SaintDonkey

I'd be happier with someone other than Wotte with proven experience at this level. However he would have to have been a miracle worker. We have a demoralized team of has beens, never weres and also runs with no more than half a dozen players of Championship level. Add to that no money to buy and the handicap that any manager appointted by Lowe will never have the full support of the fans. Stick all that together and relegation looks certain whoever is in charge, and perhaps it's better to have a sacrifical lamb as manager, ready to be replaced at the end of the season when we're taken over so the new man is not a Lowe appointee? (okay that ls bit is wishful thinking)

Bugger me I hadn't heard that one. But playing devils advocate without Gray we wouldn't have had Strachan. I'd say Wigley was a worse mistake - since it was repeating the same mistake. The JP experiment was just that an experiment and so I don't rate it as as such a terrible mistake. Repeating the failed experiment with Wotte could turn out to be a worse mistake but I don't think he deserves to be condemned as a failure (yet!).

Saints is far more than Lowe, and while it riles having him in the boardroom it's the lads on the pitch I go to support. Having said that it looks like I could be out of a job soon so maybe I'll be joining a boycott whether I like it or not!

You're not a right back by any chance? We could do with one of those

Now would be a good time for Crouch to return. The painful cost cutting has been done by the bogey man Lowe, the transfer window has closed so he wouldn't be criticised for not buying players and the 'Lowe out' euphoria might just get a few more people through the turnstiles and a decent atmosphere at Saint Mary's so we could avoid relegation and administration. Of course Lowe would then have to come back to do the next round of cost cutting and not buying anyone in the summer. Kind of a job share, Lowe does the unpopular bits, Crouch does the populist stuff.

Legends can work at national level where they can pick and choose the best players who will all be playing for their country. They don't work at club level where the pool of players is much smaller and they are in the main just playing for the people who pay their wages rather than for their club. For a 'legend' to work at club level they need to be damned good coaches as well. I'm sure every poster on here would play out of their skin for Matty - problem is we'd be hard pressed between us to put together a team that would survive in the Wessex league.

In the present financial climate I fear that going into administration would be a disaster. Even if it is seen as inevitable it needs to be put off for as long as possible in the hope that the global economy starts to recover to the extent that people are willing to take on risky investments again - because let's face it investing in a football club is about the riskiest investmnet there is.

Thank you Tim that brought tears of joy

Can I say a big and genuine thank you to Micky and saint1977 for offering the first real intelligent debate on the issue I've seen on this site for a very long time. And also a thank you to Stanley for once more demonstrating that he has nothing intelligent to offer to the issue and should be disregarded as a troll.

Nobody likes Lowe, but a few aren't so blinkered as to see him as the root of all evil. Most - if not all barring the trolls - posters want Lowe gone if only to shut up some of the monomanicial posters on here (it won't of course - people were still blaming Lowe for everything at the end of last season after he'd been gone for 2 years). However we'd like to see what comes after as something that would secure Saints long term future rather than a blind rush into the arms of administration. To some posters on here holding the views stated above labels someone a 'Lowe luvvie'.

He played at left back at Marseille, Panathinaikos, and Hertha when he went on loan there last season. Oh and he's played there for the Czech Republic. I don't know the Slavia Prague players from 2002-2003 to confirm that he played left back there but it seems likely. He also played left wing at all those places (apart from the national squad as far as I can tell) but was primarily used as a left back. I happen to agree that leftback is not his best position, but that's not the point!

First off stop labeling everyone who doesn't share your myopic view of the situation as Luvvies. Second there is no dispute that Lowe accelerated the decline; however there is also no denying that crowds were declining in his absense, so for certain posters to continue on this monomanical 'Lowe is responsible for everything' rant seems illogical. We know Lowe is a large part of the problem. What's more interesting it discussing what the other components are. The problem is that certain posters refuse to look beyond Lowe when examining what's wrong with our club.

To be honest I think a loan spell in league 1 would do Lallana some good. He's lost his way a bit this season and while he undoubtedly has talent there have been too many times recently where he's been anonymous. We definietly need a right back, and another striker would give some competition for the place alongside Saga (who MUST play!).

