Arizona Posted 25 November, 2008 Share Posted 25 November, 2008 Neither of them can tackle. Is this a problem? Against Reading it never really held us back, but tonight I would have said it did. On the other hand, I don't really want Wotton on the team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy_Porter Posted 25 November, 2008 Share Posted 25 November, 2008 We kept getting caught out because they where both bombing forward as well, i'd like to see Gillett and Schneiderlin together again. Cork and Schneiderlin would be the best partnership but I think we need Cork in defence atm. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
positivepete Posted 25 November, 2008 Share Posted 25 November, 2008 Don't agree, they are not Terry Hurlock or Robbie Savage but both can tackle, but they did'nt need to tonight, it was probably the cleanest game of the season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
um pahars Posted 25 November, 2008 Share Posted 25 November, 2008 Neither of them can tackle. Is this a problem? Against Reading it never really held us back, but tonight I would have said it did. On the other hand, I don't really want Wotton on the team. In my post Reading analysis I was also saying we need a tougher presence in the middle of the park, someone who can stick their foot in, but who can also play a bit as well. When these games get tough, we just need a bit of a bruiser in the tackle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arizona Posted 25 November, 2008 Author Share Posted 25 November, 2008 Don't agree, they are not Terry Hurlock or Robbie Savage but both can tackle, but they did'nt need to tonight, it was probably the cleanest game of the season. And yet Plymouth still had several chances. I can't help but feeling that if we'd had a bit more bite in midfield we could have made it more comfortable at the back and had a few more decent attacks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
modern matron Posted 25 November, 2008 Share Posted 25 November, 2008 Neither of them can tackle. Is this a problem? Against Reading it never really held us back, but tonight I would have said it did. On the other hand, I don't really want Wotton on the team. Disagree both tackled well at times. If you think that surely it would have had an effect at Reading? What was weird was the way we seemed to have only Robertson up front in the first half, then seemed to always have 4 up front with only 2 in midfield after HT. Often with little movement which lead to us passing backwards often, or giving it away and being totally outnumbered on the break. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
West End Saint Posted 26 November, 2008 Share Posted 26 November, 2008 I have to disagree I thought Spiderman and Drew were awesome our best midfield partnership by a million miles I thought Spiderman was MOM last night and Drew has been our best player year to date both got there foot in and are good on the ball hope we can keep them both but somehow think they will be sold Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roman Posted 26 November, 2008 Share Posted 26 November, 2008 This kind of thread makes me nervous. For reasons unfathomed, higher-ups at the club seem to read this forum (and appear overly sensitive to certain things said on here). When they're making noises about 'asset sales', and at a time when Surman, Schneiderlin and Lallana are starting to emerge as a golden midfield, I fear it gives them some unnecessary ammunition for selling one or all of them - and very soon. We have to keep hold of these players in January - somehow, anyhow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krissyboy31 Posted 26 November, 2008 Share Posted 26 November, 2008 Cork and Schneiderlin should be playing as the defensive midfield pairing, enabling Surman to play in a more advanced position. This would give the back four extra protection and also give us more fire power further up the pitch. Unforetunately, Cork keeps being slotted in to cover deficiencies at right or centreback. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fowllyd Posted 26 November, 2008 Share Posted 26 November, 2008 Cork and Schneiderlin should be playing as the defensive midfield pairing, enabling Surman to play in a more advanced position. This would give the back four extra protection and also give us more fire power further up the pitch. Unforetunately, Cork keeps being slotted in to cover deficiencies at right or centreback. This raises another question. Let's say, for the sake of argument, that we play James, Pearce, Perry and Skacel at the back (leave aside questions about whether or not James is up to it, though I thought he did OK last night). If we then have Cork and Shneiderlin in the holding midfield positions - which I think is a very good pairing - who goes where ahead of them, and who gets dropped from last night's team? I'd be inclined to put Lallana in behind (or alongside) Robertson, with BWP and Surman in the wide positions, interchanging as appropriate. Robertson didn't impress me last night, but I think we need a player who can battle with the heavy-duty centre backs you always seem to get in this division, and he's our only option for that. Lallana then needs to be encouraged to shoot a whole lot more. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickG Posted 26 November, 2008 Share Posted 26 November, 2008 how about trying (infront of defence above) Schneiderlin Cork Lallana BWP Surman Patterson Quite solid defensive pair who can both accelerate out of the back. Decent tricky wide players. Surman in free role. centre forward is harder, but Patterson seems to get good reviews and certainly worked hard physically when he came on, whether he is up to a start who knows. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saint_Pedro Posted 26 November, 2008 Share Posted 26 November, 2008 I'm probably in a minority but I think Surman is over-rated by many on here. He has no right foot (could have scored last night but he opted to move the ball to his left foot and the shot was charged down) and his tackling is poor - he often seems to pull out of a tackle when the likes of Schneiderlin goes in hard. Anyway, what do I know - I was told to shut up by a fellow fan for moaning about Surman last night. This was just before 3 people behind me called Surman a t**t...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
krissyboy31 Posted 26 November, 2008 Share Posted 26 November, 2008 I'm probably in a minority but I think Surman is over-rated by many on here. He has no right foot (could have scored last night but he opted to move the ball to his left foot and the shot was charged down) and his tackling is poor - he often seems to pull out of a tackle when the likes of Schneiderlin goes in hard. Anyway, what do I know - I was told to shut up by a fellow fan for moaning about Surman last night. This was just before 3 people behind me called Surman a t**t...... The thing is Surman is not a defensive player. Last season he was poor by his standards because he was being played mostly at left back. This season he has been one of our better players but his instincts are as an attacking midfield player, where he's at his best. He has a good shot and times his runs into the box very well. In the holding role he is stifled and that does not get the best out of him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John B Posted 26 November, 2008 Share Posted 26 November, 2008 This raises another question. Let's say, for the sake of argument, that we play James, Pearce, Perry and Skacel at the back (leave aside questions about whether or not James is up to it, though I thought he did OK last night). If we then have Cork and Shneiderlin in the holding midfield positions - which I think is a very good pairing - who goes where ahead of them, and who gets dropped from last night's team? I'd be inclined to put Lallana in behind (or alongside) Robertson, with BWP and Surman in the wide positions, interchanging as appropriate. Robertson didn't impress me last night, but I think we need a player who can battle with the heavy-duty centre backs you always seem to get in this division, and he's our only option for that. Lallana then needs to be encouraged to shoot a whole lot more. I think Surman is suspended for Saturday So I would go with the same team Pearce in For Surman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John B Posted 26 November, 2008 Share Posted 26 November, 2008 how about trying (infront of defence above) Schneiderlin Cork Lallana BWP Surman Patterson Quite solid defensive pair who can both accelerate out of the back. Decent tricky wide players. Surman in free role. centre forward is harder, but Patterson seems to get good reviews and certainly worked hard physically when he came on, whether he is up to a start who knows. We are missing Holmes and somebody like Dyer who can cross the ball Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Charlie Wayman Posted 26 November, 2008 Share Posted 26 November, 2008 Neither of them can tackle. Is this a problem? Against Reading it never really held us back, but tonight I would have said it did. On the other hand, I don't really want Wotton on the team. I do not agree with you at all, it is a ridiculous suggestion unworthy of sensible debate. Both players made incisive tackles at critical points last night and for long periods bossed midfield. If you have a downer on these guys don't exercise your frustration by creating spurious and inaccurately supposited threads Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickG Posted 26 November, 2008 Share Posted 26 November, 2008 We are missing Holmes and somebody like Dyer who can cross the ball would use Holmes ahead of BWP on left, although he surpised me for first 45 yesterday as thought he was excellent with great energy and movement. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fowllyd Posted 26 November, 2008 Share Posted 26 November, 2008 I think Surman is suspended for Saturday So I would go with the same team Pearce in For Surman True - I was thinking more in general terms, rather than specifically for Saturday's game though. Pearce in for Surman, Cork to midfield does sound good for the Charlton game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John B Posted 26 November, 2008 Share Posted 26 November, 2008 True - I was thinking more in general terms, rather than specifically for Saturday's game though. Pearce in for Surman, Cork to midfield does sound good for the Charlton game. OK I understand your point but JP never seems to have a complete squad to choose from. So he has to mix and match Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fowllyd Posted 26 November, 2008 Share Posted 26 November, 2008 OK I understand your point but JP never seems to have a complete squad to choose from. So he has to mix and match It's OK - I was agreeing with you! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hughieslastminutegoal Posted 26 November, 2008 Share Posted 26 November, 2008 Neither of them can tackle. Is this a problem? Against Reading it never really held us back, but tonight I would have said it did. On the other hand, I don't really want Wotton on the team. Come on, Wotton was JP's first great signing, wasn't he? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hughieslastminutegoal Posted 26 November, 2008 Share Posted 26 November, 2008 I do not agree with you at all, it is a ridiculous suggestion unworthy of sensible debate. Both players made incisive tackles at critical points last night and for long periods bossed midfield. If you have a downer on these guys don't exercise your frustration by creating spurious and inaccurately supposited threads Supposited thread??? Are you telling him where to put his thread, by any chance?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saints67 Posted 26 November, 2008 Share Posted 26 November, 2008 I think Surman is suspended for Saturday So I would go with the same team Pearce in For Surman According to the BBC website Drew has 4 yellow cards to his name so I think he's safe until he picks up another one. I would play the same team v Charlton and only switch things around for home games as this lot have proved they are very effective away from home. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ekelund24 Posted 26 November, 2008 Share Posted 26 November, 2008 would use Holmes ahead of BWP on left, although he surpised me for first 45 yesterday as thought he was excellent with great energy and movement. BWP with the ball played infront of him was excellent yesterday but in the second half he appeared to be in a more advanced starting position and had to comeback to retrieve the ball, at which point he is average at best. I think there is a point in home games where our style either gets found out or we run out of gas. The defensive midfield two stop coming back for the ball and the slick passing stops. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John B Posted 26 November, 2008 Share Posted 26 November, 2008 According to the BBC website Drew has 4 yellow cards to his name so I think he's safe until he picks up another one. I would play the same team v Charlton and only switch things around for home games as this lot have proved they are very effective away from home. Thats good then I thought I saw somewher he five yellows. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Junior Mullet Posted 26 November, 2008 Share Posted 26 November, 2008 I think Surman has been at his best this year playing centre mid. Whilst I like Schneiderlin and it's of course very easy to get exciting when he pings 40yard balls out to the wing with pin point accuracy, his control and first touch let's him down time and time again and regularly is the cause of our attacks breaking down. I couldnt make my mind up last night whether this was due to him simply having a poor first touch or whether it was due to him coming on the ball with too much pace to control it. I think Schneiderlin and Surman both put in plenty of tackles and interceptions. However, they do this without being 'dirty' and therefore I beleive some of their good work does not get noticed as much as it perhaps should. They were slightly off form last night but I put that down to them looking nackered - Surman in particular - you could see on his face that the effort from Saturday was taking its toll and I dont understand why Jan didnt sub him with about 15/20 mins to go in order to give us a bit more energy and bite in midfield. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alanh Posted 26 November, 2008 Share Posted 26 November, 2008 I think they are a good combination for the positions they are playing - certainly better than Wotton and Gillett who have also played there this season. IMO they both tackle, although Spiderman oftern seems clumsy and gives away fouls. The biggest 'complaint' that I have with them is their propensity to pass sideways rather than forward. I think Spiderman is the bigger culprit. Last night there seemed to be several occasions where he could have driven forward but instead played a square or backward ball which slowed down the overall attack. I'd like to see them both get an extended run in these positions as I think they are getting better and the positions are the most important in the team in terms of freeing up how the attacking 4 can play, and covering for the full backs when they go forward. