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Minus 15 points maybe more

exit2

By exit2,
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exit2

exit2

Posted
Posted

In essence, and Ill put my head on the line for this Pardew sacking is going to affect us worse than the 10 points deduction we had last season.

 

Forget all the rumour **** about players and bust ups it never happened. Alan Pardew not being able to be a football manager is what happened. The developement of players which is basically the youth squad and the first team should all have been over seen by AP from day one and had no interference from Les Reid etc etc.

 

Cortese constantly backing Reid above AP in footballing decsions is a disgrace and will bite us in the ass.

 

The quicker we can someone in the better but Im fearing that who ever it is will have no real input and be over shadowed by certain members of the management team and ceo.

 

The players I have spoken to are not really happy about things at present and you can see it in the way they play.

 

Getting promoted this year? mmmmmmmmmm personaly I dont think so. So maybe if NC gets his man etc we can hope for next year at best, but it will be a long ride Im afraid.

 

As for people singing for Pardew today, why not we have more success under him than we have had in anyone for years. He was the right man and people know that.

 

But like it says all above this mis management / timing is going to be worse than the -10 we got last year!

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Red and White Army

Red and White Army

Posted
Posted

I could not agree more. This sacking was a terrible decision, and can only be mitigated by signing someone of the calibre of Martin O'Neill, which isn't going to happen in a month of Sundays. Unless there was some gross misconduct (which has to be worse then talking to Villa or ****ging someones wife!) then sacking Pardew at this stage of the season was a terrible mistake.

 

Although I supported Cortese prior to this, I think this is his first major blunder and will cost our club the chance of automatic promotion this season.

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kpturner

kpturner

Posted
Posted
.....and will cost our club the chance of automatic promotion this season.
I think the thing that will cost us promotion this year is nothing to do with the manager being sacked - it is to do with not having a good enough team. I keep hearing about what a wonderful squad we have - but it doesn't look that wonderful to me - in fact it looks a bit light. Today Rochdale snuffed us out with ease - and took the two chances they had.
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St Marco

St Marco

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I agree with what a lot of you say but i don't think it is just about the Reed and Pardew thing. The vibe coming out deffinatly seems to indicate something happened in the past week to bring matters to ahead. Hammond say's there were no problems but Davis say's there were. Of the two Hammond being close to Reed will obviously say there were no issues. Davis has no reason to say there were if really there weren't, he probably is the only one who's name will always be first on the team sheet. So i tend to believe him.

 

Regardless of what happened right now the morale in the club is shot. The players look de-jected. Whoever Cortese brings in will need to be someone with respect who can get these players playing, they were Pardew's team. If he brings in someone who is not bigger then them then we will just fall apart like has happened before. That is why i think if Cortese can't bring in a proven big name manager he should resign. He made a choice which as you say was not made for footballing reasons. He must stand by his decision now. When the season ends and if we have not got promoted Cortese will have to accept the blame.

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70's Mike

70's Mike

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Posted
why..?

we have more points than this time last season..better squad, better set up and last season we just missed out..??????

 

 

 

question the better squad part of your post, imo,it is in balanced with too many players of a similar style and apart from Lallana lacks real flair and the ability to do the unexpected

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MarkSFC

MarkSFC

Posted
Posted

I think the Les Reed appointment was the very sensible action. All clubs serious about Youth Development have an "academy director" - whatever the actual title is.

Leaving this to the manager of the first team is flawed for two main reasons:

1) it is a drain on his time and energy

2) if or when the first team manager leaves, the academy suffers and the new man will feel it necccessary to change things even a little because thats what people do.

 

The long term success of the club will have a set up where, if unfortunately the first team manager goes, the structure remains in place and the CEO appoints who he deems the best man to fit in witht the set-up but more importantly make the First Team succesful.

 

The manager should embrace the set up, work with the Academy director (Reed) but ultimatley have only one accountability - success.

Equally the Academy Director should work with the First team manager and coaches towards the development of the "kids".

 

To us the most important man will be the manager....for the long term sustainabilty of the club the AD is possibly the most important "role".

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70's Mike

70's Mike

Posted
Posted
I think the Les Reed appointment was the very sensible action. All clubs serious about Youth Development have an "academy director" - whatever the actual title is.

Leaving this to the manager of the first team is flawed for two main reasons:

1) it is a drain on his time and energy

2) if or when the first team manager leaves, the academy suffers and the new man will feel it necccessary to change things even a little because thats what people do.

 

The long term success of the club will have a set up where, if unfortunately the first team manager goes, the structure remains in place and the CEO appoints who he deems the best man to fit in witht the set-up but more importantly make the First Team succesful.

 

The manager should embrace the set up, work with the Academy director (Reed) but ultimatley have only one accountability - success.

Equally the Academy Director should work with the First team manager and coaches towards the development of the "kids".

