david in sweden

The red card incident was similar to Bertrand's sending off in the 0-9 Leicester game in that - played in pouring rain - the effect of an ill-timed / clumsy tackle become exaggerated, and this one looked even worse in slow motion. Clearly the pitch was heavy with water and several players were seen lost their footing during the game. The nicest that could be said was the tackle was " clumsy and ill-advised " . Yes, it was a foul and deserved a yellow card. (but as captain Prowsie needed to show up and be seen) in comparison to several bad Chelsea tackles which had gone unpunished, but a yellow was justified, but the slo-mo review made it look really bad and for his part Jorgegino reacted in " typical Latin manner ". It is the challenge that should be analysed and not the " player's reaction " to it, and this didn't help either. (Wolves had a field day last week, with half the side going down for prolonged periods in order to slow down the pace of the game). With Atkinson having already shown a yellow card VAR referee Dean " forced " Atkinson to review the situation, and Atkinson in turn would have looked stupid in denying it and would have damaged Dean's " credibility " even more. I've always been a supporter of VAR , (and to be fair without VAR we would have lost by a much larger margin), but the such incidents should be reviewed in " real time " as whilst showing more detail, slow motion often appears to make everything seem a whole lot worse. (The "real time" version over Kyle Walker's challenge on Armstrong in the Man. City game left little doubt over the penalty decision).

Ouch !.... our penalty shoot-out record is almost as bad as England's .

Agree 100%. I've always maintained that even " average players " tend to look good in a successful side, and the Prem. is another standard in many ways. Vestergaard was outstanding for that early season spell last season, but overall he could hardly be rated as " better than average ". The normal " physical tackles " that are part of the game at Prem. level might get a yellow card - or worse in other part of the World. It has to be said that Oli McBurnie has always been " a handful to cope with" , and still wouldn't be out of place in the Prem. Perhaps good for Lyanco to discover what " the English game " can be like, as he had a torrid time against the Blades' strikers. Good coaching will (hopefully) get him upto standard, but meantime (during Stephens' absence) we may have found good CB cover in Romeu.

didn't he get one when playing for England sometime ?

it was hardly " a chat" ...as Prowsey was "politely " ignoring him the whole time. Walker is a past master of this type of situation and his record of red cards shows this was not an isolated incident but part of his manner. He knew JWP would take an eventual penalty and was doing his best to unsettle him.

The reverse angle shows Walker pushing his arm into Armstrongs back - even before he put his leg over and - was he nowhere near the ball in the entire scenario. Just another example of a referee who thinks he has a right to help determine who will become League champions and giving the doubt to the home side. i.e. ....Saints don't need the point(s) as much as City who are more likely to win the title again. and the 6 minutes of added time was extended to 8 ...... before he blew the final whistle, but fortunately it didn't make the difference.

and Jon Moss also thought about ......whether he'd still be able to find his car to drive home after the match !

well back to the match, anyway. Scoring opportunities were few and far between for both sides. A clean sheet and good performances from McCarthy and Salisu (who improves with every game), and gave as good as he got in the battle with Antonio, who finally lost out after his late scuffle with Jack Stephens who seems to be happier playing " the last man " role with more freedom to roam. Many people have expressed sympathy for KWP, but that's football and who would not play Tino on his showings so far ? We saw Ralph's plan B - with a type of 4-1-4-1 formation - which gave away possession, but countered the mass attack style that Moyes likes. Whatever the formation, (sadly) Redmond playing on the right just didn't fit into it, and Adam Armstrong had a tough day as a lone striker, a role that might have suited Ché Adams a little better. It will take time for the two " A men" to form a good strike partnership that we belatedly saw between Adams and Ings. It wasn't Romeu's best game ..(early yellow cards tend to tame the spirit a little,) but Diallo came on and DAJFU. After recent criticism, Djenepo had a better game, and Perraud's left-wing sorties will cause defenders problems on another day. Whilst screaming at my screen for earlier subs. Armando Broja eventually appeared and almost won the game single-handedly. (Apparently) ...We have a worse points record against W Ham than even v. Everton and Man. Utd, so perhaps a draw should be reviewed positively and looking at the Prem. table perhaps one point against West Ham and Man. Utd gives some cause for satisfaction. The next four Prem. fixtures may give some better indication as to where we really stand for the rest of the season.

**.......only as long as they both stay fit. With KWP and Tino at RB ...and Perraud, Small and/or even KWP on the left, I think that's covered. I think few of us would want to change MF.. Prowsey and Romeu in the middle and then a choice between Stuart Armstrong and Will Smallbone (when fit), and Elyounoussi and Diallo, PLUS one of Redmond or Djenepo creates a lot to choose from. The goalie question is more open . McCarthy to stay (?), and Forster to leave we have no other experienced options. A lot of press about Sam Johnstone, but we won't be the only club trying to sign him. There were a few items in the summer... about the Albanien keeper (who plays in Italy,) but has anyone considered the Swedish national keeper Robin Olsen.(?). He makes very acrobatic saves and has great ball distribution. On loan to Everton last year but got just 7 games understudying Pickford for a whole season, and then got robbed at knifepoint in his home ....... and is now on loan to..... Sheffield United (!). Olsen single-handedly got Sweden a 0-0 draw against Spain in the Euros, and gave an outstanding performance last week when the Swedes beat Spain in the World Cup qualifier.