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chez Posted 26 November, 2008 Share Posted 26 November, 2008 I'm probably in a minority but I think Surman is over-rated by many on here. He has no right foot (could have scored last night but he opted to move the ball to his left foot and the shot was charged down) and his tackling is poor - he often seems to pull out of a tackle when the likes of Schneiderlin goes in hard. Anyway, what do I know - I was told to shut up by a fellow fan for moaning about Surman last night. This was just before 3 people behind me called Surman a t**t...... there are others like you but I am certainly not one of them. Apart from the fact he is still only 22, is finding his feet in the middle and playing in a very average side, Surman has played pretty well in most games this season and has been excellent in the last three or four IMO. How many current Saints players nutmeg an opponent, outmuscle him to the ball, beat the next man all hands up and create havoc in the opponents midfield? That was tremendous play in front of the Northam and just a snippet of what he does wee in week out. other than fancy footwork Surman ran all night long. He worked his socks off and constantly made surging runs forward though not always found. He saw more of the ball than anyone else, never shying away from his responsibilities. Yes some passes go astray but he's always looking to create soemthing and thread that kilelr ball. Enjoy that as when he is sold we will haev the like sof Wotton hoofing it anywhere and the likes of you moaning how **** we are. By the way I have never seen him pull out of a tackle. If I was you I'd take that guys advice. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
teamsaint Posted 26 November, 2008 Share Posted 26 November, 2008 there are others like you but I am certainly not one of them. Apart from the fact he is still only 22, is finding his feet in the middle and playing in a very average side, Surman has played pretty well in most games this season and has been excellent in the last three or four IMO. How many current Saints players nutmeg an opponent, outmuscle him to the ball, beat the next man all hands up and create havoc in the opponents midfield? That was tremendous play in front of the Northam and just a snippet of what he does wee in week out. other than fancy footwork Surman ran all night long. He worked his socks off and constantly made surging runs forward though not always found. He saw more of the ball than anyone else, never shying away from his responsibilities. Yes some passes go astray but he's always looking to create soemthing and thread that kilelr ball. Enjoy that as when he is sold we will haev the like sof Wotton hoofing it anywhere and the likes of you moaning how **** we are. By the way I have never seen him pull out of a tackle. If I was you I'd take that guys advice. We will miss Surman a LOT if he goes. As i have said before, if we were looking to sign a Saints supporting player of his quality at his current value we would be unable to contain our excitement. He will make a very good (and good value) squad addition for some mid table PL team. Surman/Spiderman/ lallana + 1. THAT is a PL midfield in the making. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy_Porter Posted 26 November, 2008 Share Posted 26 November, 2008 Holmes, Surman, Lallana, Schneiderlin and a decent right winger maybe Thomson? That could in a few years be a superb midfield. Not much chance that we can keep them all together much longer but with some more experience they could boss this league. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fowllyd Posted 26 November, 2008 Share Posted 26 November, 2008 there are others like you but I am certainly not one of them. Apart from the fact he is still only 22, is finding his feet in the middle and playing in a very average side, Surman has played pretty well in most games this season and has been excellent in the last three or four IMO. How many current Saints players nutmeg an opponent, outmuscle him to the ball, beat the next man all hands up and create havoc in the opponents midfield? That was tremendous play in front of the Northam and just a snippet of what he does wee in week out. other than fancy footwork Surman ran all night long. He worked his socks off and constantly made surging runs forward though not always found. He saw more of the ball than anyone else, never shying away from his responsibilities. Yes some passes go astray but he's always looking to create soemthing and thread that kilelr ball. Enjoy that as when he is sold we will haev the like sof Wotton hoofing it anywhere and the likes of you moaning how **** we are. By the way I have never seen him pull out of a tackle. If I was you I'd take that guys advice. Spot on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danny Posted 26 November, 2008 Share Posted 26 November, 2008 Apart from the fact he is still only 22, is finding his feet in the middle and playing in a very average side, Surman has played pretty well in most games this season and has been excellent in the last three or four IMO. How many current Saints players nutmeg an opponent, outmuscle him to the ball, beat the next man all hands up and create havoc in the opponents midfield? That was tremendous play in front of the Northam and just a snippet of what he does wee in week out. other than fancy footwork Surman ran all night long. He worked his socks off and constantly made surging runs forward though not always found. He saw more of the ball than anyone else, never shying away from his responsibilities. Yes some passes go astray but he's always looking to create soemthing and thread that kilelr ball. Enjoy that as when he is sold we will haev the like sof Wotton hoofing it anywhere and the likes of you moaning how **** we are. By the way I have never seen him pull out of a tackle. Can't argue with that, IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AndyNorthernSaints Posted 26 November, 2008 Share Posted 26 November, 2008 Lallana, Schneiderlin, Gillett, Surman. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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