Terrorist Attacks - WARNING: CONTAINS DISTRESSING IMAGES

[hypochondriac]

2 minutes ago, Farmer Saint said:

That's fair enough - as you say I certainly am not saying she brought it on herself, but she had some utterly appalling opinions in my eyes - and I would say the same about Farage, Tice and Trump if they were murdered as well. I'm pretty sure I said the same about Charlie Kirk.

I think zack polanski is a cunt with some appaling policies. If he was horribly murdered and the first public reaction from someone I know was what a cunt he was then I'd think they were a bit of a prick to be honest. Like I said, I think social media has encouraged this sort of thing it's just quite depressing when someone just been horribly killed.

[Sir Ralph]

56 minutes ago, Farmer Saint said:

Still waiting for you guys to explain why just because someone is dead they can't be a cunt.

It shouldn’t need an explanation - in tragedy in particular, you either have respect for people regardless of politics or you don’t. Ironic that you have tried to teach others lessons in empathy in the past.

Edited 17 hours ago by Sir Ralph

[Gloucester Saint]

40 minutes ago, moonraker said:

If she stuck to politics and not ethics and morales I would agree. I do not and will never condone murder, nothing can justify it.

 

Good post. The views about ethics and morals went way beyond political ideologies but she never deserved what happened to her, no way.

[Sir Ralph]

11 minutes ago, Gloucester Saint said:

Good post. The views about ethics and morals went way beyond political ideologies but she never deserved what happened to her, no way.

Politics are intrinsically linked to ethics and morales. Not a good post. You might disagree with her but she was a leading voice in the Conservative Party for many years. You may not agree with some her views but she was hardly seen as an extremist in normal society (the echo chamber here is not a good sample test). The bbc let her on strictly for goodness sake. 

Edited 16 hours ago by Sir Ralph

[Gloucester Saint]

If people want to go down the whataboutery route, then Hitler and the Holocaust is politics, so is Stalin and the purges. Pol Pot etc. The line has to be drawn somewhere.

I met Ann and liked her, but this view as one example was going to draw conflict. She was entitled to say it but it’s not part of normal or acceptable political discourse. Not in Europe, in America at the moment with the MAGA fanatics it would be. Neither does it excuse the appalling act of violence which killed her https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-48491731

[iansums]

I can’t help thinking that Farmer is standing in for SOG who seems to have disappeared 😳

[Gloucester Saint]

I’ve met her, so my post will naturally be a bit more relevant to topic.

As I’ve posted before, I liked her when I met her, and some views I’d have had in common with her like animal rights (she was very anti fox hunting for example). Some of her views I agreed with on law and order as well (I’m more to the right on that than the average because of my background) but others I disagreed.

The views on LGBT, even as a happily married hetrosexual man were beyond reasonable debate though and even Farage admitted that. 

 

[trousers]

 

 

[hypochondriac]

1 minute ago, trousers said:

 

 

From a gay man no less. Ian Dale another notable very close friend. 

[trousers]

Edited 16 hours ago by trousers

[Sir Ralph]

4 minutes ago, trousers said:

Same happened after Charlie Kirk unfortunately

[Gloucester Saint]

I agree with the social media posts there. When I met her, she reminded me of family members I have - different views but a good heart behind it all which you never get with most politicians, or people these days.

The ghouls celebrating her death are vile, full stop. 

[hypochondriac]

9 minutes ago, Gloucester Saint said:

I agree with the social media posts there. When I met her, she reminded me of family members I have - different views but a good heart behind it all which you never get with most politicians, or people these days.

The ghouls celebrating her death are vile, full stop. 

She reminded me of my great aunt. From another time really with some pretty objectionable views. One of the kindest and most dignified people you would ever meet. Definitely not a cunt.

[Sir Ralph]

 

[LuckyNumber7]

5 hours ago, Farmer Saint said:

More white terrorism hidden on the BBC news page:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cvgl20x1ggpo

Two tier reporting from the Beeb again.

How is it hidden?

[Sir Ralph]

Th bizarre thing about this is why were the police so keen to push this idea that the attack wasn’t politically motivated? The bloke drove 4 hours from Rotherham than morning. Not exactly a speculative burglary. Doesn’t add up. 

[Farmer Saint]

10 hours ago, hypochondriac said:

I think zack polanski is a cunt with some appaling policies. If he was horribly murdered and the first public reaction from someone I know was what a cunt he was then I'd think they were a bit of a prick to be honest. Like I said, I think social media has encouraged this sort of thing it's just quite depressing when someone just been horribly killed.

