Lord Duckhunter

What a load of ****ing shiete. NO MONEY, ********, I bet they all had mobile phones. I just dont recongnise the picture of "povety" that lefties and sandal wearers portray in this country. 80% of the Worlds population would give their right arms to live in the "povety" that those riotting idiots live in. I'm glad my Gran's not around today to hear your definition of "no money". She had a disabled husband in a wheelchair before the welfare state. She was trying to bring up 2 children in the 1940's with a husband unable to work, yet she didn't riot. She didn't complain, or moan she just got on with it. I cant quite see her whining whilst trying to scrape some food togther "It's not fair , I didn't invade Poland" Before setting off to riot and burn down her neighbour's business' and communites where real people lived. She was too busy trying to survive than to waste time and energy rioting.

Come on, he does have a point. Have you seen how much tax is on ciggies and Booze? If they spend all their dole money on fags & booze, they are contributing towards the money that the taxpayer then pays them ,to buy fags and booze. It's trickle down socialist economics.

Any statue has to include the old women on the disability scooter and Steven Hawkin's love child on the bubble bus..........

That's exactly the problem, and it's not just people out of work. As I said earlier I've had good hard workers, who have refused prmotion and a higher wage because it would hit their WFTC. Their line is that they'll get a lot more hassle at work being at a higher level and any increase in pay will be cancelled out by a loss of benefit.

I doubt if I would need to. More than likely I would get better provision by just staying on welfare, which is exactly my point. If the local dole office (if there's still such a thing) said "we have a job for you, pushing trollys at Tesco and if you dont take it your benefits will be cut", what would I do? So what if some rich tw at see's me, he should think I'm doing all I can to support the family, not start taking the pi 55 down the golf club. Every week on Question time they'll be some numpty in the crowd telling us how "they'd do anything, they just want a job". I would love for one of the panelists to turn round and say "I'll give you a job, you can clean my house 5 days a week, minimum wage". I wonder how many of the "desperate to work" people would do it, and do it well.

Its just not about motivation. They were respcetful, polite and a credit to their country. We have a whole generation of people who feel that they should have a right to work in their given field. There are certain jobs that they feel are below them. When I left school there was a recession on, jobs were scarce. Most of my mates struggled to get jobs, but my old man kept on and on at me.Used to make me get up when he went to work, asked me each night "what have you done to find work today". His take on it was I could stay at the house rent free, but I had to be looking for a job. He also wouldn't let me go on the **** until I found one. Occasionally, taking me up his local (which was the most boring pub I've ever been in). In the end I ended up getting a job just to shut him up. I was scared of heights at the time, but ended up labouring for a roofer, and this was the pre H&S days, so I used to shiete myself daily. I just worked out that I was more scared of my dad than I was of heights, so went to work and overcame the fear of heights quickly. The point is, I had a middle class upbringing and my parents could easily have kept me until I found a job that fitted with what I wanted. That wasn't an option for them, their policy was get any job and then start looking for what you want. Undoubtably there are youngsters with that attitude, but are there as many as there should be? What doesn't help is the last Govt con job on the young, leading them to believe you had to go to uni. That has driven the "I've spent 3 years on a degree, I'm not going to dig holes" attitude in some of them.

The FL can impose any terms they like in return for the Golden share, I believe ours was no appeal, Boscombe & Leeds' was extra point's deduction. They'll see how it plays out before making any decision. The Leeds thing was because Bates took the pi ss. Surely if it's Chanari, they'll do the same. I feel that if a miracle happens and the bell ringers community club thing takes over, they'll bend over backwards to help them.

Spot on, they should be a stop gap. If there were more people like your mate, then welfare would not be such a toxic issue.

Welfare should be "has no money and takes money from the state on a temp basis whilst looking for a job (any job)".

I have had English people turn down promotions because it effects their WFTC. I have had Englsih people turn down overtime for the same reason, or they claim it's not worth it because the tax man takes a lot of it. I have yet to have a Pole turn down overtime, in fact I had to tell them to take time off because they were overdoing it. I cant speak for all Poles, but the ones that worked for me, were hard working, respectful and would do any job asked of them without complaining. I wish the same could be said of all my English workers.

My wife is a student midwife, and she has a NUS card. She qualifies in the next couple of months and (fingers crossed) starts with the NHS in Nov, where she will be earning pretty decent money. If the ticket office just accepted her NUS card, she would be getting a consession price for the whole season. Surely it's only right that students prove that they are going to be a student for the whole (or large majority) of season? I would say the ticket office have done the right thing.

So we can't cut the benefits of people refusing to join proper society, because if we do they'll just do illigal things? Welfare should be a safety net for people who are struggling at any given time. Provided they want to get into work, are willing to do any work and are honest law abiding citizens (or is it subjects), then I see no reason why the state shouldn't help them through a difficult period. What I cant get my head round is why our money should be used to fund someone's lifestyle choice. If half a million Poles can find work at the drop of a hat, why are there English people in their 20's & 30's who have never worked?

The feeding part is easy, some sort of pre paid card which can be used in supermarkets to buy food. The unpalatable truth is that the only way we can break the cycle in some cases is to take the children away from the destructive family life they have. In 2012 that is not going to happen, so we end up with generations and generations left behind. It's not the kids fault and if there was an easier answer someone would have found it by now.

Exactly. No doubt Red Ken will be one of the first lefties squealing about welfare clampdown.

