Snowballs2 Posted 29 October, 2008 Share Posted 29 October, 2008 Come on Leon, you are the only true Saints supporter. If you want to retain some credability you must speak up now. Get with Wilde and lets have Lowe out Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roman Posted 29 October, 2008 Share Posted 29 October, 2008 I get the impression from hints dropped by Morph that Leon and others are waiting to see how the results and attendances play out in the next few weeks - because neither trend adds up to a sustainable club, especially in the present climate. The alternative is to re-start some trench warfare among the three major shareholders, and I just don't see him wanting to do that. Just a guess. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snowballs2 Posted 29 October, 2008 Author Share Posted 29 October, 2008 I get the impression from hints dropped by Morph that Leon and others are waiting to see how the results and attendances play out in the next few weeks - because neither trend adds up to a sustainable club, especially in the present climate. The alternative is to re-start some trench warfare among the three major shareholders, and I just don't see him wanting to do that. Just a guess. If I was a significant shareholder I could not just stand and watch the mess that is developing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Delmary Posted 29 October, 2008 Share Posted 29 October, 2008 Realistically what can he do? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
um pahars Posted 29 October, 2008 Share Posted 29 October, 2008 I don't think that after moaning about Lowe and Wilde's distractive influence during last seasons relegation battle he can do anything (at least in public anyway) otherwise he would just be labelled a hypocrite (and probably quite rightly so). As with the majority of fans, I certainly don't think he's very happy, but I don't think there is much he can do. As long as Lowe's cabal remain loyal to their svengali, Wilde still backs this "revolutionary coaching set up" and the Reading fan doesn't pull the rug, then the status quo will continue, with Crouch irrelevant. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aintforever Posted 29 October, 2008 Share Posted 29 October, 2008 I would guess that IF Crouch has anyone interested in taking over then they will wait until it becomes screamingly obvious to Wilde and Lowe that their is no future in what they are planning and their shares are worth next to nothing. I expect that even now, staring League 1 and administration in the face, Lowe still has some bizarre reason to think his shares are worth something. No one - bar a billionare in need of a play thing, will want to buy the club at the price Lowe will want to sell at. I've said all along that relegation and admin is inevitable unless a white night comes along. Lowe and Wilde will never sell for a nominal fee until it is too late and noone will want to buy the club for anything more than a nominal amount. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trousers Posted 29 October, 2008 Share Posted 29 October, 2008 When's the AGM? Would that be a 'window of opportunity' for Crouch & Co? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dubai_phil Posted 29 October, 2008 Share Posted 29 October, 2008 I would guess that IF Crouch has anyone interested in taking over then they will wait until it becomes screamingly obvious to Wilde and Lowe that their is no future in what they are planning and their shares are worth next to nothing. I expect that even now, staring League 1 and administration in the face, Lowe still has some bizarre reason to think his shares are worth something. No one - bar a billionare in need of a play thing, will want to buy the club at the price Lowe will want to sell at. I've said all along that relegation and admin is inevitable unless a white night comes along. Lowe and Wilde will never sell for a nominal fee until it is too late and noone will want to buy the club for anything more than a nominal amount. And while the global financial system is in a melt down, the ONLY thing billionaires want right now is to stop losing their asset values and hoard cash.... This CAN still happen, but we HAVE to survive a few months, because right now, we are little more than a big debt for an investor to take onboard. We won't get promoted this season, so we will need 4-6 million to stabilise the club and probably the same next year. Now IF there are fears about jobs and the cost of going to games on here now, until investors can see what is likely to happen to UK PLC, the income of the club could drop even more. Nobody is going to afford to rebuild the club into what the fans "believe" they deserve in terms of quality and consistency in January, that would take millions more, so an investor sees, falling attendaces across the country, cuts in advertising and sponsorship & corporate income, no value in any "vague" property developments and on top of that, much of their own wealth is falling in value almost daily. A wise investor with cash to burn could make 10% a week playing Forex or the markets, or could lose 20%. Why add to that risk NOW with a football club. If the club survives to January the buy price won't be much different, the risks will be better known. If it doesn't survive then it will be cheaper but will be stripped of assets so we'll end up with a two-bit photocopier salesman able to buy us... The argument against this is the mantra that Lowe won't sell. Maybe historically that was the case, but right at this moment, we have no proof in the public domain that this is still the case. Maybe he would, but to my knowledge from the media and ITK's nobody has actually asked for quite some time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