9 hours ago, Sir Ralph said:

It shouldn’t need an explanation - in tragedy in particular, you either have respect for people regardless of politics or you don’t. Ironic that you have tried to teach others lessons in empathy in the past.

See, I'm not sure I agree with you both there.

When H from Steps was murdered in prison a few months ago, or Ian Huntley, there were a number of "glad he's dead" posts, which were not castigated at all, and I didn't say anything anywhere near as extreme as that.

[Farmer Saint]

7 hours ago, LuckyNumber7 said:

How is it hidden?

It was story 12 when it was first posted.

[Farmer Saint]

9 hours ago, iansums said:

I can’t help thinking that Farmer is standing in for SOG who seems to have disappeared 😳

So you don't think homophobes are bad people then? Just wondering as you seemed to decide to dodge that question.

[Farmer Saint]

9 hours ago, Gloucester Saint said:

If people want to go down the whataboutery route, then Hitler and the Holocaust is politics, so is Stalin and the purges. Pol Pot etc. The line has to be drawn somewhere.

I met Ann and liked her, but this view as one example was going to draw conflict. She was entitled to say it but it’s not part of normal or acceptable political discourse. Not in Europe, in America at the moment with the MAGA fanatics it would be. Neither does it excuse the appalling act of violence which killed her https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-48491731

Exactly this. Politics is about opinions. I draw the line at being a homophobe, and that puts her on the wrong side of that divide, that's all. 

Edited 7 hours ago by Farmer Saint

[ChrisPY]

11 minutes ago, Farmer Saint said:

See, I'm not sure I agree with you both there.

When H from Steps was murdered in prison a few months ago, or Ian Huntley, there were a number of "glad he's dead" posts, which were not castigated at all, and I didn't say anything anywhere near as extreme as that.

That’s a tragedy I’ve not seen reported elsewhere.

[Farmer Saint]

8 minutes ago, ChrisPY said:

That’s a tragedy I’ve not seen reported elsewhere.

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2026/may/07/ian-watkins-lostprophets-singer-accused-boasted-guards-fame-court-told

 

[whelk]

42 minutes ago, Farmer Saint said:

So you don't think homophobes are bad people then? Just wondering as you seemed to decide to dodge that question.

Was she a homophobe? Everyone loves calling everything phobic these days. She is allowed to have religious believe that don’t believe in it, which is not the same as hating all homosexuals. There are testimonies from gay people who say this was the case.

Not to derail with whataboutery but what often seems dodged is Islam”s view on homosexuality which is very intolerant yet it only appears levelled at someone with strong Christian beliefs.

[egg]

49 minutes ago, Farmer Saint said:

Exactly this. Politics is about opinions. I draw the line at being a homophobe, and that puts her on the wrong side of that divide, that's all. 

I don't know enough her opinions to know what she was about, but this thread appears to have become about the morals of expressing the same views of a person after they've died as you'd have expressed whilst they were alive. This forum has hardly been a place for unpopular people being granted a posthumous pardon. 

[hypochondriac]

1 hour ago, Farmer Saint said:

See, I'm not sure I agree with you both there.

When H from Steps was murdered in prison a few months ago, or Ian Huntley, there were a number of "glad he's dead" posts, which were not castigated at all, and I didn't say anything anywhere near as extreme as that.

It's not really a reasonable comparison is it as you well know.

[Farmer Saint]

43 minutes ago, whelk said:

Was she a homophobe? Everyone loves calling everything phobic these days. She is allowed to have religious believe that don’t believe in it, which is not the same as hating all homosexuals. There are testimonies from gay people who say this was the case.

Not to derail with whataboutery but what often seems dodged is Islam”s view on homosexuality which is very intolerant yet it only appears levelled at someone with strong Christian beliefs.

I think many of her views and statements can be seen as homophobic for sure, and I'm not sure that the "She had gay friends" is a suitable defence. Science creating a "solution" to being gay was one of hers.

Not sure of the relevance of Islam when talking about Widdecombe. You can be a Christian and be homophobic or not homophobic. Same with being a Muslim.

Edited 5 hours ago by Farmer Saint

[Farmer Saint]

13 minutes ago, hypochondriac said:

It's not really a reasonable comparison is it as you well know.

Why not? Many people have said they find her views abhorrent. In fact, you yourself said that people have a right to think she was a cunt. So why the two tier grieving? 

[egg]

11 minutes ago, hypochondriac said:

It's not really a reasonable comparison is it as you well know.

Who decides where the line is drawn though? I wouldn't have called the poor old girl a cunt whilst alive or dead, but if somebody felt it appropriate to call them that whilst alive, it's not totally inappropriate to call them that after they've died. 

