SW11_Saint

Given that Lowe came in and "sacked everyone" (Pearson etc.), clearly without a clue of what to do next, are you including him in that group? Mind, even if Lowe had money I wouldn't trust him with it.

I've never been more concerned about a total and utter humilation. Of course we're used to the odd 7 goal drubbing at places like Everton, even when we were in the premiership, but the gulf in class between us and United is truly frightening. I actually think we will be worse off it they play their kids - which Fergie is bound to do, no need for a first team vs. us - as they always look to impress and they have an incredible array of talent. It could truly be double figures, no doubt about it, but I suspect it will end up being 5 or 6-1 (the '1' possibly coming first to jerk them into action...).

To suggest our sorry state started simply because we didn't appoint Glen Hoddle is rather ridiculous...

I am all for giving people time, but this is the last straw for me I am afraid. Jan Poortvliet was the wrong appointment, at the wrong time; appointed by a man with a track record of poor decisions and the drastically misguided belief that he "always knows better" than anyone else. We had a very able young manager in Nigel Pearson (note readers, Leicester won 4-0 today to cement their place at the top of League 1), some promising youngsters who could have been brought through in a considered and sensible way, without over-pressurisinng them, and some seasoned pro's who could help their progression. We could easily have cut costs etc. but have retained Pearson and the hub of a half-decent side. But oh no, it was time for another moment of 'genius' by the leader of the board... If anyone else was Chairman I'd want them to ACT NOW, end this bizarre experiment with lower league Dutch coaches, and appoint someone with experience. But of course our Chairman is Rupert Lowe (I'm ignoring the monkey that is the SFC Chairman, and focussing on the organ-grinder here) so (a) he won't do anything to stop the rot, as that will entail admitting he was wrong, something he is unable to to - even if for the good of the club; and (b) who the **** would trust him to make a sensible appointment anyway?? Today was a must win game. We LOST. The manager must carry the can for our inability to win at home. Can you imagine any other club with a home record of just one win all season retaining the services of their manager? We are in very grave danger of slipping into the third tier of english football. Read that sentence again, and think about it. If you are reading this, you think about it too Mr. Lowe. Do you just sit idly by, continuing to watch us fall apart, or do you take action NOW to try and stop the rot? In honesty, I have absolutely no faith in you whatsoever to do the right thing, and my AGM ballot-card illustrated this fact, but against logic, I do cling to the remote hope that you will take counsel from those around you and do something to help save our Saints while there is still time...

He did what any sensible person reviewing our balance sheet would have done - and no doubt he was required to do by the bank - cut costs. Cutting costs however has to be balanced with the right strategy for the club - sure, cut some of those who are earning too much, but keep those who can still going to make a positive impact (e.g. Stern John). Is sacking the coaching staff and appointing a brand new set of coaches a cost cutting measure? I'd debate that one. I agree that Crouch had let costs get out of hand, but it doesn't make Lowe a genius for identifying the issue. The greatest tragedy in all of this, is that with our history, fan base and potential that we have been subjected to a stream of sub-standard Chairmen. We really deserve better.

Sorry? Please provide some evidence for this statement? A 'cracking businessman' doesn't lose £30m through poor decisions, have 90+% of his customer base against him and attract the most appalling PR the company has ever known. Will everyone please stop thinking that just because Lowe worked in the City he's some sort of corporate genius. He's nothing like - just a small time businessman, like all of the other jokers we've had in recenty years running the club.

We had a good young manager, we had a decent youth set up, we had some experienced heads to help them along. Most felt we had 'turned the corner' after the Sheff Utd. game last season. Cut costs/dead wood by all means, but keep a decent spine and and bleed in the better youngsters as and when they are ready. We'd probably be at least mid-table. We'd likely be getting regular 20k+ gates. Oh no, that was all too simple. What we really needed was another Lowe "revolutionary" idea - 'total football' played by teenagers with no experience, in a cloggers league, managed, sorry 'coached' by a Dutchman with good intentions but no experience of English football, and with a managerial record of lower dutch leagues only. It was barmy then, it's barmy now. But as ever with Lowe, the only way he ever gets proved wrong hurts the club terribly. Incidentally, no one will ever convince me that getting rid of Pearson was motivated by anything other than spite (against Crouch). Sadly, unless someone comes in that can move the club forward and we can finally rid oursleves of Lowe, his ridulous ideas, and his toxic mix of ego, arrogance and ignorance, we're basically f****d. The club is literally falling apart before our eyes...

Typical Lowe statement - putting onus on players, trying to abstain himself of any responsibility - prior to the inevitable fire sale that will happen in January... (at which point he can turn around and say he wanted to keep them but the bid from Fulham/Spurs/Stoke and the chance to play in the Premiership was just too much of an attraction...). Incidentally, why isn't the Chairman of SFC handling this media onslaught?

The thought of playing them terrifies me, but great to have a big name/game and a full house again. Come on you Saints!

With the obvious exception of Davenport (which I assume was a joke!), a great line-up. I'd give an honourable mention to Neil Ruddock too - if nothing else for his last minute pen vs. Newcastle (when he got stripped down to his jock strap by the crowd!) - and Mel Blyth. My heart says Jim Steele for his MoM performance on 1 May 1976, Dave Watson was probably one of the greatest english centre halves I've seen, Wright was an immense talent, but I have never quite forgiven him for the way he legged it to Derby, Clause was different class for so many years. Based on their impact for Saints... ...Screw it, I'll go for Claus and Jim Steele.

