moonraker Posted 30 November, 2011 Share Posted 30 November, 2011 Please respect this. This thread is about the views of private sector workers. Great that’s me allowed to contribute to Dunes private little rant. As a private sector higher rate tax payer I fully support the Public Sector workers strike today and what’s more have been very pleased with service I get from my school, hospitals etc. Unlike the so called entrepreneurial builder (he actually had one of those awful Capitalism Works Stickers in his van) I once employed who failed to complete the contracted work then did a runner leaving me with a bill twice the size of his original quote. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pap Posted 30 November, 2011 Share Posted 30 November, 2011 What happened to Dune to invoke that much bitterness? Every thread, every post. Can't be healthy. I hope it's mostly put on, sad to see that happen to anyone really. There's a lot of bitterness on here. Misdirected in my opinion. Still, abandoning sense and perspective seems to be a hallmark of those on the right. I'd suggest that the vitriol would be better directed at the people who put us in the situation where we (supposedly) cannot afford the public sector. Not the people who are striking today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wade Garrett Posted 30 November, 2011 Share Posted 30 November, 2011 We might pay their wages, but they earn what they get paid the same as everyone else. Good luck to the striking workers. I have every sympathy when they only agreed changes to their pension arrangements in 2008. It seems the Government are happy to fund bankers and their lavish lifestyles without question, but take back from 'easy targets'. The firm I work for recently changed our pension arrangements, with our agreement. I would feel angry if they came back in a couple of years and said 'f*ck you, pay even more, retire even later, on less money'. Typical Tory attitude. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickG Posted 30 November, 2011 Share Posted 30 November, 2011 Ultimately, everyone acts in self-interest these days, rightly or wrongly. As a result, as this strike doesn't directly affect me, I'm not really that bothered by it all, to be honest. If people have a genuine reason to go on strike - and I don't really know enough about the situation here to decide one way or the other - that's fine, but every single one of them should be manning the picket line for the duration of time they were due to work that day. If there's one thing that only adds fuel to the "lazy, workshy public sector workers" stereotype, it's people "on strike" who use the day to have a lie-in, go and do a bit of shopping, go to the gym when it's quiet, etc, and then the same people wonder why private sector workers get arsey when another day of strike action is announced. codes of practice for strike (both sides) says should be no more than 6 picketing at any one site Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wade Garrett Posted 30 November, 2011 Share Posted 30 November, 2011 codes of practice for strike (both sides) says should be no more than 6 picketing at any one site And flying pickets are now illegal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
OVER THE HILL Posted 30 November, 2011 Share Posted 30 November, 2011 We might pay their wages, but they earn what they get paid the same as everyone else. Good luck to the striking workers. I have every sympathy when they only agreed changes to their pension arrangements in 2008. It seems the Government are happy to fund bankers and their lavish lifestyles without question, but take back from 'easy targets'. The firm I work for recently changed our pension arrangements, with our agreement. I would feel angry if they came back in a couple of years and said 'f*ck you, pay even more, retire even later, on less money'. Typical Tory attitude. Very good post, I agree 100% with this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
solentstars Posted 30 November, 2011 Share Posted 30 November, 2011 Can anyone with a therapist or on medication please not post on this thread either. Thanks.that rules you out for posting on this thread then and your late picking up your job seekers today. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pap Posted 30 November, 2011 Share Posted 30 November, 2011 We might pay their wages, but they earn what they get paid the same as everyone else. Good luck to the striking workers. I have every sympathy when they only agreed changes to their pension arrangements in 2008. It seems the Government are happy to fund bankers and their lavish lifestyles without question, but take back from 'easy targets'. The firm I work for recently changed our pension arrangements, with our agreement. I would feel angry if they came back in a couple of years and said 'f*ck you, pay even more, retire even later, on less money'. Typical Tory attitude. I suspect a big difference is that :- a) your bosses have probably been in their jobs for more than 2 years b) they know what they're doing c) they know the value of having a happy workforce Every policy the Crapalition has implemented or tried to implement has been an utter shambles. They haven't got control over the economy and their policies are based on naive fantasy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Viking Warrior Posted 30 November, 2011 Share Posted 30 November, 2011 Wade Garrett that would be the reason the flying pickets longer produce records NickG your right about the number of Pickets. seems like the unions have forgotten about that. Also they are supposed to picket their own place of work . 