CanadaSaint

It’s mental that we completely negate Fernandes’ vision and passing ability by compressing his space with our own short-passers.

It doesn’t help that we don’t have a solid left side CB on the books. Oh, wait … we do but he’s got an attitude issue that’s apparently a much bigger problem than a ball-watcher who gets two red cards in twelve games.

There are lots of “I hate playing for this prick” signs out there.

Warning: Lengthy vent inbound. I can’t believe I’m typing this when I’ve long felt little sympathy for spoilt, ludicrously-overpaid athletes who live cosseted lives and don’t face the day to day challenges most of us face. But I really sympathize with our guys because they’re like the crew of the Costa Concordia, as our version of Francesco Schettino takes them on his ego-triggered journey onto the rocks. Or, to use another metaphor, they are the cannon-fodder that “General Lead-From-Behind” sends out to meet their inevitable fate. The last words they hear from him are “Be brave, men, be brave”. Russell Martin says “brave” constantly but only focuses on the first word of the definition: courage in the face of danger. He arrogantly refuses to focus on the last word (the word that pretty much the entire football world keeps using), and is dismissive of what that last word means for the players. So what does it mean for the players? I have little doubt that, if the real truth were told, the vast majority hate playing for him. You can see the fear in their eyes, the panic as they try to find the “Russball” pass when all their football instincts are telling them to do something else. They know they are being transformed into football robots. They know that being robotic and sycophantic with the manager will get you in the team ahead of far more talented players. They know that not being sufficiently robotic will get them a one-way trip to the sidelines. They know that when they make the inevitable mistake, all eyes will be focused on them. And then their mistake will be replayed and replayed again, before making its way to YouTube for even more people to see. They know that their career trajectories are heading ever-lower with each game under Russ. Having played the position myself, I see Martin as a “keeper killer” because he forces his keepers to play in a way that compromises their positioning, and try to make Russball ‘contributions’ that A) are well out of their comfort zone and often beyond their capability, and B) damage their ability to actually be keepers. We can criticize Bazunu and McCarthy until we go blue in the face, but when we spend 25 million on a high-quality, ultra-confident keeper and can see the fear in his eyes two games into his stint with us, something is very, very wrong. Despite their huge pay checks it's very sad to watch, and I’m really starting to feel for them. Here’s another thing I can’t believe I’m typing, given our disastrous results so far. There are numerous very solid elements of Russball, and I’d be sorry to lose them. It can be great to watch until it hits the point at which it turns from great to suicidal. The problem is back to that definition of “brave”. Martin’s self-besotted arrogance only allows him to see the courage part, not the danger part. The bit where everything falls apart. Just as there’s a “trigger” for pressing tactics to kick in, there needs to be a trigger for Russball to end. But he just won’t accept it – won’t even pick fast, wide players who are targets for quick transition from Russball to penetrating offence. He says he wants fast transition but does nothing to make it happen, and sometimes even shows exasperation if someone tries it. I doubt that he took anything from Tall Paul’s excellent play on Sunday, other than the fear that it might derail Russball and make other talented but non-robotic players think that there’s a route from the doghouse to the starting lineup. I’d love to know what was said in his little chat with Dibling on Sunday – it didn’t look like they were on the same page but young Dibling seemed to be holding his ground. It’s becoming increasingly clear that Russ isn’t leaving, so we can only hope that he is somehow forced to face some realities. It won’t come from SR – that’s like being up shit creek with Rasmus for a paddle. The fan opinions don’t work with Russ or Rasmus because they’re the smartest guys in every room they enter. It needs a new dressing room leader (i.e. not Jack Stephens or Ross Manning – good guys but …) to have enough gonads to step forward, on behalf of what I suspect is a large majority of the squad, and have a frank conversation with the manager. It wouldn’t be a player “revolt” but a very pointed discussion. So who’s going to have a chat with our Francesco Schettino?