I think our priority - at the moment - is to start getting both Adams and Armstrong on the scoresheet PDQ. The idea of putting one of two our £15 million buys on the bench, in order to give a loan player game time doesn't seem right. Broja certainly impressed during the week, but as he has already played twice in a week he may not be ready for a full game, but I would see him as first change sub. and not have to wait until the 80th minute to get on the pitch.

If we end up with Salisu and Lyanco as regular CB's ..we might do worse than using Stephens as Romeu's back-up. Jack looks more impressive when he's on the move, and he knows how to tackle with some determination.

..." only a couple of million " ? ...it's better than a poke in the eye with a sharp stick, and a real chance for him to get regular first team football.

Recall watching him in a Blades game last season, and he showed up well and put himself about a lot. Not every 18 years starlet makes the grade at Prem-level, but hopefully (if signed) he may progress later on. Our current " B team" is in dire need of goalscorers, as the majority of that squad are last season's U18's who have moved up and suddenly find it hard to adapt to the higher level.

66% possession and 11 shots without scoring in the first half was more down to the panic Toon defending than simply blaming Djenepo for missing when so close in, and on another day we might easily have gone in 2 or 3 goals up. Yet another instance of our all-out attack in the first 45 , not being able to keep it going into the second half. Good performances from Livramento that auger well for the future. Despite conceding two goals , both Stephens and Salisu look to be forming a good CB partnership, and Walker Peters didn't look out of place at LB. After his two season sojourn at Celtic, Elyounoussi has earned his place in the start line-up and we may finally be on the way to getting our money's worth on his deal. Huge disappointment conceding second goal after 91 mins. but although not scoring, Adam Armstrong contributed to the result through sheer determination and it was left to " Super-Prowsey " to do the business and get us a well-earned point.

I see it's back to "the blame game " for some people, but it was Everton (away) .... where we regularly win every 25 seasons, Why was this fixture so special, possibly our worst tally of wins than against any other club in the country. ? Are we really so shocked.. angry...or disappointed?

sure to be yet another 18 year old genius who will go directly into the B team as "one for the future".......

well you can live in hope, I suppose....

.......and you already have a better man lined up ? ........or

We had several candidates for a 10 rating in the first half. Adam Armstrong's debut goal and Tino Livramento's start were a real surprise and Tino won some good duels v. Richarlison. But Rafa changed the playing style afterwards and their first goal was the beginning of the end. All four goals in the game were half-chances that paid off, but we lacked service to our " A " men up front and they hardly had a kick in second half. Adams seemed strangely quiet, and Walcott drifted out of the game on several occasions. Romeu began well, but tired noticeably late on in the game, and the subs. made little / no impact. I think Ralph is still undecided on his ideal line-up. We need to give the newcomers game time, but it will take time for them to settle in and contribute to the side. Better to have played this line-up against Everton rather than Man U . next week, although he began well, I don't see Tino as a regular starter and we ought to have KWP back next week, but IMHO we badly missed STUART Armstrong who would have fared better against the Everton MF. The ongoing debate about Stephens as a scapegoat for mistakes .....and who is the better keeper will continue. Clearly Forster is a burden to the club's economy (whilst his contract lasts), but I would still pick him ahead of McCarthy.

with one year left on his contact............SELL to Bournemouth.

Benny Smailes-Braithwaite .......rather a lot to print on one shirt...

Not BIG fees individually, but it is a quite a lot when you add it all up = without any positive results. *** I also note that no-one had mentioned Angus Gunn, (£13 mill) who didn't come cheap either, and I suppose that the jury is still out on Elyounoussi (£16 mill.) .... unless Ralph can make a Prem. player of him.

we've saw the " best choice" line-up in the Welsh games, here is a chance for the rest of the squad to show up and impress or we can expect one of two of them to get a move away before the 31st.

Oops... I stand corrected (about Pep).... but the others mentioned did succeed without a top class career behind them. Many fans think that former "top players " will automatically become good managers...."but the list of those who failed at that task is longer than anyone can recall. Several of the 1966 World Cup players are good examples of " wannabe managers " who failed ingloriously.

I'm always careful of the word " expert" , once defined as someone.... who knows more and more ..about less and less. Since our "B side has been invited to play against L1/L2 clubs in the " whatever it's called this season " Cup competition, they have hardly covered themselves with glory which goes to show that at that level they are scarcely "good enough" to play against those clubs. This season's " B squad " will be one of the youngest we've ever had as quite a few of them were playing in U18 last season. Olly Lancashire is a previous Academy guy who didn't make the cut, when better players came in (example : Fonte and Jaidi in 2009) after which his Saints days were numbered. However, he made a journeyman career in a number of clubs and probably knows as much about " that level of football " than many others. Good coaches cannot be categorized by their own playing careers and the list of those who have done well as managers often had a less-than-average personal career, whilst many " top players " fall at their first management hurdle. You can start a list with Arsene Wenger ....and Jose, Pep and Jurgen Klopp who hardly set the football world alight in their own playing days. We can hope that Olly's experience brings something positive to the B side (many of whom are still teenagers), and get a few points under their belt and perhaps even a few wins in Cup games, it may prove to be a good move in employing someone who has gone through that stage and knows our club. Statistically, very few Academy graduates make it to top level football, and the Walcott, Bale's and Shaw's are are rare examples, but on my count ...more than 30 former Saints Academy graduates have made reasonable careers in the game, albeit (like Olly) at a lower level.