Feels odd to me that people who've celebrated death, and/or refused to condone killers and bad regimes, are getting their knickers in a knot about someone speaking ill of the dead. 

[Farmer Saint]

37 minutes ago, egg said:

I don't know enough her opinions to know what she was about, but this thread appears to have become about the morals of expressing the same views of a person after they've died as you'd have expressed whilst they were alive. This forum has hardly been a place for unpopular people being granted a posthumous pardon. 

BBC News - MEP Ann Widdecombe sparks fury with gay science comments - BBC News
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-48491731?app-referrer=deep-link

 

https://www.thepinknews.com/2026/07/10/ann-widdecombes-dead-lgbtq-track-record/

 

 

Edited 5 hours ago by Farmer Saint

[Farmer Saint]

12 minutes ago, egg said:

Who decides where the line is drawn though? I wouldn't have called the poor old girl a cunt whilst alive or dead, but if somebody felt it appropriate to call them that whilst alive, it's not totally inappropriate to call them that after they've died. 

Feels odd to me that people who've celebrated death, and/or refused to condone killers and bad regimes, are getting their knickers in a knot about someone speaking ill of the dead. 

Thank you for putting it more eloquently than I have.

I think the issue that Hypo et al seem to have is that they are happy to speak ill of the dead if it is someone they think deserves it (Ian Watkins or Ian Huntley for example), and I'm not even celebrating her death. As I said previously she absolutely didn't deserve to die in the way she did. 

Doesn't stop her being a right cunt though.

Edited 5 hours ago by Farmer Saint

[rallyboy]

If we can celebrate anything as a group I think it's the evolution of the phrase two-tier grieving.

It's what Ann would have wanted, bringing people together.

Well, not everyone obviously, not those groups of society that she ferociously campaigned against.

 

 

Edited 5 hours ago by rallyboy

[trousers]

1 minute ago, rallyboy said:

If we can celebrate anything as a group I think it's the evolution of the phrase two-tier grieving.

It's what Anne would have wanted, bringing people together.

Well, not everyone obviously, not those groups of society that she ferociously campaigned against.

 

 

*Ann

[Sir Ralph]

2 hours ago, Farmer Saint said:

So you don't think homophobes are bad people then? Just wondering as you seemed to decide to dodge that question.

Whilst she, for example, voted against certain proposed LGBT… legislation that doesn’t make somebody a homophobe. How do you square off the fact that she was friends with a number of gay celebrities as outlined above who have come out in support of her?

You literally labelled me a child killer because I disagreed with the removal of the two child welfare cap so your standard for offence generally is a very low bar

Edited 4 hours ago by Sir Ralph

[Farmer Saint]

3 minutes ago, Sir Ralph said:

Define a homophobe

"Homophobic" describes prejudice, discrimination, or negative attitudes and feelings toward homosexuality or people perceived to be lesbian, gay, or bisexual. 

Edited 4 hours ago by Farmer Saint

[trousers]

1 hour ago, whelk said:

Was she a homophobe? Everyone loves calling everything phobic these days. She is allowed to have religious believe that don’t believe in it, which is not the same as hating all homosexuals. There are testimonies from gay people who say this was the case.

 

 

[egg]

5 minutes ago, Farmer Saint said:

"Homophobic" describes prejudice, discrimination, or negative attitudes and feelings toward homosexuality or people perceived to be lesbian, gay, or bisexual. 

Are people now performing a posthumous character analysis of her to decide whether she has crossed a SW "cunt" threshold? 

Very odd thread is this. 

[Sir Ralph]

22 minutes ago, Farmer Saint said:

"Homophobic" describes prejudice, discrimination, or negative attitudes and feelings toward homosexuality or people perceived to be lesbian, gay, or bisexual. 

 

Whilst she, for example, voted against certain proposed LGBT… legislation that doesn’t make somebody a homophobe. How do you square off the fact that she was friends with a number of gay celebrities as outlined above who have come out in support of her? You can disagree with something and not be racist, homophobic, etc. it’s how you treat the individual - you should read @trousers copy and paste above it nails it

You did label me a child killer because I disagreed with the removal of the two child welfare cap. so if that’s the standard for calling someone that, you are too easily offended by people that you don’t agree with

Edited 4 hours ago by Sir Ralph

[hypochondriac]

I think it's fine to consider Ann Widdecombe to be a cunt even if I disagree. For that to be your first public reaction following her murder is in my opinion in very poor taste and reflects badly on whoever does it. I'm happy that there's an obvious distinction for most people between someone with some strong conservative and old school Christian values that some people disagree with and someone who rapes babies.

