St Marco

Indeed But i think we all knew they were cost cutting. They took many different actions to do that such as shutting the corners. But if these numbers are correct then that means they actually increased our debt not decreased it such was our assumption. For me the question then becomes is that increase 100% purely down to just the debts interest? I.e because we had a £27m debt we have to probably assume we have to pay interest on that. So is the increase just down to that? Which if it is leads me to believe that the only way this club was going to avoid admin in Lowes return was to sell players in the jan window. The fact we didn't sell anyone might have been a key factor in the bank saying enough is enough. But realisticly if we do look at our players who we could of sold only really Davis,Lallana and Surman stand out. Davis at that point could speak to other clubs if he wanted anyway so doubt he could of had a big fee due to contract expiring. Surman and Lallana on the other hand is a big question mark. Both have a lot of potential even if at that point were not playing so great. If we had got the offers in how much would of made a difference? I really wonder how much doing the dutch way cost the club. We had something like 6 guys come in behind the scenes. They all have to be paid. Then add to that the signings of players, some on loans and some on permanent deals. Didn't someone say we paid £200k to agents in the last 5 months or something? I guess we will never know now what the cost of this approach was in terms of actual figures.

Have to agree with Offix. Nobody wanted this club to go into admin, and if they did they never cared about this club. But the reason for going into admin was inevitable with the return of Lowe and Wilde. They decided to come back with no money, no real plan, and a change in football system. The club needed investment. That was the only way this club would of continued. Lowe has never put money into the club nor found investment. Wilde has never put money into the club or found investment. The two previous boards both said without investment this club is fooked. The old board found Sisu who would of put £20m into the club. They rejected it. Crouch's board were seeking investment and had numerous discussions with groups. When Lowe and Wilde returned the 1st thing they did was to stop talking to investors saying "time to put up or shut up". They thought they could fix the problems in house and without the need for investment. So i myself am not pro-admin, but i find it tragic that the only way Lowe would give up on his grasp of power is for this to happen. If this club was put into admin a year or so ago as the admin team said "we would be very confident of finding a buyer as Southampton FC is a lucrative prospect". If Lowe had not returned and we acted then to sell as Crouch was trying then i do not think we would be where we are now. I still think we will be bought out and we will be ok. Just it will not be by some Paul Allen with someone who can plough millions into the club, invest in better players and so on. We will need to re-build pretty much from scratch. But we all knew that was coming.

So from that it is clear that only Jones remains with Pointon guy as directors of the club. Meaning Wilde,Lowe,Crouch etc are all now 100% gone from all of the boards right?

Cheers Danny

How about nickmane Phoneix as in rise up from the ashes and all that? Maybe a bit too American for us lot Would have to be The Saints surely? Or is that copyrighted? As for team colours Home Kit Red and White and away kit White and Red? Manager would have to be MLT or someone who means a lot to us. Someone who can bring back the old fighting spirit.

I 100% agree with you Minty and i feel the same. At the end of the day it does not matter because ultimatly were now in admin. But to answer the question that i put i found the results for November 2008 annual report http://www.saintsfc.co.uk/uploads/documents/nov_08/sfc_1227479896_Southampton_Leisure_Holdings_p.doc It says in there our Net Debt was £27.5m. So in the past 4 months our Net debt must have increased by at least £2.5m if what that admin guy said was correct in that we owe £30m+. I think the important thing is that we now all just do our bit by getting to the games and help the lads by cheering them on. Until we know what the football league will do on tues we must assume we have not been docked and thus can still stay up.

Yes you suck pancake and you just shown why. Rather then have an inch of intelligence you press the insult button. You don't have the brain power to be a mod. For example you create a thread saying pretty much "admin team out" and you say im the one who is off school on holiday? That is severe double standards you got there Pancake. So i must be a kid for starting a thread to try and work out in the year Lowe and Wilde returned we saved how much money? That is an important question because if as Ponty says they actually reduced the debt by 30% then they did a good job. Admin was inevitable. But hey throw some more insults Pancake, comment on my spelling as i could use a spelling teacher now that im not at school.

Can you not see the difference between the threads? You should step down as a mod Pancake as you suck at it. The debt is different from "what is going on at the club". It is about what has happened in the last year in Lowe and Wildes tenure. It has nowt to do with admin, points being docked, Lowe resigning etc etc. It has to do with the figures of debt from before they returned and after they returned. Thus we can judge if they did good or bad from that.

Everyone was saying Lowe and Wilde were saving the club money but if im right was our debt not at £27m in the last report? If what the admin guy said in the conference that we "have a debt over £30m" then they did not save us anything and to the contrary increased spending.

To be fair i don't really think you can say the anti Lowe group got their wish. My wish was for Lowe to not return to the club in the 1st place. To me it seems a damn shame that the only way he would leave would be for the club to get to the level it is at now. We all lose because of it. That does not make me happy one bit. It makes me angry that things have got this far. I don't think any Saints fan "wished for this". In regards to Wotte i think he has to stay. Things must try and stay as normal as possible and right now he is the coach. He knows the players and he is doing okay thus far. Staying up now is the only thing that should matter to us fans. As hard as it will be we need to leave the politics until after we are either safe or we are down. Until then everyone including the idiots who come on this website just to cause trouble must get behind the team.