I’ve voted Yes even though it’s just a plaintive cry if the reality is that he CAN’T be moved on because the cost would cause us to breach the Profit and Sustainability Rules, because of the understandable lack of decent candidates willing to pick up the poisoned chalice we’ve become, or because (like many on here) they fear that we’re doomed regardless of whether he stays or goes. If that’s the case our only realistic option may be to hire someone with football knowledge and a powerful-enough personality to supervise him. There are pacy, wide players in the squad who can add the fast-break dimensions we need, but Martin refuses to play them. They may be short of PL standard but the important thing is that they offer us the early out-ball and the through-the channels target we need in order to break out of our self-created quicksand and get an earlier delivery into the box. AA contributed nothing out-wide yesterday, and playing BBD out there was ludicrous. I can’t imagine that Martin’s contract gives him unfettered control over team affairs regardless of his performance. He has to report to someone, and that “someone” is also doing a really shitty job right now.

Stunning save from Ramsdale after Stephens yet again demonstrates that he thinks that ballwatching is the key to effective marking.

Sadly, he’s a tactical eunuch who values possession far more than penetration. City’s goal today came when we had possession and control in their end but needlessly decided to play it back. We nearly conceded another in the second half when Fernandes - from the LB position FFS - tried to play a square pass across our own box. WTF is one of our most skilful and creative midfielders even doing there? City were vulnerable to a fast counter on many occasions today but it needed what Martin views as a mortal sin - an early out-ball to a wide area. His tactics are neutering some good players, and we will only start to see our true potential when he’s nowhere near the squad. The misplaced arrogance is astounding.

So infuriating when even skilled players like Fernandes have to become mere pawns in the Grand Master’s plan.

That came from us playing it back when we were in the offensive third.

They’d get their money back on Ramsdale, no problem, and Dibling is already worth a fortune. We’ve already shed some of the worst millstones of the relegation season. It doesn’t make much sense to me either, but it explains them just watching this shit happen. An owner’s idea of success is very different to a fan’s.

But we don't know what their business plan actually is, do we? It's increasingly looking like relegation might actually be PART of their business plan, as it did at times during the Summer window. Not that they were going to admit to it when they're wanting to maximize their season ticket sales. Appointing two dire managers, and then persisting with Martin months after all of football had him rumbled, gives the clear impression that they think being a yoyo club is a more sustainable business strategy than trying to compete up here. Seems crazy to me, but the longer this level of incompetence is permitted to exist, the more it starts to look intentional.

Sadly it's hard to see anything changing. No balls, no penetration. To me he's a tactical eunuch.

This is the part I don't understand. How can a group that targeted Jesse Marsch end up appointing Russell Martin? From what I've seen of Marsch's style he's very high on getting the ball forward ASAP with diagonal passes, runs "in behind", width and pace. It's exhilarating to watch, he gets total "buy-in" from the really talented and less talented players, and all of them improve. He scared the crap out of the South American teams, including the Argies, in Copa America. So why did Marsch turn us down, and how the hell did we end up hiring his polar opposite? I have a feeling that the explanations for both might just lead back to Rasmus and his fixation with player metrics.

Good managing is largely down to three things - selection, tactics and man management. His starting line-up tonight was a Frankenstein-esque gong show, his tactics were even exploited in the EFL and everyone bar him knew they'd be suicidal up here, and two PL quality players (KWP and ABK) have been left out in the cold for unknown reasons - probably questioning him. That's 3 fails right there, but he's not done. He deploys a carthorse as a wide attacker on the left, happily plays most games without a focal point in the box, persists with taking an eternity to get the ball forward, and now sticks it on the shoulders of an 18 year-old to dribble through the opposition as our main form of attack. Meanwhile, Bournemouth stuff us with the very tactics he despises. If anyone has the temerity to question him when things inevitably go pear-shaped, he throws one of his hyper-sensitive "smartest guy in the room" retorts. We won't find out how good our squad is until he's nowhere near it.