 

To us the most important man will be the manager....for the long term sustainabilty of the club the AD is possibly the most important "role".

 

Sounds good in theory but not sure if there are many practical examples of where it works

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exit2

exit2

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Song for the next game?

 

He's bald, he's fat , he is a f*****g prat. Les Reed, Les Reed

 

I wouldnt go that far as Les Reid is an asset I believe, but AP should be the main man. People have said that LR sits on the scouting committee, thats fine for younger players but AP should have the otherall say. LR should be in charge of the development or youth as it used to be called and thats fine. Like others have said it seems NC is looking to LR for guidance and is like a DOF as such but not in title. So who ever comes in I think will be a younger manager who will accept the arrangment and look to LR for some guidance.

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Topcat

Topcat

Posted
Posted

Exit2, Les Reed has clearly acted in ways that undermined Pardew and forced a show down. That was not in the best interests of the Club so Les Reed is part of the problem and has to go to give the new Manager a chance of success. Cortese should have more of the blame for setting up this dysfunctional structure.

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70's Mike

70's Mike

Posted
Posted
I wouldnt go that far as Les Reid is an asset I believe, but AP should be the main man. People have said that LR sits on the scouting committee, thats fine for younger players but AP should have the otherall say. LR should be in charge of the development or youth as it used to be called and thats fine. Like others have said it seems NC is looking to LR for guidance and is like a DOF as such but not in title. So who ever comes in I think will be a younger manager who will accept the arrangment and look to LR for some guidance.

 

just sounds like NC is RL in a different suit

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Daren W

Daren W

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Posted
In essence, and Ill put my head on the line for this Pardew sacking is going to affect us worse than the 10 points deduction we had last season.

 

Forget all the rumour **** about players and bust ups it never happened. Alan Pardew not being able to be a football manager is what happened. The developement of players which is basically the youth squad and the first team should all have been over seen by AP from day one and had no interference from Les Reid etc etc.

 

Cortese constantly backing Reid above AP in footballing decsions is a disgrace and will bite us in the ass.

 

The quicker we can someone in the better but Im fearing that who ever it is will have no real input and be over shadowed by certain members of the management team and ceo.

 

The players I have spoken to are not really happy about things at present and you can see it in the way they play.

 

Getting promoted this year? mmmmmmmmmm personaly I dont think so. So maybe if NC gets his man etc we can hope for next year at best, but it will be a long ride Im afraid.

 

As for people singing for Pardew today, why not we have more success under him than we have had in anyone for years. He was the right man and people know that.

 

But like it says all above this mis management / timing is going to be worse than the -10 we got last year!

 

 

The fact we've gone from a 4-0 away win to two consecutive home defeats, shipping five goals in the process, is lost on some on here. Somehow some bright sparks have even managed to blame Pardew for two defeats after he'd left

 

And to think people mocked those of us who thought Pardew's sacking had de-railled our season. The club is in absolute chaos, the butt of numerous jokes from the national media and now in a rich vein of **** poor form.

 

Not unretrievable, a good appointment can salvage it all, but right now I'd question anyone who thinks the sacking is anything but a disaster right now...

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acersaint

acersaint

Posted
Posted

138 points available for the season. 95 points should guarantee automatic promotion. Therefore we can drop 43 points. We have dropped 8 so far. Chill out. New manager on the way. Automatic promotion still very possible. Ok I have been a supporter for 45 years and am an eternal optimist. But remember it's not over until it's over. Let's hold on until the new guy is in and has a few games under his belt until we all start slitting our wrists.

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Topcat

Topcat

Posted
Posted
right...so now Les Reed is the new antony pulis/paul wotton..

 

who decided who we hate...?

 

It is not about hate. It is about ensuring that the new Manager has a fair chance of selecting the players they judge that we need to be successful. Les Reed has become part of the problem. He wants to have a say, so must accept some feedback when things are going wrong.

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70's Mike

70's Mike

Posted
Posted
138 points available for the season. 95 points should guarantee automatic promotion. Therefore we can drop 43 points. We have dropped 8 so far. Chill out. New manager on the way. Automatic promotion still very possible. Ok I have been a supporter for 45 years and am an eternal optimist. But remember it's not over until it's over. Let's hold on until the new guy is in and has a few games under his belt until we all start slitting our wrists.

 

after watching today new bloke will have to be a miracle worker because imo the squad is poorly balanced , lacks pace at both ends of the pitch

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Thedelldays

Thedelldays

Posted
Posted
It is not about hate. It is about ensuring that the new Manager has a fair chance of selecting the players they judge that we need to be successful. Les Reed has become part of the problem. He wants to have a say, so must accept some feedback when things are going wrong.

 

where has he become part of the problem...where is this laid down...?

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exit2

exit2

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So basically Les Reid is Corteses Sir Clive Woodward.