[Farmer Saint]

20 minutes ago, egg said:

Are people now performing a posthumous character analysis of her to decide whether she has crossed a SW "cunt" threshold? 

Very odd thread is this. 

Agreed - ironic the type of people that are acting like snowflakes about this.

[Farmer Saint]

30 minutes ago, Sir Ralph said:

 

Whilst she, for example, voted against certain proposed LGBT… legislation that doesn’t make somebody a homophobe. How do you square off the fact that she was friends with a number of gay celebrities as outlined above who have come out in support of her? You can disagree with something and not be racist, homophobic, etc. it’s how you treat the individual - you should read @trousers copy and paste above it nails it

You did label me a child killer because I disagreed with the removal of the two child welfare cap. so if that’s the standard for calling someone that, you are too easily offended by people that you don’t agree with

Again, the whole "I have gay friends" defense is laughable and the last solace of a guilty mind.

I would suggest reading the Pink News article above, and would like you to honestly say, hand on heart, that she believed gay people should be treated the same as straight people.

I also didn't label you a child killer. I said would you prefer to give a little bit of additional money to families with children to stop child poverty and ensure that more children survived, or not. You wouldn't answer I seem to remember.

Edited 4 hours ago by Farmer Saint

[Farmer Saint]

7 minutes ago, hypochondriac said:

I think it's fine to consider Ann Widdecombe to be a cunt even if I disagree. For that to be your first public reaction following her murder is in my opinion in very poor taste and reflects badly on whoever does it. I'm happy that there's an obvious distinction for most people between someone with some strong conservative and old school Christian values that some people disagree with and someone who rapes babies.

It wasn't my first reaction TBF, my first reaction was on the other thread.

As far as I'm concerned, they are both cunts, one more extreme than the other, but nevertheless both on that side of the divide.

Don't worry though, I'll make sure the next time I look to criticise someone I'll ensure I ask you and Sir Ralph to decide whether or not you condone me reacting in that way about someone.

[Mustang Saint]

3 hours ago, Farmer Saint said:

See, I'm not sure I agree with you both there.

When H from Steps was murdered in prison a few months ago, or Ian Huntley, there were a number of "glad he's dead" posts, which were not castigated at all, and I didn't say anything anywhere near as extreme as that.

H from Steps wasn't murdered in prison, he's currently sponging a living doing panto, you're referring to the Lostprophets kiddy fiddler, who raped children, little different from a little old lady getting murdered for her opinion..

[Farmer Saint]

3 minutes ago, Mustang Saint said:

H from Steps wasn't murdered in prison, he's currently sponging a living doing panto, you're referring to the Lostprophets kiddy fiddler, who raped children, little different from a little old lady getting murdered for her opinion..

I know who I'm referring to, thank you very much. Good to see I have you to police whether I can think someone is a cunt or not though 👍

[Mustang Saint]

8 minutes ago, Farmer Saint said:

I know who I'm referring to, thank you very much. Good to see I have you to police whether I can think someone is a cunt or not though 👍

When H from Steps was murdered in prison a few months ago

 

I would say clearly not?

[whelk]

46 minutes ago, egg said:

Are people now performing a posthumous character analysis of her to decide whether she has crossed a SW "cunt" threshold? 

Very odd thread is this. 

Even I am getting appalled at the overuse of cunt in this thread. It should be saved for extreme right or left and thick people…and Boro fans….and Argies, Portsmouth fans obviously. I best stop now

[whelk]

Whoever murdered H from Steps is definitely a cunt

[rallyboy]

H was a pretty notorious inmate, I remember when Steps first started out they even named a prison block after him, and Charles Bronson didn't get that, despite his extensive film career prior to his offending.

[egg]

28 minutes ago, Farmer Saint said:

Agreed - ironic the type of people that are acting like snowflakes about this.

People with questionable morals questioning the morals of others for questioning the morals of someone who has died is odd even by the SW standards. 

[whelk]

What I really fucking hate is labelling as if there are no grey areas. Not one of you bastards don’t have prejudices that pre-judge people. Maybe they aren’t overtly on skin colour or sexual orientation. Let he who is without sin….

[egg]

3 minutes ago, whelk said:

Even I am getting appalled at the overuse of cunt in this thread. It should be saved for extreme right or left and thick people…and Boro fans….and Argies, Portsmouth fans obviously. I best stop now

Pretty much this. 

Doctors receptionists too. They've annoyed me this week so cross the threshold.