aintforever Posted 19 August, 2008 Share Posted 19 August, 2008 ...from the squad at the end of last season. Not a bad side. R Wright Ostlund Lucketti Davies Vignal Viafara Safri Idiakez Licka Rasiak Saganowski Subs: Pericard Powell Hammill J Wright Makin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidthesquid Posted 19 August, 2008 Share Posted 19 August, 2008 ...from the squad at the end of last season. Not a bad side. R Wright Ostlund Lucketti Davies Vignal Viafara Safri Idiakez Licka Rasiak Saganowski Subs: Pericard Powell Hammill J Wright Makin A very bad side with two good players in it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickG Posted 19 August, 2008 Share Posted 19 August, 2008 RB. RM subs are all poor tho! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aintforever Posted 19 August, 2008 Author Share Posted 19 August, 2008 A very bad side with two good players in it! True the side was not that great. But they are being replaced, on the whole, by players who were deemed worse by all the managers we had last season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doctoroncall Posted 19 August, 2008 Share Posted 19 August, 2008 True the side was not that great. But they are being replaced, on the whole, by players who were deemed worse by all the managers we had last season. That says more about the ex-managers than the current players IMHO. Let's see how the next few games pan out, at least they haven't had an inept performance and a drubbing like the palace game last season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saintwarwick Posted 19 August, 2008 Share Posted 19 August, 2008 A very bad side with two good players in it! Which two would that be? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy_Porter Posted 19 August, 2008 Share Posted 19 August, 2008 True the side was not that great. But they are being replaced, on the whole, by players who were deemed worse by all the managers we had last season. Or player the managers where scared to use. I don't think D&G or Burley would have had the b0llocks to drop someone like Safri, Euell or Idiakez in favour of a youngster like Lallana or Gillett. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ulstersaint Posted 19 August, 2008 Share Posted 19 August, 2008 ...from the squad at the end of last season. Not a bad side. R Wright Ostlund Lucketti Davies Vignal Viafara Safri Idiakez Licka Rasiak Saganowski Subs: Pericard Powell Hammill J Wright Makin Not a bad side??? Wright excepted, if they had been any good we would not having have been scrapping for survival on the last game of the season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saintjinksie Posted 19 August, 2008 Share Posted 19 August, 2008 ...from the squad at the end of last season. Not a bad side. R Wright Ostlund Lucketti Davies Vignal Viafara Safri Idiakez Licka Rasiak Saganowski Subs: Pericard Powell Hammill J Wright Makin i have to say i agree that isnt a bad side. two specialist full backs and solid centre backs. Rasiak would get 20 in a season if played regularly. better than our current crop of gash IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saint.tom.clancy Posted 19 August, 2008 Share Posted 19 August, 2008 i have to say i agree that isnt a bad side. two specialist full backs and solid centre backs. Rasiak would get 20 in a season if played regularly. better than our current crop of gash IMO. lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wadesmith Posted 19 August, 2008 Share Posted 19 August, 2008 ...from the squad at the end of last season. Not a bad side. R Wright Ostlund Lucketti Davies Vignal Viafara Safri Idiakez Licka Rasiak Saganowski Subs: Pericard Powell Hammill J Wright Makin You've gotta be joking...that side sucks. Just reading those player names (Davies excluded) makes my heart sink. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legod Second Coming Posted 19 August, 2008 Share Posted 19 August, 2008 ...from the squad at the end of last season. Not a bad side. R Wright Ostlund Lucketti Davies Vignal Viafara Safri Idiakez Licka Rasiak Saganowski Subs: Pericard Powell Hammill J Wright Makin That missed relegation by a Coventry goal... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wes Tender Posted 19 August, 2008 Share Posted 19 August, 2008 Not a bad side??? Wright excepted, if they had been any good we would not having have been scrapping for survival on the last game of the season. Well, it coincides pretty well with what Nigel Pearson played against Sheffield United in our last game, one of the best teams in the league. That day, the team was R Wright, Wright, Powell, Perry, Surman, Viafara, Safri, Idiakez, (Licka) Euell, Saganowski (Lallana) John. It was a team capable of scoring three goals against decent opposition whilst conceding two. At least they have done better than our current team in that respect, scoring more than they concede. But then it seems to me that Pearson was a good motivator of those older players, whilst the current regime has told those that remain that they are surplus to requirements, which is hardly the best way to motivate people, is it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Legod Second Coming Posted 19 August, 2008 Share Posted 19 August, 2008 Well, it coincides pretty well with what Nigel Pearson played against Sheffield United in our last game, one of the best teams in the league. That day, the team was R Wright, Wright, Powell, Perry, Surman, Viafara, Safri, Idiakez, (Licka) Euell, Saganowski (Lallana) John. It was a team capable of scoring three goals against decent opposition whilst conceding two. At least they have done better than our current team in that respect, scoring more than they concede. But then it seems to me that Pearson was a good motivator of those older players, whilst the current