Martin’s a dead man walking. Done by a long ball from the keeper, and a one touch layoff. The very things that this utter fuckwit detests.

That lineup can only work if we get the ball forward much faster, so who knows what the hell the maestro has up his sleeve.

We are playing out from the back less, and playing it back into the back more. Russ likes to call it brave football but I think it's gutless football. We didn't surrender two points at the death, we surrendered them by refusing to even look for a forward ball countless times in the first ninety minutes.

But that's the point. Once it's hit anything can happen. You have to stop the shot. Defending the "D" is very basic stuff.

The "D" is one of the most dangerous places on the pitch, and we left it wide open. Unfrickingbelievable.

Still think there’s a decent side in our squad but it’s frustrating to watch Russ take so long to figure out who should and shouldn’t be in it, and that it’s not a cardinal sin to go long and wide when we’re penned in. Jack’s a great guy but I don’t think it’s a coincidence that we looked tighter and more assured without him back there. Dropping THB and keeping him in was ridiculous. It was nice to have some attacking width and pace with Cornet and Fraser, but BBD needs to either be more central or on the bench.

THB looking quite solid and Stephens not playing is not a coincidence.

Yep, that's very troubling on multiple levels. It suggests that he just won't accept that playing it long when we're being heavily pressed is infinitely preferable to surrendering possession in our own back third. It also suggests that the only target he can think of is a big guy up front - not a pacy attacker out wide, so he doesn't see the counter-attacking dimension. But, most of all, it shows how deep-seated his arrogance is, and how unwilling to accept that everyone has rumbled his style. There seems to be no room in his head for the notion that a decent Plan B makes Plan A better, because it reduces the critical weakness of a predictable Plan A and creates a fast-break option (probably not in his lexicon). Plan A and Plan B aren't mutually exclusive - unless Martin's "smartest guy in the room" mentality decides they are. But he's a bullshitter, because he was forced to change when we lost Bazunu, and that's what got us promoted. It wasn't losing Bazunu but the style change it forced on him. His arrogance won't let him admit it. He's riding for a fall.

IMO Martin hit a fork in the road when we failed to sign Biljow, who was comfortable with his “play out from the back all the time” style. We then spent 25 million on Ramsdale, for whom “playing out” is definitely not a strength. However, one of his real strong suits is the crisp out-ball to wide, pacy attackers. We also brought back Fraser and loaned Cornet – two solid targets for the early out-ball. Finally, we have the makings of a Plan B which could make us less vulnerable to the press – the weakness in Martin’s style that every opponent knows about and exploits. Nothing emboldens a press more than predictability, but a good Plan B blunts the press because they fear being bypassed. But Fraser and Cornet were unavailable on Saturday, so we don’t know yet whether Martin is willing to use Ramsdale’s special skill to give us the Plan B we desperately need. I’m willing to wait and see if pragmatism can overpower Martin’s arrogance and obstinacy. His insistence on playing out from the back, to me, is a “keeper killer”. I can’t see ownership sitting idly by if he doesn’t use their 25 million asset properly, and his confidence starts to take a nosedive.

Thank you - brain fart. 😀 The first 4+ pages of this thread say he was real quality until things started going pear-shaped on the manager front, and then everything went to hell - not just ABK. The point is that getting ABK #1 back would be very helpful right now.

IIRC he was fine until the start of the relegation season (more than fine if you check the 2022 posts), but that season was a total shitshow. Three managers, two of them dire, players checking out all around, fractured dressing room, relegation inevitable long before the season ended, SMS was a depressing place for fans and players alike. He was far from the only one who didn't want to be here for 2023-24 in the Championship. But he's still here, for whatever reason, and we have huge problems at the back. The questions for me are: What changed that early guy? Can we fix it? Why are we apparently not even trying when, warts and all, he's far better than some automatic starters who are costing us games? I have no doubt that Martin sees himself as a top-notch "man manager". This is a great opportunity to show it - the potential upside is huge.