Verbal

The big difference being that European university systems do not work with loans an ANYTHING LIKE the scale of the UK. Many are free, and so there are no loans for students to apply for. THAT's why European universities are cheaper to UK students. There is next to no flow of european tax funds into British students' pockets

For the simple reason that by whacking up the fees to such screaming levels, they are funnelling taxpayers' money abroad. Had we kept a system that, say, cut student numbers and maintained a university system through the MUCH CHEAPER route of government grants, we wouldn't be in this ridiculous situation. The higher the fees - and remember the government has TREBLED them - the more flows abroad. The higher the qualifying salary level, the more East European students do NOT have to pay back. so entirely the government's fault for adopting a cretinous neo-liberal approach rather than dealing directly with the problem. Who these days needs a solution that costs FAR MORE money?!

Yep, that was my point.

Ah, I see the charm offensive is going well since your near-miss.

And this government will continue to give. Want to hear a little scandal? As more and more students in the UK re dissuaded by the combination of higher fees and poorer employment prospects, their places are being increasingly taken up especially by East European students. The reason is that they get a first-rate university education and, because they're in the EU, can apply for UK-funded student loans on exactly the same terms as UK students. The scandal isn't that more EU students will fill places; it's that this government has designed a system that will rob the UK taxpayer of billions. EU students individually in receipt of upwards of £50,000 in UK government loans will, on the whole, not pay back - - because a) it's hard to chase the money; and b) these students come from much lower-wage economies, where the £21,000 floor before you HAVE to repay will in many cases simply never be reached. So this coalition has somewhat brilliantly exported education, training and jobs at HUGE expense to UK taxpayers.

Aren't you all being a tad hysterical? It all seems a bit 'so what' to me.

Neat trick with the mobiles. Yet another band, though, who owe EVERYTHING to The Band.

...

Precision. Considered. Lexicographer. Don't mention it.

But that's rather the point. No one is seriously claiming that anything is off-limits to actual humour, or even failed attempts at it. What Gray in particular (as well as the un-sacked reporter) displayed was seething contempt directed at women in football.

You should try logging out and looking at this thread. Every single advert is for a degree course. Ironic advertising?

Agreed. It makes you wonder what a pundit like Alan Shearer is up to. In being so blandly uninformative and lacking in analysis, is he upholding the secret oath of a kind of football magic circle, to curry favour with his erstwhile mates, or is he just dull?

Oh deary me. Wrong forum. Never mind - just think of it as saints related

Put the bunting out, have a street party. http://www.guardian.co.uk/film/filmblog/2011/jan/28/slade-film-school-studies-ucl (This link is brought to you by our proud sponsors, Johnny Bognor Data Entry Inc)

*Yawn* Oops, sorry.

I said STOP generalising your life to the rest of us!

Ok enough! Could people PLEASE stop generalising from their own tiny personal experiences - as if their lives were some kind of scientifically representative sample of the universe and everything in it.

I take it you are long-term unemployed.

No, it makes the case for meritocracy - not the atrophied system that selection at 11+ had become.

Wrong. Deppo works for me. His job is safe - for now.

Yes they are a drain - a very severe one. PFI companies raking in huge contracts and defaulting; pharmaceutical companies vastly overcharging the NHS (ie us); defence contractors ripping us off to the tune of billions PER CONTRACT; multinationals moving HQs and money offshore every five minutes to evade paying anything but the most miniscule amounts of tax; banks going bust and being rescued by taxpayers...etc, etc. God the list is endless. Ethical capitalism is one of those oxymoronic pipe dreams in the modern world of the large corporation. They won't 'save this great nation' because they don't give a flying **** about this nation. National borders faded long ago in the headlong rush to bilk the British taxpayer.

Has it only just dawned on you that your lords and masters, on whom you fawn so abjectly, are from a world you could only dream of but never really aspire to? And you certainly wouldn't be allowed anywhere near... The political class live their lives in complete security knowing that there are enough unthinking, obsequious dunderheads in Britain to go around propping up their lives of unearned privilege and power.

The problem with the hope that apprenticeships will be the answer to all ills is that whereas companies used to run these at their own expense, it's now common, if not almost universal, that companies expect the government to 'subsidise' apprenticeships schemes, so that the cheap labour becomes all but free. The sponger mentality runs deep among our thrusting entrepreneurs.

I think you are about to be teased a little bit.