CanadaSaint

Sadly, he’s a tactical eunuch who values possession far more than penetration. City’s goal today came when we had possession and control in their end but needlessly decided to play it back. We nearly conceded another in the second half when Fernandes - from the LB position FFS - tried to play a square pass across our own box. WTF is one of our most skilful and creative midfielders even doing there? City were vulnerable to a fast counter on many occasions today but it needed what Martin views as a mortal sin - an early out-ball to a wide area. His tactics are neutering some good players, and we will only start to see our true potential when he’s nowhere near the squad. The misplaced arrogance is astounding.

So infuriating when even skilled players like Fernandes have to become mere pawns in the Grand Master’s plan.

That came from us playing it back when we were in the offensive third.

They’d get their money back on Ramsdale, no problem, and Dibling is already worth a fortune. We’ve already shed some of the worst millstones of the relegation season. It doesn’t make much sense to me either, but it explains them just watching this shit happen. An owner’s idea of success is very different to a fan’s.

But we don't know what their business plan actually is, do we? It's increasingly looking like relegation might actually be PART of their business plan, as it did at times during the Summer window. Not that they were going to admit to it when they're wanting to maximize their season ticket sales. Appointing two dire managers, and then persisting with Martin months after all of football had him rumbled, gives the clear impression that they think being a yoyo club is a more sustainable business strategy than trying to compete up here. Seems crazy to me, but the longer this level of incompetence is permitted to exist, the more it starts to look intentional.

Sadly it's hard to see anything changing. No balls, no penetration. To me he's a tactical eunuch.

This is the part I don't understand. How can a group that targeted Jesse Marsch end up appointing Russell Martin? From what I've seen of Marsch's style he's very high on getting the ball forward ASAP with diagonal passes, runs "in behind", width and pace. It's exhilarating to watch, he gets total "buy-in" from the really talented and less talented players, and all of them improve. He scared the crap out of the South American teams, including the Argies, in Copa America. So why did Marsch turn us down, and how the hell did we end up hiring his polar opposite? I have a feeling that the explanations for both might just lead back to Rasmus and his fixation with player metrics.

Good managing is largely down to three things - selection, tactics and man management. His starting line-up tonight was a Frankenstein-esque gong show, his tactics were even exploited in the EFL and everyone bar him knew they'd be suicidal up here, and two PL quality players (KWP and ABK) have been left out in the cold for unknown reasons - probably questioning him. That's 3 fails right there, but he's not done. He deploys a carthorse as a wide attacker on the left, happily plays most games without a focal point in the box, persists with taking an eternity to get the ball forward, and now sticks it on the shoulders of an 18 year-old to dribble through the opposition as our main form of attack. Meanwhile, Bournemouth stuff us with the very tactics he despises. If anyone has the temerity to question him when things inevitably go pear-shaped, he throws one of his hyper-sensitive "smartest guy in the room" retorts. We won't find out how good our squad is until he's nowhere near it.

Martin’s a dead man walking. Done by a long ball from the keeper, and a one touch layoff. The very things that this utter fuckwit detests.

That lineup can only work if we get the ball forward much faster, so who knows what the hell the maestro has up his sleeve.

We are playing out from the back less, and playing it back into the back more. Russ likes to call it brave football but I think it's gutless football. We didn't surrender two points at the death, we surrendered them by refusing to even look for a forward ball countless times in the first ninety minutes.

But that's the point. Once it's hit anything can happen. You have to stop the shot. Defending the "D" is very basic stuff.

The "D" is one of the most dangerous places on the pitch, and we left it wide open. Unfrickingbelievable.

Still think there’s a decent side in our squad but it’s frustrating to watch Russ take so long to figure out who should and shouldn’t be in it, and that it’s not a cardinal sin to go long and wide when we’re penned in. Jack’s a great guy but I don’t think it’s a coincidence that we looked tighter and more assured without him back there. Dropping THB and keeping him in was ridiculous. It was nice to have some attacking width and pace with Cornet and Fraser, but BBD needs to either be more central or on the bench.

THB looking quite solid and Stephens not playing is not a coincidence.

