sadoldgit

There was an interesting Horizon last night on what makes people evil. Nature over nurture has been debated over the years but according to this there is a genetic connection. But if you have the "warrior gene" your upbringing will determine if you become full on psychopath of not. They found that many people with the dodgy gene but with decent nurturing often went on to become senior managers in corporations (The Don?). They still had the psychopathic tendencies but were able to control the more extreme behaviour that led to many with poor upbringings ending up behind bars. One of the main features of psychopaths is their lack of empathy. They are also very charming and work their way to the top through charisma rather than hard work (these are the ones with decent upbringings). I don't know about you but I have worked with and under a number of managers like this. Fascinating programme, watch it on catch up if you can.

I think it is a bit unfair. Some artists work better in some mediums than others. Not sure if Warhol would have been any good in oil. Instead of kicking people off perhaps they should judge them all on all of the standards to see who is best across the board.

So is that why so many Yanks are obese? It is to pull hot women?

tourettes

https://8tracks.imgix.net/i/000/697/204/Nun_too_soon_by_Lochai-3655.jpg?rect=19,143,531,531&q=65&sharp=15&vib=10&fm=jpg&fit=max Ok, Ive cracked

never a nun when you need one...

They have music?

perhaps we could have nuns and monks together?

We have been playing well and just need to find our scoring touch. All we can do is go for every game and hope for the best. I feel gutted for Pelle. He clearly can play but seems shot at the moment. If RK can get him and Tadic firing again there is no reason why we cant finish well.

Long overdue.

Ok I am with you on extreme porn. I would also agree that the fact that basic porn is so accessible nowdays isn't great. If you were to use topless models in your argument (as in sending a message to men that any fit woman is up for it) instead of Take Me Out I would agree. I think that Page 3 and the like has done more damage to feminism than basic porn and Take Me Out. I don't know if sexism is on the increase. Talking from my own experience I don't hear much of it. Even in the pub any "sexist" banter is ironic nowadays and we all seem to know where to draw the line. Whether it is an the increase or whether more women are prepared to speak out against it and not put up with it I don't know. Certainly more women are prepared to come forward and report sexual harassment and assaults to the police and that can only be a good thing. The main thing is that we agree that women and other groups of people should be respected and if there are any GYTOFTL chants then it would be good if the rest of the crowd booed those chanting. We all like to have a bit of fun and any red blooded bloke likes to look at fit women and likes to flirt. There is a boundary though and that needs to be respected.

I think I am done with this discussion too. How you can say a crass show like Take Me Out causes more damage than GYTOFTL and obscene chanting (remember when Victoria Beckham got a volley about her taking it up the b*m? Oh how we all laughed - I bet the Beckhams still tell that tale over the dinner table and chuckle) is beyond me.

Jeff, I don't know you and I don't know Lou but find it a little odd that a clique of you should get together and decide that someone who comes on and discusses the problems about sexism is a troll and should be ignored. I am a bloke but I have to say I find your defence of Ched Evans and GYTOFTL chants as light hearted banter by some numbskulls misses the point by a country mile.

Really Jeff, there is nothing new here. Men have been disrespecting women for thousands of years. Back in the biblical days we couldn't handle menstruation (some still cant). Women are unclea. Women "force" us to do things to them that make us feel guilty because we cant control ourselves. It goes on and on. Porn has been available for pretty much as long as Mankind could draw and make images. I agree that it is more widely available than ever, If your argument rang true surely sexism would be on the rise too? It seems to be in decline to me. At least more and more people now see that it is not acceptable in this day and age. It is about what is appropriate. Many, many men look at pornography but do not rape women, do not chant GYTOFTL and treat women with respect. I think in most families nowdays, both the men and the women go out to work. many men are managed by women. We know that mother-in-law jokes died out in the 70s and we know why. There has never been more explicit sex on TV as there is now yet the rape figures have not gone through the roof. in 2015 no man in a western society can say that he has not been exposed to the arguments about equality and does not know why it is not acceptable to treat another human being as an object for gratification. Singing GYTOFTL is not acceptable in todays society. Why? Because we have had this debate a million times (along with other discriminatory stuff) and society agrees that it is not right. Much in the way that you could air Love They Neighbour or Alf Garnett nowadays. The debate has moved on although some have missed the point I grant you. The kind of porn you describe is something else entirely. There are laws about stuff that goes way beyond what most reasonable people would find acceptable and people are prosecuted regularly for producing images that transcend what society currently sees as acceptable. I am not sure if the average bloke singing GYTOFTL would look at that stuff, but I could be wrong.

How do you define porn?

The thing is that is has been ingrained over the centuries. Internet porn and Take Me Out are very recent affairs. Porn has been around forever too but it is different to not allowing women the vote and treating women like second class citizens. Many women enjoy porn too, Sex is natural and it is natural for both men and women to explore their sexual fantasies. This usually involves consenting adults and privacy. This is very different to a bunch of blokes embarrassing a woman going on with her professional job but chanting for her to expose her breasts. When the worst name you can call someone is the same word used for female genitalia, what does that tell you about the division of the sexes?

cunning

Taken three quarters of the season though.

Jeff, if you really cant see the difference between porn and blokes singing GYTOFTL at some poor woman just doing her job this thread will end up longer than the Portsmouth take over thread.

Jeff, you do know that the internet has only been around a few decades and sexism for hundreds, if not thousands of years, right?

It gets better. Mentally ill and wanted on an arrest warrant! Even more reason to shoot him. I was taking the p*ss when I talked about firing blanks. Are you saying that a group of officers cannot deal with a bloke on the ground (ok he was trying to get a gun but was unarmed) without actually shooting him 5 times? The training course at the academy must be very short. If anyone gives you grief, shoot them. Sorted.

Glad we have sorted that out then Jeff. I can watch The Big Painting Challenge safe in the knowledge we have cracked it!

Yep you said that before, but why do you think that is? Why do some people think it is acceptable there but not elsewhere? These same blokes have read the Sun for years and watched Take Me Out yet they know that in certain circumstances they need to moderate their instinct to make offensive chants. That says to me they know it isn't actually acceptable yet put them in a football ground and it becomes perfectly acceptable?

Okay I am sure we get it. Although I still don't think the show is particularly a good example can you explain to us why there seems to be more racism, sexism and general discriminatory behaviour amongst blokes who go to football. If we all subjected to this kind of stimulus why do so many men not behave this way? What makes a bloke at a football match think it is ok to sing get em out for the lads at a football match but the same bloke at a cricket match or tennis match in the same circumstances wouldn't dream of doing it?

To be fair I don't think we are talking about a level playing with Bearsy