INFLUENCED.COM Posted 29 October, 2008 Share Posted 29 October, 2008 When's the AGM? Would that be a 'window of opportunity' for Crouch & Co? To do what though ? if he's not got large investment behind him then whats going to change, do you think Barclays will say welcome back Leon, we will fund the termination of contracts the return of Rasiak, John, the purchase of a right and centre back ? will we see a return of c.6k fans, is that really the extent of the stayaways due to Lowe ?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capel Saint Posted 29 October, 2008 Share Posted 29 October, 2008 I think if Administartion and League 1 football was an almost certainty Lowe would sell his shares, however, no investor will actually buy them. The main reason being they will not need to buy any shares when the plc goes into administration. The Administrators will sell the club as a going concern and the new owner gets a football club a lot cheaper. What happens then is anyones guess but any shareholder will lose their 'investment' as the shares are dissolved along with the plc. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snowballs2 Posted 29 October, 2008 Author Share Posted 29 October, 2008 To do what though ? if he's not got large investment behind him then whats going to change, do you think Barclays will say welcome back Leon, we will fund the termination of contracts the return of Rasiak, John, the purchase of a right and centre back ? will we see a return of c.6k fans, is that really the extent of the stayaways due to Lowe ?? The 6000 stay away fans are not totally the result of the return of Lowe, mainly due to poor results. Lowe has had some affect on the attendances , but a return to winning games will see an up turn in the gates. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
INFLUENCED.COM Posted 29 October, 2008 Share Posted 29 October, 2008 The 6000 stay away fans are not totally the result of the return of Lowe, mainly due to poor results. Lowe has had some affect on the attendances , but a return to winning games will see an up turn in the gates. And you think Leon's return will affect results on the field ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alpine_saint Posted 29 October, 2008 Share Posted 29 October, 2008 Dont see why Crouchie should do a damn thing after the way he has been treated. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
70's Mike Posted 29 October, 2008 Share Posted 29 October, 2008 To do what though ? if he's not got large investment behind him then whats going to change, do you think Barclays will say welcome back Leon, we will fund the termination of contracts the return of Rasiak, John, the purchase of a right and centre back ? will we see a return of c.6k fans, is that really the extent of the stayaways due to Lowe ?? He could stand up at the AGM and say i will put a million pounds in as a long term loan , if the other shareholders owing over 5% will do the same Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alpine_saint Posted 29 October, 2008 Share Posted 29 October, 2008 He could stand up at the AGM and say i will put a million pounds in as a long term loan ' date=' if the other shareholders owing over 5% will do the same[/quote'] He did something similar to Wilde once, and Wilde choked. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
solentstars Posted 29 October, 2008 Share Posted 29 October, 2008 The 6000 stay away fans are not totally the result of the return of Lowe, mainly due to poor results. Lowe has had some affect on the attendances , but a return to winning games will see an up turn in the gates.even if we were winning i think their is lack of interest in football at the moment because people are going threw hard times,the premiership is becoming a turn off because of lack of competition and silly ticket prices. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr X Posted 29 October, 2008 Share Posted 29 October, 2008 Dont see why Crouchie should do a damn thing after the way he has been treated. I'm not saying crouch didn't make his mistakes yes he probably was guilty of overspending, but having contacts that work for him, I can honestly say the man is 100% saints through and through he is a real fan, he firmly believed things were going to work out with nigel, we had someone that the players were starting to show real respect for and he seemed to be able to get the best out of mediocre players, survival on the last day severely against the odds should have been our springboard to get on the right track this season and I firmly believe we would have done had he been given the chance. Personally I feel not sticking with pearson is as big a mistake as appointing wigley, and as most people point out this latest fook up will have the biggest consequences by far :smt102 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Long Shot Posted 29 October, 2008 Share Posted 29 October, 2008 Snowballs, I can reliably inform you that LC is very active in trying to solve the looming crisis but, like someone said, doing that without rocking the boat is a tricky juggling act. I do think he feels, however, that it would be neccesary for Lowe and Wilde (assuming they have no intention of putting their own hands in their pockets) to "bow out" before other's purse strings are loosened. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaintRichmond Posted 29 October, 2008 Share Posted 29 October, 2008 I think if Administartion and League 1 football was an almost certainty Lowe would sell his shares, however, no investor will actually buy them. The main reason being they will not need to buy any shares when the plc goes into administration. The Administrators will sell the club as a going concern and the new owner gets a football club a lot cheaper. What happens then is anyones guess but any shareholder will lose their 'investment' as the shares are dissolved along with the plc. If League 1 is a certainty, then, as I have said before, Administration IS the way forward It is the way forward because, although we will be short of CCC Quality players, ( as we are now ) ..... with poor results ( as we are getting now ) ... THE CLUB can start again ( after Admin) , with a clean slate, and also be rid forever of the Leeches that have for far too long, been sucking the lifeblood out of SAINTS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sun of spain Posted 29 October, 2008 Share Posted 29 October, 2008 Unfortunately Leon can only sit and watch in despair,there's very little he can do at the moment even if he wanted to.No one is going to ride in on a white charger and save our club,the financial meltdown has seen to that.Rupert knows that only too well,so we are stuck with Lowe and Wilde for the foreseeable future. As for Leon joining forces with Wilde again,that surely a non-starter after what has gone before ? Leon can really only sit and wait along with the rest of us Saint's supporters, and see where the remainder of this season takes us ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SaintRichmond Posted 29 October, 2008 Share Posted 29 October, 2008 Unfortunately Leon can only sit and watch in despair,there's very little he can do at the moment even if he wanted to.No one is going to ride in on a white charger and save our club,the financial meltdown has seen to that.Rupert knows that only too well,so we are stuck with Lowe and Wilde for the foreseeable future. As for Leon joining forces with Wilde again,that surely a non-starter after what has gone before ? Leon can really only sit and wait along with the rest of us Saint's supporters, and see where the remainder of this season takes us ? I really am surprised in a way, that Wilde is not visibly "Twitchy" about his Devil's Alliance with The Prince of Darkness Very very unlike Putty man Wilde ...... either that, or he has some very good reinforced Y Fronts .......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wade Garrett Posted 29 October, 2008 Share Posted 29 October, 2008 Snowballs, I can reliably inform you that LC is very active in trying to solve the looming crisis but, like someone said, doing that without rocking the boat is a tricky juggling act. I do think he feels, however, that it would be neccesary for Lowe and Wilde (assuming they have no intention of putting their own hands in their pockets) to "bow out" before other's purse strings are loosened. Why not go hostile? I am sure Wilde would cave in. It shouldn't be too hard. I bet even the weasel Askham is getting twitchy now. I think our situation gets worse with every passing day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alpine_saint Posted 29 October, 2008 Share Posted 29 October, 2008 I do hope, however, that Crouchie is making small insignificant steps behind the scenes, like a game of chess, with the ultimate goal the downfall and removal of Lowe and the Quisling. Because I can imagine Lowe was doing the very same thing to him and Wilde when they were in charge. People in glass houses shouldnt throw stones.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snowballs2 Posted 29 October, 2008 Author Share Posted 29 October, 2008 Snowballs, I can reliably inform you that LC is very active in trying to solve the looming crisis but, like someone said, doing that without rocking the boat is a tricky juggling act. I do think he feels, however, that it would be neccesary for Lowe and Wilde (assuming they have no intention of putting their own hands in their pockets) to "bow out" before other's purse strings are loosened. Just cannot see Lowe and Wilde leaving, either their shares or their positions at SMS. To do that Rupert would have to admit that he has failed...he does not have the ability to admit this. He thinks that everything that he has ever done was right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VectisSaint Posted 29 October, 2008 Share Posted 29 October, 2008 There is little Leon can do at the moment, except in the background try to put a deal together. Although he is the 2nd biggest shareholder, and has some allies that give him a significant power base, it is not enough to oust Wilde, let alone Wilde and Lowe. The only way to get Lowe out at present is for the Lap Dog to about turn again, even he must be finding it difficult to continue sucking up to Lowe. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alpine_saint Posted 29 October, 2008 Share Posted 29 October, 2008 There is little Leon can do at the moment, except in the background try to put a deal together. Although he is the 2nd biggest shareholder, and has some allies that give him a significant power base, it is not enough to oust Wilde, let alone Wilde and Lowe. The only way to get Lowe out at present is for the Lap Dog to about turn again, even he must be finding it difficult to continue sucking up to Lowe. Yep, I wrote the other day that with the Quisling's track record, this is the most likely scenario for removing Lowe again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
