to_hit_out_at_w.html