5 years ago I was trying to fill posts just above the minimum wage. All I got applying was Polish and timewasters. Timewasters who applying for the jobs, just to satisfy the autherites that they were looking for work and therefore could keep their benefits. They barely made any attempt to conceal the fact, and did not really want the jobs. It is these people that I think of when reforming the benefit system is discussed. How was it that half a million Polish came over here and found work, yet their are people who have been unemployed 10 years? Welfare should be a safety net for people, not a way of life. You say you worry about "the implementation, which is likely to be scatter-gun, and will likely affect people that fall well outside this culture of entitlement" , but the people to blame for this are not the ones trying to clamp down on abuse, but the ones that milk the system to end up with more disposable income than the average working man.As you say it will not be done until after the next election, so let's hope the Torys put it in their manifesto, and then nobody can complain they haven't got a mandate for it.

I'm also attacking Labour rank and file that voted Tax avioder ken Livingstone onto their NEC. In fact Livingstone topped the poll, that's how serious they are about tax aviodence in the Labour party. We expect our politians to be hypocrites, but when it trickles down to the grass roots, it's a bit worrying.

I didn't know that only one country outside of Europe has 50% or higher tax rate, so thanks for that. My view is pretty much that a % is a %, and can't quite understand why the richest have to pay an even higher %. Particulary when you bare in mind that they pay for an NHS they proberly dont use, schools for their children when most go private, and public transport which I doubt they ever go on. All in all we get a good deal out of the richest in society and they pay a lot more in terms of % into the revenue than they did in the 70's. I'm just under the 40%, will never get anywhere near the 45%/50% but still feel the richest do pay their fair share, it's just the ones that dodge it who give the rest a bad name.

Agreed, it should not be optional. But people who do consider it optional should not be Knighted . And when someone who feels it's optional comes top of a political parties election for their NEC, that party really should STFU about tax dodgers.

The HMRC conducted a study into tax aviodence, and The study said the use of tax reliefs on charitable donations was among the top three tax loopholes used to legally reduce income tax bills. Osbourne closed that down, then came the howls of anger and attacks on the Tory party for being out of touch. The vehicle that Carr used was set up by Gordon Brown to help film funding . Had that been closed you would have had luvvies and their leftie mates whinning on about the Govt being "out of touch". It's the same with the so called pasty tax. Why is it right for massive Companys like Gregs to not charge VAT on a hot pasty, but the local family chippie has to? As soon as the Govt tries to do something about tax a special interest group will hit the airwaves and the BBC will lap it up. There are only so many loopholes, because there are so many tax breaks here and there for various pet projects, but also because the tax rate is so high in this country.

Is that the same Philip Green knighted by the Labour Govt?

I have lived in Poole for the past 20 years, and the number of Saints fans I have met, or seen around with shirts on is directly linked to how we are doing and what legaue we are in. Right through the late 90's and early 00's there were plenty, but the last few years there has been less and less.Last season they started popping up again. I travel by train most games, and there used to be a large number of Saints supporters already on the train, when I got on at Poole. The past few years, there have been hardly any. Now, unless people from Weymouth & Wareham ect have started driving it must be linked to which league we're in. I guess we will see whether they are back next year. The fact that we were in the top league alone for the most part of 30 years, has attracted people from all over Dorset. Surely had Boscombe been in the top flight and Saints in the 3rd & 4th tier, these people from Weymouth, Wimborne, Ferndown ect ect would have been going to watch Boscombe. Playing in the top flight and having a degree of sucsess clearly widens your catchment area, and increases the number of fair weather fans. Most on here are "hardcore" and will follow Saints in what ever league we're in, but there are thousends who just want to be seen to support a sucsessful/top flight club. It's why there are loads of non scousers in their 40's support Liverpool and loads of non mancs in their 30's support Man U, and why in 30 years time there will be loads of middle aged man City supporters, who have no connection with the City.

Agreed, And the fake moral outrage from Labour Politicans makes me sick. One of the most notorious tax avioders is Phillip Green, who saved £285 million worth of tax in 2002, by buying Arcadia in his Monaco based wife's name.Fast forward 4 years and he gets awarded a knighthood by the Labour Govt. We have a fat cat business tax avioder knighted, a hypocrite champagne socilaist tax avioder coming top of their NEC vote, yet they still bang on about "sticking up for the right people".

Yes, Blair and Mandleson's tax affairs would make interesting reading. And who has just come top of their NEC vote, held just 2 days ago? It's our old friend Ken "21% corporation tax" Livingstone. Rich Tory families, bankers and entertainers are bad people for avioding tax. Whereas champagne socialist Tax avioders get voted onto to Labour's NEC.

If you're going to use technology, the most sensible thing I've read on here is Bob's 3 challanges. Anything else would be the thin end of the wedge in my opinion. GLT may beep to alert the ref that the ball has crossed the line. But how is it fair to just use it for that? A corner at OT is bent in after going out of play, SRL heads it towards goal, the ref's watch (or whatever) bleeps, and a goal is awarded. It should have been a goal kick. One line decision was subject to technology and one 2 seconds earlier that was an important part of the goal (the cross) was not. Can you see the Fergie's, Wenger's ect standing for that?

Did you see that chump Angela Eagle on the Dail Politics yesterday. They had some fit Socilaist French bird on, and he was asking about the 75% tax rate. Andrew Neil asked Eagle what she thought of it and she was all bluster and waffle. kept banging on about "we wont announce our tax plans until nearer the election". Neil pressed her 3 times, what do YOU think of the 75% tax rate and she wouldn't answer. Neil said, "what's the point in coming on here if you wont answer my questions", when eagle said "can I just make one point" he said "no, you wont answer a simple question, so you can keep quiet". Her attitude summed Labour up completely. Alan Duncan (who I think is a t wat) said, it's bad uncompetitive and wont bring anymore money in. The Labour bint could not bring herself to even comment on it.......