St Marco Posted 29 October, 2008 Share Posted 29 October, 2008 Crouch is the south's second biggest earner this year, he has more money then Wilde and Lowe combined. At this time there is not much he can do because as Um Pahars said he would be seen as a hypocrite if he came out and slagged off Wilde and Lowe like they did last year. The facts are the club is in melt down in all areas. I think he will probably join with a consortium and oust Wilde. Crouch has no bad feelings towards Lowe, they are both buisness men. But Wilde stabbed the shareholders in the back. He is the only reason Lowe could return. He made that choice. So it would not surprise me at all to see Lowe sell his shares to this consortium and Crouch proxy his and other shareholders do the same i.e Corbetts and remove Wilde. Then the consortium will have control and hopefully the funds. Then we can get on with the football which it should be about. Now i hope that happens. The longer we stay as we are the closer we come to admin meaning the closer Lowe comes to losing his shares. I can't see him risking everything he has on Jan and the direction he has taken this year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SuperMikey Posted 29 October, 2008 Share Posted 29 October, 2008 Musical chairs in the boardroom isn't going to help the club in the slightest. We've got RL and MW, people should just accept that. If Crouch is a real fan he'll give us a nice big cash injection in January which will allow us to keep some players who might be sold otherwise. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snowballs2 Posted 29 October, 2008 Author Share Posted 29 October, 2008 Crouch is the south's second biggest earner this year, he has more money then Wilde and Lowe combined. At this time there is not much he can do because as Um Pahars said he would be seen as a hypocrite if he came out and slagged off Wilde and Lowe like they did last year. The facts are the club is in melt down in all areas. I think he will probably join with a consortium and oust Wilde. Crouch has no bad feelings towards Lowe, they are both buisness men. But Wilde stabbed the shareholders in the back. He is the only reason Lowe could return. He made that choice. So it would not surprise me at all to see Lowe sell his shares to this consortium and Crouch proxy his and other shareholders do the same i.e Corbetts and remove Wilde. Then the consortium will have control and hopefully the funds. Then we can get on with the football which it should be about. Now i hope that happens. The longer we stay as we are the closer we come to admin meaning the closer Lowe comes to losing his shares. I can't see him risking everything he has on Jan and the direction he has taken this year. I think I would support that Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snowballs2 Posted 29 October, 2008 Author Share Posted 29 October, 2008 Musical chairs in the boardroom isn't going to help the club in the slightest. We've got RL and MW, people should just accept that. If Crouch is a real fan he'll give us a nice big cash injection in January which will allow us to keep some players who might be sold otherwise. No, no, no,no Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Topcat Posted 29 October, 2008 Share Posted 29 October, 2008 (edited) We have a lot to thank Leon Crouch for. He has (like Wilde) put his own money at risk by purchasing shares in Saints. He was maybe too loyal to Burley (Lowe's appointment) and was too decent in being prepared to back the inhouse Dodd and Gorman. Pearson was a brilliant appointment. I hope that he is putting together a rescue consortium should we be relegated. At that stage the shares (including his own) will be worthless and the bank will be looking to see if anyone is willing to take on the debts in return for ownership of the Club that I would call a "Saints 2009". He will need 1. An able CEO. 2. A new deal with Saints Trust mk2 3. A solid team Manager 4. A credible group of former Saints players. Channon etc. I suggest he looks at some kind of long term purchase of STs over a 5 year period which also carry a value in shares in a "Saints 2009". We need a Club part owned by supporters committed to STs. Edited 29 October, 2008 by Topcat Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Capel Saint Posted 29 October, 2008 Share Posted 29 October, 2008 I suggest he looks at some kind of long term purchase of STs over a 5 year period which also carry a value in shares in a "Saints 2009". We need a Club part owned by supporters committed to STs. We need a club not owned and run by a bl***y plc! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alpine_saint Posted 29 October, 2008 Share Posted 29 October, 2008 Musical chairs in the boardroom isn't going to help the club in the slightest. We've got RL and MW, people should just accept that. If Crouch is a real fan he'll give us a nice big cash injection in January which will allow us to keep some players who might be sold otherwise. heheheheh. You reckon Crouch is going to hand money over to Lowe ????:rolleyes::rolleyes: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