If Lowe does rise from the ashes to remain in charge after administration that doesn't count as evidence that it was his plan all along. Still I hope he doesn't.

2005-2006 23,614 Lowe 2006-2007 23,556 No Lowe 2007-2008 21,253 No Lowe 2008-2009 16,662 Lowe Lowe is clearly a factor but it has to be pointed out that attendances were in decline anyway.

Maybe a couple of years ago it would have doen, but honestly have you looked at the world economy recently? Just a heads up - it's screwed. IMO now would be a very bad time to enter administration. A world wide recession is not a time that people take risks with investments. That just leaves fans as potential investors with money they can afford to lose. Except of course they've all had losses with everything tanking and probably don't have that much they can afford to lose either. So what happens? SFC goes into administration? 10 point deduction. Can't find a buyer in time to emerge from administration in time for the league deadline? Right have another 15 point penalty and the forced sale of playing assets. Why hello league 2! And what's that - 7 thousand fans in a 30,000 seater stadium. I smell a winding up order... Hopefully it won't come to that but please don't wish administration on us until the economy picks up a bit!

Just a thought - isn't the club more attractive to investors with more season ticket holders? So by not renewing people might just be making it more likely that Lowe will stay? I'm playing devil's advocate here but while I can understand not wanting to renew because the standard of football is sh!te, as a "Lowe Out" strategy any form of boycott is surely ultimately self defeating?

Ted was before my time so it has to be Lawrie.

Man U play with width but they rarely play 4-4-2. Even yesterday with Berbatov and Tevez up front it was more of a 4-1-4-1 without the ball and 4-2-4 with it. I agree with the original post though we do need to be playing more with width. And I think even without Dyer we've got the players to do it. James has shown he's more than capable of playing that right wing role (better than he's shown at right back) and Holmes or dare I say it Smith (on his correct side) can do the left wing (Skacel drifts inside to much).

The only way the fans can be said to be 'at fault' is declining attendences that have pushed us deeper into the financial mire. You can't really blame them for that this season. Even the most ardent fan likes to see a winning side, and we've not had that this season. The difference should have come after the play off season, we had been playing good football, winning games and had a come within a hairs breadth or promotion. 32008 saw us secure a play off place against Souuthend. The first game next season we had a respectable 25054 for the humiliation against Palace. We'd lose 5000 of them by the next home game (a victory against Stoke) which pretty much set our average for the rest of the season. I don't blame the fans - but I do wonder whether things would have been different if those 12 thousand extra fans who watch us against Southend (or even the 5 thousand who came to watch us against Palace) had kept coming to games. Leaving aside any possible effect that playing in front of a full stadium might have had on the players we would be in a much sounder financial position and Lowe would not have been able to return. And without Lowe everything would be just a little bit better.

I hope that some people on here, and everyone at at St Mary's, takes this to heart.

*sigh* do try to keep up [a] it wasn't my logic it was means of determining the relegation places as suggested by Victor. I was merely pointing out that as a scheme for predicting relegation from the Championship it's not going to be far out. As you well know income also comes into it. Debt as a percentage of turnover would be a better measure but frankly I couldn't be arsed to do any more than the minimal research of just looking at the previous thread we had on here. Now run along dear and play in the traffic with the other children.

I was being mischieveous - I don't mean he was actually hounded from the club, but certain people on this board who shall remain named after mountain ranges were all for hounding him out

I'd sell a kidney if it would save Southampton FC - sadly I think a kidney in prime condition only goes for about $22,000 http://www.zimbio.com/Singapore+Travel+and+Expats/articles/55/Need+Cash+Fast+Not+Sell+Kidney+Singapore+Black which isn't nearly enough. Unless of course 10,000 other fans would do it as well. Any volunteers? Failing that I'd happily stomp up 200 quid for life membership.

Hmmm a relatively successful manager hounded out by fans who think they should be doing better? Leading to a collapse from mid table to a relegation scrap? Sound familar? Nice to know the fans are as incapable of learning from mistakes as the board are