Colinjb

Well. This cannot be a bad thing. 1. If it's crap we remain in excellent hands. Onwards and upwards. 2. If someone can afford to spend 50 million to buy us. Happy days. Onwards and upwards.

That's West Brom's relegation sealed then.

Damnit Damnit Damnit. Play-offs here we come.

I'm utterly fanatical about Formula 1 racing. If anything that was my first love before Saints got it's claws into me.

I would recommend visiting the program shop in the Chapel stand next week. They usually have programs from recent away games for sale. Good luck in finding one and congratulations!!

Then, the obvious question must surely be.... What differences are to be made to ensure that the forum will not go under during high demand times? (Just jumping in before someone else does....)

You are entitled to your opinion on me JRM. Regardless of how wrong it may be. This argument is entitled to both sides, littleoldladysaint outlined my perspective (removing my dislike of the the guy) extremely well. Why do I dislike him? Anyone who offers a misrepresentation of what he claims to represent (The Saints Trust being representative of the fanbase is such a fallacy - but that is a topic for another thread) will be on the end of my contempt. Nontheless, we do need to know why this has happened. Beyond my dislike for him he is a fan and has had something many of us hold dear withheld. We would all hate being in that position.

An excellent point well made. I totally agree.

I do not like the guy. That is clear, I reacted badly instinctively to something without giving it consideration. I have played devils advocate for a point of view that's unpalatable to you, I can understand why, we would not like to be denied the ability to buy a season ticket. You do not agree with some of Illingsworths comments in OUR name over the years, neither do I... This feeling has obviously polarised myself more then you. Yet oddly, after consideration we both agree on one thing. The club do need to clarify why this has happened.... because we both want to know why!

It was an event held specifically for the club's fans. It would be a daft thing to hang over someone's head as it was organised privately. Yet it was disasterous and upset a few people.... who knows who all those people may have been.

Could the indirect association of the club with the event be a factor in the decision not to let him buy a season ticket? It may be laughable but it could indeed be something daft.... but it must be something! I'm not suggesting Illingsworth is a Mafia head... I'm saying that SOMETHING must have happened! I doubt we will ever know.

The decision to revoke the season ticket installment plan and then the removal of Illingsworth's ability to buy the season ticket occured 6-7 months ago. My point is that there was silence at the time. Nicola Cortese has since admitted this is something he needs to learn from, yet the mistake then (and the remaining silence on things that clearly matter a lot to some people) has stuck in a lot of minds. The decision not to allow installment payment was made for good reason. 100 or so people were signing up to it (a very small percentage, but some nonetheless), obtaining the tickets and then cancelling direct debits and still having a useable ticket booklet. It was cancelled until something more watertight couldn't be implemented. This wasn't communicated at the time, very little warning was given. It was handled badly. The decision to revoke one fan's ticket has not been explained. Apparently not even to him and he doesn't know what he did wrong. (Gemmel, sorry, but that doesn't fly with me! Cynical sod I must be.) It could be cleared up with one communication from the club. This hasn't happened. This is in contravention of a charter that didn't exist in an up to date form until this PFO organisation investigated. So the upset is understandable.... especially as it is not unprecidented on things that have effected more people then that one.

A charter that didn't exist for this season until it was highlighted by this case, so at least it had some direct benefit. Many thanks for the pleasantries by the way. I am fully aware that some of what I am saying is unpalatable, we would hate this to happen to ourselves but there must be a reason and you do not get stung by the hornets nest unless you provoke it. Thank heavens the art of polite conversation isn't dead. We wonder why the forum is losing popularity....

Both things that happened back in the summer. Now 6-7 months ago. But yes, the PR policy is still in something of a hangover. Staying quiet though appears to be the way of things. (Not saying it's right..... before anyone jumps on me...)

As you say. For the club to speak.

Maybe so. But please, Steve. I'm just trying to reason why this may happen. If I'm wrong I am wrong. We do not know why this has happened. All we say about this is speculation but seemingly it is easier to side with a fellow fan rather then reason that it may actually have been something they have done to provoke the reaction. I can understand that, we are all fans.... we would hate to be in that situation. Just because I am theorising that maybe Nick Illingsworth is not as innocent as first appears it doesn't mean that I should be called 'judge jury and executioner.' This is a forum, a debate. Not everything in life is kittens and roses.

No need for that Gemmel. My personal feelings about Illingsworth are obvious but the fact remains he must have done something wrong to provoke this. To provoke a reaction like this it must have been something serious. When you do something of this nature it would be highly unlikely that you wouldn't be aware of it. I have stated that this is my personal opinion. Challenge it as you wish, this is after all a forum. We're all adults here arn't we? But to react like that is frankly offensive. Apologise.

Therein lays the key point. We will not be in his position. You only lose the ability to buy a season ticket if you have done something wrong. What did he do wrong and why are the club resisting to comment? The club not commenting is consistent behaviour. (Even if it is viewed as distasteful right now.) So, He did something wrong.

I see your point. The problem is though, while this entity can rule on the ethical grounds of which we are all aware it doesn't tackle to route cause of the issue... just suggests the solution which is obvious to everyone. In short, it's not worth the paper it's printed on. Only when the reason is known will we be able to say who was 'wrong.'

Unless he wanted to appear innocent of something? The club may have already agreed not to comment to allow a gracious saving of face. Or they may be continuing their stated policy of not responding to every idle rumour/story. The club's consistency of behaviour could be working absolutely to Illingsworth's advantage. I would rather believe the club then a chairman of a meaningless entity that claims to represent those that it painfully obviously doesn't.

I don't for a second think he needs to be told. This story does not add up. Cortese is not an idiot, he wouldn't allow the revokation of a season ticket holders ability to buy unless there is reason to. Equally, Illingsworth pleads ignorance and is claiming to be victimised. Something must have happened to trigger this. If Illingsworth really doesn't know or at the very least have an inkling I would be absolutely gobsmacked.

I'm sorry, but if you had your ability to buy a season ticket removed you will surely know why. The club are staying quiet, that's their perogative. While Illingsworth himself stays quiet he can plead ignorance until the cows come home. He should be grateful, the club are sparing his blushes. (This my take on the situation.... not fact, just my reasoned opinion. You do not get stopped from buying a season ticket unless there is a good reason!)

A defunct organisation chaired by a nobody. No wonder they treat 'The Saints Trust' with credibility.

Quite right, back on track.

Yes, In the same way I would be upset if anyone misrepresented me. It's pretentious and damn right rude.