17. The expression "at or near his own place of work" is not further defined in statute law. The provisions mean that, except for those covered by paragraphs 22 and 23 below, lawful picketing must be limited to attendance at, or near, an entrance to or exit from the factory, site or office at which the picket works. Picketing should be confined to a location, or locations, as near as practicable to the place of work. 18. The law does not enable a picket to attend lawfully at an entrance to, or exit from, any place of work other than his own. This applies even, for example, if those working at the other place of work are employed by the same. However some are ignoring the law and by doing so are carrying out secondary picketing Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saintandy666 Posted 30 November, 2011 Share Posted 30 November, 2011 Let's abolish the public sector and see how the private sector do(no education for a start... expand it from there). Anyways, it can't be that inefficient, as Osborne and co are acting like today's strike is an economic catastrophe so the public sector must contribute loads to the economy. How come it is alright to call a day off for a royal wedding, but the second 2 million people(substantially less than got the day off for royal wedding) use their democratic right to strike, they are ruining the economy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pap Posted 30 November, 2011 Share Posted 30 November, 2011 Just seen this on Twitter. Sums up my feelings about the Unions too. "Unions: the people who brought you the weekend, capped working hours, employment rights, fair wages, pensions and ended child labour." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Saintandy666 Posted 30 November, 2011 Share Posted 30 November, 2011 Just seen this on Twitter. Sums up my feelings about the Unions too. "Unions: the people who brought you the weekend, capped working hours, employment rights, fair wages, pensions and ended child labour." Damn right. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trousers Posted 30 November, 2011 Share Posted 30 November, 2011 Just seen this on Twitter. Sums up my feelings about the Unions too. "Unions: the people who brought you the weekend, capped working hours, employment rights, fair wages, pensions and ended child labour." Yep. None of those things would ever have happened without the unions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minty Posted 30 November, 2011 Share Posted 30 November, 2011 Just out of interest, is there no acknowledgement from dune that public sector workers also pay tax, and therefore also pay their own wages? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sergei Gotsmanov Posted 30 November, 2011 Share Posted 30 November, 2011 Just seen this on Twitter. Sums up my feelings about the Unions too. "Unions: the people who brought you the weekend, capped working hours, employment rights, fair wages, pensions and ended child labour." and sent your jobs to Asia Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trousers Posted 30 November, 2011 Share Posted 30 November, 2011 Let's abolish the public sector and see how the private sector do(no education for a start... expand it from there). Anyways, it can't be that inefficient, as Osborne and co are acting like today's strike is an economic catastrophe so the public sector must contribute loads to the economy. How come it is alright to call a day off for a royal wedding, but the second 2 million people(substantially less than got the day off for royal wedding) use their democratic right to strike, they are ruining the economy. I was led to believe that the Royal Wedding (and other such events) had a net positive effect on the UK economy (not just on the day but over a period of time)? I don't have the stats to hand so can't substantiate that (feel free to correct me via provision of said stats). To compare something that is also an income generator with something that is purely destructive (in economical terms) is "comparing apples with oranges" terriotory. Just an opinion mind you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colinjb Posted 30 November, 2011 Share Posted 30 November, 2011 Just out of interest, is there no acknowledgement from dune that public sector workers also pay tax, and therefore also pay their own wages? Yet they cannot pay their own wages. The sum simply doesn't add up, although yes, they do supplement them just a little. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
trousers Posted 30 November, 2011 Share Posted 30 November, 2011 (edited) Yet they cannot pay their own wages. The sum simply doesn't add up, although yes, they do supplement them just a little. The main contributors to public sector wages are the top 1% who pay 27% of all taxes collected by the exchequer. Just think how much they would contribute if they weren't so busy avoiding tax... Edited 30 November, 2011 by trousers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dune Posted 30 November, 2011 Author Share Posted 30 November, 2011 Let's abolish the public sector and see how the private sector do(no education for a start... expand it from there). Anyways, it can't be that inefficient, as Osborne and co are acting like today's strike is an economic catastrophe so the public sector must contribute loads to the economy. How come it is alright to call a day off for a royal wedding, but the second 2 million people(substantially less than got the day off for royal wedding) use their democratic right to strike, they are ruining the economy. Arghhhhhhhhhhh. NO F/CKING STUDENTS. Especially ones that know it all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minty Posted 30 November, 2011 Share Posted 30 November, 2011 lol. So how long before you're talking to yourself on this thread then dune? Oh, sorry, you already are... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Viking Warrior Posted 30 November, 2011 Share Posted 30 November, 2011 At Least Dune has a sense of humour!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minty Posted 30 November, 2011 Share Posted 30 November, 2011 Question for everyone else: If someone were to ask you for a link to a website or story with the details about today's strike, and as much unbiased and factual information as possible, so this person could make up their own mind, free of as much journalistic licence and political agenda as possible, where would you direct them? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dune Posted 30 November, 2011 Author Share Posted 30 November, 2011 lol. So how long before you're talking to yourself on this thread then dune? Oh, sorry, you already are... If certain mods did their job it wouldn't be required. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CB Saint Posted 30 November, 2011 Share Posted 30 November, 2011 Question for everyone else: If someone were to ask you for a link to a website or story with the details about today's strike, and as much unbiased and factual information as possible, so this person could make up their own mind, free of as much journalistic licence and political agenda as possible, where would you direct them? pick the mirror and the mail - the truth is somewhere in the middle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minty Posted 30 November, 2011 Share Posted 30 November, 2011 If certain mods did their job it wouldn't be required. To be fair, I don't think you can expect Mods to suddenly act to protect your self-imposed rules on a thread. Here's a novel idea that works for me on forums like this: Take note and reply to the people who answer your question and give responses that you respect, and ignore the ones who don't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minty Posted 30 November, 2011 Share Posted 30 November, 2011 pick the mirror and the mail - the truth is somewhere in the middle It's easy to take the facts of a story and add journalistic licence and political agenda to it, it's much harder to reverse. So I'd quite like an information source that has none of that to begin with. If it exists. It may not. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dune Posted 30 November, 2011 Author Share Posted 30 November, 2011 Take note and reply to the people who answer your question and give responses that you respect, and ignore the ones who don't. Oh my f/cking god, this is my forum motto aswell. Spooky or what! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dune Posted 30 November, 2011 Author Share Posted 30 November, 2011 It's easy to take the facts of a story and add journalistic licence and political agenda to it, it's much harder to reverse. So I'd quite like an information source that has none of that to begin with. If it exists. It may not. SKY News is the closest we have to impartial news, unlike the BBCC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minty Posted 30 November, 2011 Share Posted 30 November, 2011 Oh my f/cking god, this is my forum motto aswell. Spooky or what! Note however, that I didn't say 'And belittle people you don't agree with.' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dune Posted 30 November, 2011 Author Share Posted 30 November, 2011 Note however, that I didn't say 'And belittle people you don't agree with.' I never belittle people that don't deserve it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Verbal Posted 30 November, 2011 Share Posted 30 November, 2011 I never belittle people that don't deserve it. Ah, so this thread has followed its inevitable course, now that it turns out to be about you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dune Posted 30 November, 2011 Author Share Posted 30 November, 2011 Ah, so this thread has followed its inevitable course, now that it turns out to be about you. I'm going to surprise everyone now by not making a comment about therapists or medication. Not as predictable as you thought, eh Verbal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Verbal Posted 30 November, 2011 Share Posted 30 November, 2011 I'm going to surprise everyone now by not making a comment about therapists or medication. Not as predictable as you thought, eh Verbal. I've been charitable and left your medication out of it. But I'm curious - are you on strike? Because you seem to have an awful lot of free time today. Or are you - again - secretly wasting your employer's time and money? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ecuk268 Posted 30 November, 2011 Share Posted 30 November, 2011 Let's abolish the public sector and see how the private sector do(no education for a start... expand it from there). Anyways, it can't be that inefficient, as Osborne and co are acting like today's strike is an economic catastrophe so the public sector must contribute loads to the economy. How come it is alright to call a day off for a royal wedding, but the second 2 million people(substantially less than got the day off for royal wedding) use their democratic right to strike, they are ruining the economy. The estimated cost of the Royal Wedding to industry was about £5bn whereas today could cost £0.5bn. But at least the government is on the right track with rising growth (oh, it's not), borrowing less (oh, they're increasing it) and falling unemployment (oops, it rising). So less tax revenues, more spent on benefits. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dune Posted 30 November, 2011 Author Share Posted 30 November, 2011 I've been charitable and left your medication out of it. But I'm curious - are you on strike? Because you seem to have an awful lot of free time today. Or are you - again - secretly wasting your employer's time and money? Did you or did you not once mention having a therapist? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Verbal Posted 30 November, 2011 Share Posted 30 November, 2011 Did you or did you not once mention having a therapist? Not me guv'nor - although I did recommend that someone on here see one. You know how helpful I try to be. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dune Posted 30 November, 2011 Author Share Posted 30 November, 2011 Not me guv'nor - although I did recommend that someone on here see one - you know how helpful I try to be. Well Turkish remembers you saying it.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Verbal Posted 30 November, 2011 Share Posted 30 November, 2011 Well Turkish remembers you saying it.... Turkish isn't much of an expert on what he said five minutes ago, so I doubt you should take that as gospel. But let's talk about you. Striking or shirking? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
um pahars Posted 30 November, 2011 Share Posted 30 November, 2011 I'm still waiting for my three subsequent questions. i fear this thread has shortchanged me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Verbal Posted 30 November, 2011 Share Posted 30 November, 2011 I'm still waiting for my three subsequent questions. i fear this thread has shortchanged me. So the current balance is: dune owes you three questions and me two answers. I think we're both going to be left bitterly disappointed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
buctootim Posted 30 November, 2011 Share Posted 30 November, 2011 Turkish isn't much of an expert on what he said five minutes ago, so I doubt you should take that as gospel. But let's talk about you. Striking or shirking? lol. Best post in a while. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anothersaintinsouthsea Posted 30 November, 2011 Share Posted 30 November, 2011 I never belittle people that don't deserve it. I don't think you ever belittle anyone, you're not clever enough. You may think that you do but most often you belittle yourself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thorpe-le-Saint Posted 30 November, 2011 Share Posted 30 November, 2011 Have you come up with an answer yet dune as to why the government has carried out an audit on these pensions? Thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
um pahars Posted 30 November, 2011 Share Posted 30 November, 2011 I don't think you ever belittle anyone, you're not clever enough. You may think that you do but most often you belittle yourself. Harsh, but fair. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LGTL Posted 30 November, 2011 Share Posted 30 November, 2011 This thread hasn't really gone the way dune had hoped, I imagine. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minty Posted 30 November, 2011 Share Posted 30 November, 2011 This thread hasn't really gone the way dune had hoped, I imagine. I'm stunned. I really didn't expect it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dune Posted 30 November, 2011 Author Share Posted 30 November, 2011 This thread hasn't really gone the way dune had hoped, I imagine. I'm gutted, but I take solace in the fact we have a Conservative led coalition that is going to push through public sector cuts and there's nothing you can do about it. Shall we call it 1-1 and move on? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
um pahars Posted 30 November, 2011 Share Posted 30 November, 2011 Shall we call it 1-1 and move on? Not until I get my three questions (specialist subject, #fanontheboard) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shurlock Posted 30 November, 2011 Share Posted 30 November, 2011 (edited) As both an income and corporation tax payer, my only real issue with the public sector is the size of salaries of some at the top end. Demonising public sector workers is becoming a sport played to amuse the dumb and stupid. Those at the lower end in the public sector get paid more than their private sector counterparts; those at the higher end get paid considerably less than their private sector counterparts. Public sector workers in London and SE get rawer deal than those oop north because of union opposition to regional pay. Services provided by the public sector tend to be higher quality but are more expensive; the same services provided by the private sector tend to be lower quality but cheaper and more efficiently delivered. These are all more or less FACTS. Edited 30 November, 2011 by shurlock Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dune Posted 30 November, 2011 Author Share Posted 30 November, 2011 Not until I get my three questions (specialist subject, #fanontheboard) I notice other clubs Trusts are still running. Reading even have their own portacabin. What went wrong? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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