Yep, that's very troubling on multiple levels. It suggests that he just won't accept that playing it long when we're being heavily pressed is infinitely preferable to surrendering possession in our own back third. It also suggests that the only target he can think of is a big guy up front - not a pacy attacker out wide, so he doesn't see the counter-attacking dimension. But, most of all, it shows how deep-seated his arrogance is, and how unwilling to accept that everyone has rumbled his style. There seems to be no room in his head for the notion that a decent Plan B makes Plan A better, because it reduces the critical weakness of a predictable Plan A and creates a fast-break option (probably not in his lexicon). Plan A and Plan B aren't mutually exclusive - unless Martin's "smartest guy in the room" mentality decides they are. But he's a bullshitter, because he was forced to change when we lost Bazunu, and that's what got us promoted. It wasn't losing Bazunu but the style change it forced on him. His arrogance won't let him admit it. He's riding for a fall.

IMO Martin hit a fork in the road when we failed to sign Biljow, who was comfortable with his “play out from the back all the time” style. We then spent 25 million on Ramsdale, for whom “playing out” is definitely not a strength. However, one of his real strong suits is the crisp out-ball to wide, pacy attackers. We also brought back Fraser and loaned Cornet – two solid targets for the early out-ball. Finally, we have the makings of a Plan B which could make us less vulnerable to the press – the weakness in Martin’s style that every opponent knows about and exploits. Nothing emboldens a press more than predictability, but a good Plan B blunts the press because they fear being bypassed. But Fraser and Cornet were unavailable on Saturday, so we don’t know yet whether Martin is willing to use Ramsdale’s special skill to give us the Plan B we desperately need. I’m willing to wait and see if pragmatism can overpower Martin’s arrogance and obstinacy. His insistence on playing out from the back, to me, is a “keeper killer”. I can’t see ownership sitting idly by if he doesn’t use their 25 million asset properly, and his confidence starts to take a nosedive.

Thank you - brain fart. 😀 The first 4+ pages of this thread say he was real quality until things started going pear-shaped on the manager front, and then everything went to hell - not just ABK. The point is that getting ABK #1 back would be very helpful right now.

IIRC he was fine until the start of the relegation season (more than fine if you check the 2022 posts), but that season was a total shitshow. Three managers, two of them dire, players checking out all around, fractured dressing room, relegation inevitable long before the season ended, SMS was a depressing place for fans and players alike. He was far from the only one who didn't want to be here for 2023-24 in the Championship. But he's still here, for whatever reason, and we have huge problems at the back. The questions for me are: What changed that early guy? Can we fix it? Why are we apparently not even trying when, warts and all, he's far better than some automatic starters who are costing us games? I have no doubt that Martin sees himself as a top-notch "man manager". This is a great opportunity to show it - the potential upside is huge.

The only thing I can see is Turk's post, from more than two years ago, suggesting that it came from that bastion of well-researched, well-informed journalism - the Daily Star. All the comment about his play is super-positive. Those are fixable issues (p.s. to Russell - fines and bollockings work wonders). That's why I think someone is in Martin's ear.

Today demonstrates (yet again) that the question shouldn't be whether Martin reintegrates ABK into the squad but how he's going to fix the attitude issue and do it. I'd rather have a strong, skilled, ball playing defender with an attitude issue than a mentally slow, ball-watching, shit-passing player with a great attitude. But maybe that's just me. A follow-up question I have is "Who is in Martin's ear telling him that ABK is bad news?" Check out the early pages of this thread and it's universal recognition that we have a gem on our hands and won't be able to keep him.

The part I can’t wait to see is how Ramsdale’s arrival impacts Martin’s tactical approach and even his starting formation. Ramsdale has some unique distribution skills that almost turn Martin’s missing Plan B into more of a Plan A. At the very least it adds a solid Plan B.

Recognizing that inflated egos are welded into most modern players, I still think we’ve had more than our fair share of really good players with bad attitudes. It’s very frustrating and it makes me wonder if there’s something on the inside at the root of it. Hate selling players like that but sometimes there’s little choice.

I’m not sure he’s ever played for Martin, so he’s going on what he’s been told. ABK’s talent has never been in doubt but he’s earned his bad reputation. Much of it was earned in a shitshow season when we had lots of dressing room issues. But Martin has also earned his reputation as a good man manager so I wonder who has convinced him not to even try to rehabilitate ABK.

I thought he was a pretty effective LWB - fast on the break, great cross, and much better defensively than Manning. He’s solid in both roles. Maybe not a starter but a good bench asset.