Cheers for that Nick So if we have 21 days to find investment and we do manage to find it; does that then mean we escape the points deduction even if the football league find us guilty of breaking the rule?

All they said on SSN was that the Football League would not be held to saying Saints would avoid the points penalty. Listening to the brothers on radio hampshire might be interesting tonight.

Just about to come on. The girl (who is well fit btw) said "Find out why Saints could be docked points when we come back".......Maybe they not heard about our plan?

Cheers Clapham So basically everything can stay as it is for up to 2 weeks then if no money has been found will mean the club goes into admin? I had heard that Begbies Traynor were going to step in and do the admin. I think i read that on the Times piece. Another question is if the club goes into protection and the bank won't be paying anymore money does this also mean the players/staff will continue to be paid or does it mean they won't? Because if they don't get paid isn't there some sort of football rule where if you haven't been paid for a period of time you are free to leave?

care to expand on that?

Cricket?!! THIS GUYS NOT ONE OF US!!

Ah im guessing Pancake is a Nick supporter then?

What worries me is the potential **** storms that could follow us avoiding it. Say we do survive (it is still possible) and stay up. And say a club goes down by like a point difference. They could then sue the league Sheff Utd style for not docking points etc. Especially if going down then leads them to financial ruin. Reading through the Derby case it is very clear that the club was Bought by a consortium and some of the debts were transfered which was probably why the creditors agreed to it. Now what i don't get is the time frame for that. It sounds pretty instant. I.e they announced going under then were bought out a few minutes later. How long are we able to stay in our state of limbo before we have to declare admin? If at that point we have not been sold or received any financial investments won't that mean the PLC and SLH will both go into admin as i doubt the PLC will have the funds to keep the club afloat?

I think this game just went to a whole new level The atmosphere win or lose will be very strange. I really hope it doesnt get ugly but i guess if we lose/draw it could ignite the bad feeling. Club bankrupt, could be going into admin, could be getting a points deduction, and losing to Charlton all in one week.... I still think we will win though! COYR

We'll done Barfy I still not completed it yet. Taking my sweet time! Love the game. MP is pretty awesome.

"I think everyone will be shocked. People I speak to just don't believe a club the size of Southampton would do this. Attendances have dropped below the 15,000 mark at one stage and many supporters have said 'I'm not putting my money into Rupert Lowe etc' on the basis that they don't realise how desperate this is. "Now we know how desperate it is. No Saints supporter can turn round and say 'I didn't realise the club was in trouble'." Am i the only one who thinks its time for him to shut up? I fail to believe people did not know this was coming. I fail to believe Saints fans who pay hundreds of pounds to watch the team were not aware of our financial situation. It is so easy for him to say stuff like that. But yet he never seems to mention that the club would of made more money if Lowe had not returned. So Nick why should all those people who don't want/didn't want to fund the Lowe regime back down? Would it not be easier for one guy to leave then get thousands of people to step down from their belief? Would it not have made more sense for Lowe to have not returned and split the fans? You never seem to mention any of the negatives about Lowe. And once again we have a "Its the fans fault" comment to the media... Maybe just maybe it isn't the fans fault, maybe it is Lowes? Can you not accept that?

Yeah well done FF Nice to know that some of the fans are prepared to let the rest of us know what is happening behind the scenes. Think this thread will be in the golden posts for sure. Defining point in our clubs history broken to the fans by you. A day that will live in infamy and all that

Very interesting. Derby have done it before. From what they are saying it goes like this Derby County PLC owed £30m, couldn't pay went into receivership. Derby County Football Club (different from PLC) had no points deducted because Derby County LTD (another company?) was bought out the momment it went into receivership by a consortium then they killed the company minutes later. Soooo I think that means for this to work to the same pattern the SLH must be sold? Is there a deadline to when that must happen? Someone here mentioned 11am?

Imagine if it was just an April Fools...... can only hope can't we.

I'm speaking from a business perspective. I have worked as a business analyst for over 5 years now. I have seen companies do the strangest of things to try and survive. Especially in the last year or so what with the financial meltdown and all. But i don't think you need to have that experience to make a intelligent judgement/assumption on this matter. If multi-billion pound companies go under due to the fact they can no longer obtain help from the banks then why have they not just got their parent company to take the fall? Because the parent company and all of the parent companies assets go with it. In football terms if people such as Bates who have spent **** loads of money on the best lawyers he can get can't find loopholes like that then how could Lowe? As Exit has mentioned other clubs have had other companies such as Leeds and they got deductions because of it. How is our case any different? So f you want to throw some insults around and act as a 2 year old then send them via PM to me and were deal with it there. I don't think the rest of the forum want to see childish slanging matches especially today.