 

I said ages ago that Cortese was another Rupert Lowe and with every day that passes I am being proved right.

 

NO!!!!! Les Reid is a respected person in football but I dont agree that his decisions can interfere with AP's. AP or who ever the new manger is should have overall say on first team matters, and the statement from the club

 

"embrace bot the first team and the football development & support centre as intergrated co-operative units" shows this was an issue for AP

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dune

dune

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Posted
NO!!!!! Les Reid is a respected person in football but I dont agree that his decisions can interfere with AP's. AP or who ever the new manger is should have overall say on first team matters

 

I'd go further and say the manager should have overall say on all playing staff matters from the youth team to the first team and it should be up to him to direct his coaches to do whatever he demands. Can you imagine the likes of Alex Fergusson or Arsene Wenger accepting any less?

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lordswoodsaints

lordswoodsaints

Posted
Posted
In essence, and Ill put my head on the line for this Pardew sacking is going to affect us worse than the 10 points deduction we had last season.

 

Forget all the rumour **** about players and bust ups it never happened. Alan Pardew not being able to be a football manager is what happened. The developement of players which is basically the youth squad and the first team should all have been over seen by AP from day one and had no interference from Les Reid etc etc.

 

Cortese constantly backing Reid above AP in footballing decsions is a disgrace and will bite us in the ass.

 

The quicker we can someone in the better but Im fearing that who ever it is will have no real input and be over shadowed by certain members of the management team and ceo.

 

The players I have spoken to are not really happy about things at present and you can see it in the way they play.

 

Getting promoted this year? mmmmmmmmmm personaly I dont think so. So maybe if NC gets his man etc we can hope for next year at best, but it will be a long ride Im afraid.

 

As for people singing for Pardew today, why not we have more success under him than we have had in anyone for years. He was the right man and people know that.

 

But like it says all above this mis management / timing is going to be worse than the -10 we got last year!

 

Bull****,pardew has been a naughty boy and he was sacked for it.....I don't know where you got your info from but it's wrong.

The senior players are not happy and they made a decision.

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dune

dune

Posted
Posted
Bull****,pardew has been a naughty boy and he was sacked for it.....I don't know where you got your info from but it's wrong.

The senior players are not happy and they made a decision.

 

Does this relate to the stuff that no-one is allowed to post?

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Professor

Professor

Posted
Posted (edited)

Unlike past dimissals of managers, this appears to have been done for no good reason and with no regard to timing. The published reason is entirely illogical as a structural change should have been made in the close season, not in September, so frankly that doesn't wash as a reason. This has all the hallmarks of a stamping foot, something that we haven't seen with past chairmen. Like them or not, past decisions were taken calmly, whereas this looks more like tremper tantrum. It bodes very ill for the club that I love, and shows why personal ownership of football clubs can look fine to fans while an owner is pumping in money, but things can also go disasterously wrong.

 

This minus 15 points could look like minus 20 in a couple of weeks.

Edited by Professor
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docker-p

docker-p

Posted
Posted
Unlike past dimissals of managers, this appears to have been done for no good reason and with no regard to timing. The published reason is entirely illogical as a structural change should have been made in the close season, not in September, so frankly that doesn't wash as a reason. This has all the hallmarks of a stamping foot, something that we haven't seen with past chairmen. Like them or not, past decisions were taken calmly, whereas this looks more like tremper tantrum. It bodes very ill for the club that I love, and shows why personal ownership of football clubs can look fine to fans while an owner is pumping in money, but things can also go disasterously wrong.

 

This minus 15 points could look like minus 20 in a couple of weeks.

And to top it all, the only people that can sort this mess (NC) out are hundreds of miles away in Switzerland, and have probably got there minds on other things.

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Dalek2003

Dalek2003

Posted
Posted
I agree with what a lot of you say but i don't think it is just about the Reed and Pardew thing. The vibe coming out deffinatly seems to indicate something happened in the past week to bring matters to ahead. Hammond say's there were no problems but Davis say's there were. Of the two Hammond being close to Reed will obviously say there were no issues. Davis has no reason to say there were if really there weren't, he probably is the only one who's name will always be first on the team sheet. So i tend to believe him.

 

Regardless of what happened right now the morale in the club is shot. The players look de-jected. Whoever Cortese brings in will need to be someone with respect who can get these players playing, they were Pardew's team. If he brings in someone who is not bigger then them then we will just fall apart like has happened before. That is why i think if Cortese can't bring in a proven big name manager he should resign. He made a choice which as you say was not made for footballing reasons. He must stand by his decision now. When the season ends and if we have not got promoted Cortese will have to accept the blame.

 

Totally agree with this statement. Sturrock failed because he did NOT have the respect of the players. From the off , they had no confidence in him and they did not play for him. When Strachan came he had the complete respect of the players and so did Hoddle when he came.

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