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England will never win the world cup again


mightysaints
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After watching the better footballing team loose today to West Hoof I believe we will never see England win the world cup whilst teams like WH succeed in the Prem League. The England style mirrors WH. OK not so much hoof ball but hard working no flair still prevails against good footballing teams. Look at Swansea and the trouble they find themselves in.

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After watching the better footballing team loose today to West Hoof I believe we will never see England win the world cup whilst teams like WH succeed in the Prem League. The England style mirrors WH. OK not so much hoof ball but hard working no flair still prevails against good footballing teams. Look at Swansea and the trouble they find themselves in.
It is "lose" not "loose"! But anyway. if England were to grind out wins from a mediocre overall team of players in the way the West Ham have recently, why might go a lot further in a World Cup than you think.....although you may be right about actually winning it.
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It is "lose" not "loose"! But anyway. if England were to grind out wins from a mediocre overall team of players in the way the West Ham have recently, why might go a lot further in a World Cup than you think.....although you may be right about actually winning it.

 

Yeah, because hoofing it up front would work against the best players in the World in 30 degree heat.

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England need to commit to a system and play it through the age groups like us and then employ the manger who believes in that system.

 

It would stop the old "don't get enough time with the players" most international managers go on about as they will be only tweaking the players based on the opposition they would be playing for the game, formation is embedded.

 

Unfortunately there is a distinct lack of nuts in the FA and unless we have a shocker in Brazil we will be muddling through hoping for a golden generation again rather than a system that we can exploit.

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The main problem with the England team is the fact that not enough English players play regularly at the highest level in the Prem.

 

Look how well Sturridge has developed since his move to Liverpool after just sitting on his arse at Chelsea. Players sat on their arse today include Ashley Cole, Young, Oxlade Chamberlain, Milner, Lescott, Welbeck (not even on the bench so I assume is injured). The last Spurs game Townsend and Dawson sat and watched.

 

Unless we limit the amount of foreigners allowed we will continue to decline at international level.

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"grind out wins from a mediocre overall team of players in the way the West Ham have"

 

What point were you trying to make then?

 

The one where they are getting the best out of a group of largely mediocre players with a smattering of quality - just as you have just quoted. I made no reference to their style of play and how effective it might be in 30 degree (slight underestimate probably) heat. However, if you want to accept the slightly ludicrous premise in the OP that West Ham are the reason we will never win a World Cup then I would have to disagree. If England can win 4 on the spin by defending very well and scoring the odd goal on the break, they could do pretty well (regardless of the heat).

Edited by kpturner
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West Ham won because they convert the chances they make. We dont. Nothing to do with hoofball.

 

Personally I completely agree with this. We only have ourselves to blame for not winning this, and several other matches. Our chances to goals scored ratio must be pretty p1ss poor (he says expecting someone to prove him wrong almost instantly!)

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The one where they are getting the best out of a group of largely mediocre players with a smattering of quality - just as you have just quoted. I made no reference to their style of play and how effective it might be in 30 degree (slight underestimate probably) heat. However, if you want to accept the slightly ludicrous premise in the OP that West Ham are the reason we will never win a World Cup then I would have to disagree. If England can win 4 on the spin by defending very well and scoring the odd goal on the break, they could do pretty well (regardless of the heat).

 

I read "the way the West Ham have" as referring to their style of play. I accept their is a feint chance we could 'do a Greece' but history shows this is not very likely at a World Cup. I think we will go out at the group stage, it's the worst England squad I can remember.

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I read "the way the West Ham have" as referring to their style of play. I accept their is a feint chance we could 'do a Greece' but history shows this is not very likely at a World Cup. I think we will go out at the group stage, it's the worst England squad I can remember.

 

Well on that point I concur wholeheartedly. I hope I am pleasantly surprised, and I hope we might scrape some decent results, even if it is in a West Ham stylee. The truth of the matter is that England are nowhere near the level required to compete in a World Cup, and I don't think West Ham are the cause of that. Still, makes a change not to be going on a fanfare of unjustified optimistic expectation :)

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Well on that point I concur wholeheartedly. I hope I am pleasantly surprised, and I hope we might scrape some decent results, even if it is in a West Ham stylee. The truth of the matter is that England are nowhere near the level required to compete in a World Cup, and I don't think West Ham are the cause of that. Still, makes a change not to be going on a fanfare of unjustified optimistic expectation :)

 

Going in with low expectations might actually help us. Greece didn't win the Euros by going into it thinking they were better footballers than everyone else. They accepted their limitations and played to their strengths - we need to do the same. Accept the fact that we are sh!t and try and grind out enough draws to see us through as far as possible. We've always had a pretty decent defence, just keep it tight and try and hit teams on the break. And practice penalties.