Nick H played there quite a bit towards the end of his career. Also got quite a lot of stick as I remember - outrageous for such a great servant to the club. From Franny, Peach, Holmes, Mills, Dennis, Statham, Bale, Bridge I'd have to go for Mark Dennis. Had everything you need in a fullback - tigerish tackling, speed, bravery, perceptive thinking. And of course he was a psycho, which made him a legend!

I can imagine most of this being true. I've always thought Redknapp was a decent manager and so he had proved (before and after his stint with us). Our setup and Mr. Lowe's, ahem, 'experiments', make it almost impossible for managers to do well here.

Yes, but they had some half decent players, a millionairre chairman and a decent young English league experienced manager. You're not comparing apples with apples; rather apples with prunes...

They might be telling him to "cut cloth accordingly" but not how to do it, or who to farm out. Why not farm out 2-3 kids and keep the fella that scored 18 goals last season, and knows this division inside out? THAT decision was Lowes undboubtedly - yet again his toxic mix of arrogance and ignorance means he will force his will, whatever the outcome. Lord help us... (yes, I'm talking to you Matt!).

Poortvliet is quite simply out of his depth. We'll scrape the odd point here and there, but more often than not we'll be on then end of consistent hammerings by average or worse teams. 95% of our supporters knew this would happen - playing kids in a cloggers league, managed by a non-league manager was always doomed. Buy, hey, what do we know - we're just the dumb schmuks who pay their wages...

A bunch of young players who are not ready for this level of football + A 3rd tier Dutch manager, with nice ideas, but hopelessly out of his depth + An FC Chairman who literally stands by unable or unwilling to taken any positive action + A egomaniac Plc. Chairman who is still inflicting insane experiments on the club (just after we all thought we'd turned the corner, with a young, bright, league experienced, track-suit manager) + Disastrous management of the club pre and post relelgation, leaving us with not a penny to rub together. = Us being well and truly ****ed. (But go on, do any of us really care? After all, we just sit by week after week and let it happen)

Another nail in our coffin. Rudderless, spiritless, destitute. Where this will end, god knows... (it'll start wtih League 1 football obviously).

If this was any other club, and any other person, I'd say it was a ludicrous suggestion. However, given it's Saints and it's Lowe, sadly it is totally believeable. That he'd keep a player who could help our cause and our youngsters out of pure spite - even when it's harming the club is... well, typical sadly. How on earth did we get back into this situation? Isn't this where Wilde should step in and talk some sense to Herr Lowe? Oh no, I forgot - he's an invertebrate...

I have no proof whatsoever, and I doubt there's any SCW involvement, but I have no doubt that JP is being "encouraged" by Lowe to play the younger players at the expense of those with proven experience like John, Perry, Skacel etc. just so that he can 'prove' to everyone that his masterplan is sound, and that he knows better than anyone else. The sad thing is, that even though the plan is clearly failing, and what most sensisble people suggested would happen is happening - i.e. the kids are being bullied out of games, getting crushing defeats and deflating their confidence - will make no difference whatsoever. Lowe will continue regardless. Sound like the insane strategy of a megalomaniac? Yes, doesn't it...

I think every pundit so far has missed the point on this one. This is not about generally scapegoating England players, or about the hatred of Chelsea. It's about Ashley Cole, and the fact that he's generally loathed. The pass-back just gave the fans the opportunity to express what they generally think of him. He does however personify what most people hate about modern Premiership footballers - and their perceived traits: greed, overblown ego, celebrity, amorality - but he is one of the worst culprits imho.

I am sure this has been done before, but I'm bored, it's Sunday and I fancy stimulating some debate... My question is this: What single event or action signalled the start of our demise, or sealed our fate in your view? (e.g. could be WGS leaving, Boardroom changes, lack of investment after the cup final, the final whistle after the Man Utd game etc.) For me it's absolutely clear - the appointment of Steve Wigley. Not that I'm heaping all the blame on him - in fact I don't hold anything against Steve at all, if anything he was just an innocent victim of circumstance. But when we appointed him, we still had ample time to turn things around, we had a run of 14 emminently winnable games (I think we one one of them), and we still had a half decent squad. If Lowe had of made a sensible appointment then, I am convinced we'd have a decent chance of being in the Premier League still. From the moment I heard that we'd appointed him (and I will always remember it as I was on a business trip in Germany and had to be convinced by a mate that it wasn't a wind up - given we'd been through this once with Stuart Gray). I sat back and though, "that's it, we're f*cked". And so it proved.

Simply put, we won't. Well, not while we have our major shareholders at loggerheads and with ego's which inhibit their ability to make decisions for the best of the club. I don't know about the make up of the Charlton shareholding, but I suspect they are able to get a broad consensus and do what is right for the club. I am not sure how actively Seymour Pearce are looking for investment for Saints, or even if they are. I do not believe it is high on the agenda for Lowe and Wilde (or rather Lowe, who's clearly the one still pulling the strings - Wilde will seemingly just do as he's told); to my knowledge they dynamic duo have not publicly commented on a proactive search for investment.

I'm not a gambling man, but I have a sneaking suspicion that Leicester will be back in the Premier League before us...

Agreed. We've had too many pathetic little small-time businessmen squabbling over who gets to 'sit in the big chair'. If only we could find someone with real business acumen, and frankly, real money (and lots of it!). The fans deserve better than the bunch of clowns we've been saddled with over the last 10 years.

1 point more than losing. Win v Barnsley and it won't be too bad a week. Lose, and it'll be fairly catastrophic...