Lord Duckhunter

So what should Isreal have done after Saturday’s attacks?

So what proportional action should Isreal have taken. I keep reading about the response being disproportionate, so what was a proportional response? Nobody saying Isreal acted disproportionately has answered that.

So what would you call proportionately, how do you think Isreal should have acted? Asked the UN to pass a resolution maybe. Perhaps negotiate with the “militants” & kindly ask them to hand over the perpetrators so they could be put on trial in Israel. What do you consider proportionate and what action do you think Isreal should have taken to maintain the delicate “peace” that existed in the area last Friday.

I’ve amended it for you…

Yes, it is a bit hard to understand. Probably because it’s not true.

Simpson is full of shit. I’ve posted examples of the BBC naming various groups as terrorists, so it’s not true they never call anyone by that name. And Simpson himself called the Charlie Hebdo murderers terrorists as well as the “ militant “ the Millwall bloke done on London Bridge. Other than that, good point well made.

It’s not just the Government though is it? Kier Starmer has called for the BBC to call them terrorists. One thing for sure had Jewish citizens attacked Muslims at a music festival, dragged them back to Isreal after raping them, murdering their babies and the elderly, you and The BBC would damn we’ll call them terrorists. And you’re the one preaching about “double standards” in the media?

It’s interesting that the usual suspects don’t seem to be critical of Egypt, who could open their border & help the relive the suffering of their Arab brothers.

Do you not not understand, these 2 statements are completely contradictory. Isreal will never be safe with those original borders, the country could easily be split by invading forces. They are not just areas the Israelis fancy moving into, they are important strategic areas which the Israelis need some degree of control over to keep the rest of the country safe.

Fuck me, you couldn’t make it up.

I watched the first one last night & thought it was shite. Coogan was very good, but it wasn’t subtle enough, and the characters were siloed into “good” or “idiot”. Fucking hell, even Stevie Wonder could have seen what he was up to if that was how he carried on from the get-go.

The reason that there will never be a 2 state solution is one side will not accept the right of the other to exist. As you rightly said, a fragile, unofficial 2 state solution existed for a number of years and this latest Hamas attack was probably a reaction to that. How on earth can the Israelis contemplate living beside people who want to murder each & every one of them. Why would you expect the Israelis to take their foot off the throat of their enemies, when that enemy want them wiped off the face of the earth. If the displaced people were given a homeland, do you think they will live peacefully beside Israel? Of course they won’t, because too many of them want Jews wiped out totally. We’ve seen in Northern Ireland & in the Balkans that counties can move on from horrendous acts and injustices, move on from hatred inflicted on each other. Uneasy peace and reconciliation can take place, but not when one side is unwilling to let the other exist and is quite prepared to murder each and every last one of them. Isreal could flatten & wipe out every single person living in Gaza. It won’t, but it could. If the other side could do that to Isreal, do you really believe they wouldn’t do it? This time last week I was drinking along Rothschild Boulevard, and the people of Gaza weren’t being bombed. The reason that changed is because of Hamas, and the fact that Hamas deliberately hide amongst innocent people. They provoked this & they are ultimately to blame for the death and destruction reaped upon Gaza at the moment.

When 7/7 happened I don’t recall too many people saying “both sides are to blame” because of our war in Iraq (which many considered evil & illegal). Everybody who wants normalisation of this area needs to accept that Hamas & Hamas alone is responsible for pushing that back a generation. Many gulf states were putting their countries on a course towards acceptance and cooperation with Israel, that is now clearly impossible as Arab nations can not do so in light of the Israeli response to this. The Egyptians response to this is very telling seeing as they also have a border with Gaza & a means of escape for all these women & children being pummelled.

To be fair to the guy, saving 4 in a row is the form of his life.

Absolutely spot on. There is no equivalence between the two sides in this particular outbreak, anymore than the 9/11 bombers were legitimately fighting back against American excess around the globe. The Israelis are facing an enemy who want every single Jew wiped off the face of the earth. So they will use any ruthless or barbaric tactic to ensure the survival of The Jewish state, because without one they will never be truly safe. The appalling anti semitic treatment they get in what are supposed to be modern liberal democracies is chilling, from celebrating terrorism against them on London streets, to people singing “gas the Jews” on the steps of Sydney Opera house. Is it no wonder they will do anything to eradicate these monsters and want a safe haven for Jews if they ever needed it. They are the only democracy in the middle east, a country that is tolerant of homosexuality, a country where women are encouraged to be whatever they want to be. Yet so called “progressives” consider them as bad as medieval savages who live in the dark ages.