up and away Posted 29 October, 2008 Share Posted 29 October, 2008 I get the impression from hints dropped by Morph that Leon and others are waiting to see how the results and attendances play out in the next few weeks - because neither trend adds up to a sustainable club, especially in the present climate. The alternative is to re-start some trench warfare among the three major shareholders, and I just don't see him wanting to do that. Just a guess. For once Crouch is actualy doing the wisest thing, irespective of his personal views at this time. If he did start the mud slinging, he would be buried for a month of Sundays, so what we have is this forced truce. If he's smart he will keep his head down and mouth shut and sneak in to collect the bits. With our current financial predicament he would not be able to do anything without administration cancelling out those contracts and losses that are pulling us down at the present. Unless of course that promised investment by Fulthorpe miraculously appears out of thin air. Crouch knew all these hard decisions had to be made (players, sections of the ground, job losses), but spectacularly backed away from them because he knew how unpopular they would be. Just look back at the denial of the excs statement that players would have to be moved on, or the implied denial over the early settlement of the Walcott deal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mole Posted 29 October, 2008 Share Posted 29 October, 2008 I don't think we've heard the last of Leon Crouch, but i cannot see him wanting to be in the same room as Wilde, let alone allied to him again. My opinion is that Leon will now play a waiting game and once the club goes into administration he will make his move. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sun of spain Posted 29 October, 2008 Share Posted 29 October, 2008 Musical chairs in the boardroom isn't going to help the club in the slightest. We've got RL and MW, people should just accept that. If Crouch is a real fan he'll give us a nice big cash injection in January which will allow us to keep some players who might be sold otherwise. And if Lowe and Wilde were true fans,they'd have put some of their money into the club long before now ! Leon will sit tight and watch how things develop I'm sure,and not prop up the Lowe / Wilde failed regime with his hard earned cash. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustMike Posted 29 October, 2008 Share Posted 29 October, 2008 If League 1 is a certainty, then, as I have said before, Administration IS the way forward It is the way forward because, although we will be short of CCC Quality players, ( as we are now ) ..... with poor results ( as we are getting now ) ... THE CLUB can start again ( after Admin) , with a clean slate, and also be rid forever of the Leeches that have for far too long, been sucking the lifeblood out of SAINTS completely agree Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mole Posted 29 October, 2008 Share Posted 29 October, 2008 And if Lowe and Wilde were true fans,they'd have put some of their money into the club long before now ! Leon will sit tight and watch how things develop I'm sure,and not prop up the Lowe / Wilde failed regime with his hard earned cash. Lowe would never put money into SFC, his only desire is take money out. As for Wilde i doubt he's as flush as he once was and is therefore unable to put money in even if he wanted to. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Long Shot Posted 29 October, 2008 Share Posted 29 October, 2008 Lowe would never put money into SFC, his only desire is take money out. As for Wilde i doubt he's as flush as he once was and is therefore unable to put money in even if he wanted to. I hear Wilde is twitching like hell. The publishing of Merlion's accounts are long overdue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pheonix Posted 29 October, 2008 Share Posted 29 October, 2008 I hear Wilde is twitching like hell. The publishing of Merlion's accounts are long overdue. I have heard the same! How can you find out about the accounts? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trousers Posted 29 October, 2008 Share Posted 29 October, 2008 I have heard the same! How can you find out about the accounts? http://wck2.companieshouse.gov.uk/175065c334f838b77c8a235d1bb32279/compdetails[url=http://wck2.companieshouse.gov.uk/175065c334f838b77c8a235d1bb32279/compdetails][/url] http://wck2.companieshouse.gov.uk/175065c334f838b77c8a235d1bb32279/compdetails Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pheonix Posted 29 October, 2008 Share Posted 29 October, 2008 http://wck2.companieshouse.gov.uk/175065c334f838b77c8a235d1bb32279/compdetails[url=http://wck2.companieshouse.gov.uk/175065c334f838b77c8a235d1bb32279/compdetails][/url] http://wck2.companieshouse.gov.uk/175065c334f838b77c8a235d1bb32279/compdetails Thankyou, well that say's it all!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mole Posted 30 October, 2008 Share Posted 30 October, 2008 Thankyou, well that say's it all!! No it doesn't. It's common for the Companies House page to show accounts being overdue when they aren't. I would certainly be cautious of trusting the info. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pheonix Posted 30 October, 2008 Share Posted 30 October, 2008 No it doesn't. It's common for the Companies House page to show accounts being overdue when they aren't. I would certainly be cautious of trusting the info. ok thanks, now i am confused Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mole Posted 30 October, 2008 Share Posted 30 October, 2008 ok thanks, now i am confused Don't get me wrong i'm no Wilde fan, but fairs fair and it'd be wrong not to point this out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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