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Going in with low expectations might actually help us. Greece didn't win the Euros by going into it thinking they were better footballers than everyone else. They accepted their limitations and played to their strengths - we need to do the same. Accept the fact that we are sh!t and try and grind out enough draws to see us through as far as possible. We've always had a pretty decent defence, just keep it tight and try and hit teams on the break. And practice penalties.

that is excatly what woy will do. Just look at the Euro's

he will then get, hounded to the point of near suicide by the English press

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Going in with low expectations might actually help us. Greece didn't win the Euros by going into it thinking they were better footballers than everyone else. They accepted their limitations and played to their strengths - we need to do the same. Accept the fact that we are sh!t and try and grind out enough draws to see us through as far as possible. We've always had a pretty decent defence, just keep it tight and try and hit teams on the break. And practice penalties.

 

A bit like the way West Ham have just dragged themselves out of the relegation zone ;)

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I do not think England will win any major competition in my life time. The reason for this, is because we are just not good enough and we are light years behind, most of Europe let alone the world!

we are now only really looking to players good with the ball at their feet.

before, it was pace first and skill being a bonus. Gazza had the industry with skill

 

if Le Tissier was playing like he did circa 1994, now. sweet jesus, he would have the team built around him

 

back then, it was your carlton palmers and dennis wise's over pure skill like Le Tiss

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After watching the better footballing team loose today to West Hoof I believe we will never see England win the world cup whilst teams like WH succeed in the Prem League. The England style mirrors WH. OK not so much hoof ball but hard working no flair still prevails against good footballing teams. Look at Swansea and the trouble they find themselves in.

 

Although I'm in the generation that was old enough to see and enjoy that victory in 1966, ......in some perverse way, I think it was a pity that we did;) .......because ever since generations of fans have come to think that we are some sort of world power in football and see that as a sort of substitute for us losing the Empire.

 

Of course I'd like to see England do well .......I still have my British passport.......but as long as OUR Premier League is dominated by foreign players, we'll have to wait a bit longer, (or at least until the rest of our Academy can make it past the U21s and qualify for England's first team).

Edited by david in sweden
wrong decade cited..
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Although I'm in the generation that was old enough to see and enjoy that victory in 1976, ......in some perverse way, I think it was a pity that we did;) .......because ever since generations of fans have come to think that we are some sort of world power in football and see that as a sort of substitute for us losing the Empire.

 

Of course I'd like to see England do well .......I still have my British passport.......but as long as OUR Premier League is dominated by foriegn players, we'll have to wait a bit longer, (or at least until the rest of our Academy can make it past the U21s and qualify for Englald first team).

 

1966 ?

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Liverpool, Everton, Swansea and Saints

Are considered to play nice football by most yes.

 

 

Liverpool have Johnson, Kelly, Flanagan, Henderson, Sterling, Gerard and Sturridge

Everton have Barry, Barkley, Osman, jagielka, and Baines

And we got Shaw, Clyne, Chambers, Cork, Lallana, Jrod, Lambert, Ward Prowse

 

All of those are comfortable on the ball and can press.

Basically what I'm saying is, it's the coaching. We need a Rodgers/Martinez/MoPo type to coach England?

Edited by Wrensup
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Liverpool, Everton, Swansea and Saints

Are considered to play nice football by most yes.

 

 

Liverpool have Johnson, Kelly, Flanagan, Henderson, Sterling, Gerard and Sturridge

Everton have Barry, Barkley, Osman, jagielka, and Baines

And we got Shaw, Clyne, Chambers, Cork, Lallana, Jrod, Lambert, Ward Prowse

 

All of those are comfortable on the ball and can press.

Basically what I'm saying is, it's the coaching. We need a Rodgers/Martinez/MoPo type to coach England?

 

the trouble is when you take away the non-England players from those set-ups they become mediocre. Take away Suarez from Liverpool and what have you got left, similarily Everton with Coleman and Lukaku. What's left are just nearly teams.

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