He said if Baz wasn’t here he’d like to buy him. He’s either an idiot or a liar.

Thank you. They want an escalation, they want other supportive countries and terrorist groups to rise up against Isreal. There’s absolutely no way they didn’t expect this response. As other posters have said, it’s killed any agreement/ closer ties with The Saudis & other Arab nations. Peace co operation with other states is pretty much dead in the water now. You can not put the genie back in the bottle, we are where we are, we can’t return to the 1940’s. Rightly, or wrongly, Isreal exists and will exist forever more. There can be no peace until Israel’s enemies accept that fact. No peace until they are willing to live alongside a Jewish state.

Yes finally got out. The best bit of advice I’ve ever received was given to me on Saturday, “Book on El Al asap”. They were about the only ones leaving & there was mayhem at the airport. Sirens going off constantly was the most frightening thing I’ve ever suffered, genuinely terrifying as we made our way to safe shelter in airport. Thank fuck for the Iron Dome, because they were firing rockets at the terminals. Most frightening moments were on the bus from terminal 1 to terminal 3 (which takes about 20 mins) & when we were sat on a plane for an hour and a half before finally taking off. The airlines that cancelled were an absolute disgrace, not for cancelling I get why they did that, but their communication & customer service horrendous. Nobody had a fucking clue what was going on, the Israeli staff were superb, but overwhelmed. Nobody could speak to their airlines, didn’t know whether they needed to make their own way home, contact the consulate or sit tight. There were people who had flown in early Sat, who hadn’t left the airport & were trying to get back out. The screens on the seat in front had a airplane tracker on & when I woke up from a quick Kip & saw we were over Cyprus it was a moment of relief like I’ve never felt before. As for the conflict. No matter what has gone on before, this particular escalation is the fault of one group of people, Hamas. They are responsible for what is happening now. They knew what the Israeli Government’s response would be, and still went ahead with this barbaric attack on innocent people, including children, and the elderly. They actually wanted this response . When I dropped the hire car back the guy said something to me that sums it up. He said that if they can the Israeli forces will wipe Hamas off the face of the Earth. That if they could, they would murder every single Hamas member. However, Hamas would like to wipe Isreal off the face of the earth, and if they could, they would murder every single Jewish person. That is the profound difference between the sides in this conflict. If the Jewish people did ever give the land back to the Palestines, these fucking animals wouldn’t give up killing Jews. If every Israeli moved to The USA these animals would still try and murder them over there. I spoke to a lot of Israelis at the airport as there really was fuck all else to do. The general consensus was they don’t want revenge on the Palestinian people, they want revenge on Hamas. But accept innocent Palestinians are going to die in great numbers to get that revenge. They would rather innocents that have murderous animals living amongst them, die, than innocent Israeli’s die. I’m not debating the rights or wrongs of that, just giving you a little glimpse into the mindset of most Israelis I talked to.

He’ll score a hatful in training if they are.

Not when we’ve lost 4 in a row I fucking wouldn’t. It’s like saying “I’d take 2 putting on that green”, after taking 5 shots to get there. You certainly wouldn’t take 7 points from the last 7 games, any day of the week

I read somewhere that because we use a different ball & it’s tied in to a sponsorship deal (I think it’s Nike but could be wrong) we cant use it. The ball we use hasn’t been authorised to use the chip needed and therefore we’d need to pay out to break the current ball contract, before using the ball that can put chip in. Don’t know if it’s true, & cant remember where I read it, but wouldn’t surprise me. Money rules everything in our game.

Do think there has been one game he’s played in where the opposing supporters would have swapped keepers? He’s probably played against 40 different teams for us and I doubt one of those 40 sides wished he was in nets rather than their keeper. Not one.

If he was nets for them, do you think we’d have won?

I wasn’t there today, but by all accounts we had a lot of chances. A question for those that did see it. If you swapped keepers would the score still have been 1-1. As Baz’s fan boys don’t seem to like the “shots on target saved” stats, perhaps we could ask that particular question every week instead.