regime has told those that remain that they are surplus to requirements, which is hardly the best way to motivate people, is it? Not really true is it? The older players were higher earners who had to be shifted on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wes Tender Posted 19 August, 2008 Share Posted 19 August, 2008 Not really true is it? The older players were higher earners who had to be shifted on. No, not strictly true. But said against a background that they have been discarded by JP on Lowe's instructions and some on here have made judgements against them as a knee-jerk reaction because of it. Half decent player leaves us and five minutes later somebody says good riddance, he was crap. Just look at the Andrew Davies thread for instance. Some say that we won't miss him because we have plenty of cover for him. Yes, with inexperienced youth team kids or older potential crocks. Under the circumstances, I can't say I blame players like Scacel or Euell for not wanting to go elsewhere for less money than they get here when they have contracts allowing them to stay. The whole thing has been mismanaged IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wildgoose Posted 19 August, 2008 Share Posted 19 August, 2008 Should be a good side.....on paper. Not so good on the pitch though unfortunately. For all sorts of reasons. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
team-saint Posted 19 August, 2008 Share Posted 19 August, 2008 not really much point in talking about what would of happened if lowe kept pearson, he didn't and there's nothing we can do about that now all we can do is get behind jan and the boys and help them to 3 points on saturday Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlfredKo Posted 20 August, 2008 Share Posted 20 August, 2008 It is never a bad side, Viafara, Rasiak, Saganowski and Ostlund are the main players for our team that got to the play-off two seasons ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madsent Posted 20 August, 2008 Share Posted 20 August, 2008 Well, it coincides pretty well with what Nigel Pearson played against Sheffield United in our last game, one of the best teams in the league. That day, the team was R Wright, Wright, Powell, Perry, Surman, Viafara, Safri, Idiakez, (Licka) Euell, Saganowski (Lallana) John. How does it coincide well with the last NP team ? There are only 5 players in both starting 11s. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alucard Posted 20 August, 2008 Share Posted 20 August, 2008 Well, it coincides pretty well with what Nigel Pearson played against Sheffield United in our last game, one of the best teams in the league. That day, the team was R Wright, Wright, Powell, Perry, Surman, Viafara, Safri, Idiakez, (Licka) Euell, Saganowski (Lallana) John. It was a team capable of scoring three goals against decent opposition whilst conceding two. At least they have done better than our current team in that respect, scoring more than they concede. But then it seems to me that Pearson was a good motivator of those older players, whilst the current regime has told those that remain that they are surplus to requirements, which is hardly the best way to motivate people, is it? Also very similar to the absolute shambles that made us the laughing stock of the nation against Bristol Rovers. Davis ,Ostlund ,Powell ,Davies ,Wright ,Saganowski (McGoldrick ,80 ) ,Idiakez (Wright-Phillips ,57 ) ,Viafara (Hammill ,87 ) ,Surman ,Euell ,John You just keep coming up with one game we played well in Wes. I can come up with 10 times as many where we played crap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickG Posted 20 August, 2008 Share Posted 20 August, 2008 very good point and why we should not be adverse to an overhaul this season. That "expensive" side, performing like that, would have been thrashed by the lightweight youths and Lowe signings and cheap options playing like they did on Saturday. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Minsk Posted 20 August, 2008 Share Posted 20 August, 2008 ...from the squad at the end of last season. Not a bad side. R Wright Ostlund Lucketti Davies Vignal Viafara Safri Idiakez Licka Rasiak Saganowski Subs: Pericard Powell Hammill J Wright Makin You could also add in Claus, Poke, Baseya and Dutton-Black. Are there any others? But then again the important thing is not what team you could make from those who have gone, but how much money per week we are now saving. As well as all those players we have also seen Pearson, Dodd and Gorman leave, with JP and Wotte alledgedly on one third of Fearsome's wages! We do, of course, have to then calculate in the wages for the 4 replacements (Wotton, Holmes, Spiderman and Forecast) for the 20 above who have gone - but not necessarily the wages for Perry as we were paying him last season too. All in all our wage bill is now probably 120k-140k per week less than it was in May! That works out at 6.24-7.28 million over a year!! And even if I have overestimated some wages a saving of 100k per week is still 5.2 million per year!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
INFLUENCED.COM Posted 20 August, 2008 Share Posted 20 August, 2008 Teams on paper mean f*ck all as those you document demonstrated Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wes Tender Posted 20 August, 2008 Share Posted 20 August, 2008 Also very similar to the absolute shambles that made us the laughing stock of the nation against Bristol Rovers. Davis ,Ostlund ,Powell ,Davies ,Wright ,Saganowski (McGoldrick ,80 ) ,Idiakez (Wright-Phillips ,57 ) ,Viafara (Hammill ,87 ) ,Surman ,Euell ,John You just keep coming up with one game we played well in Wes. I can come up with 10 times as many where we played crap. We obviously played crap against the other Bristol team too, eh? When they were top of the table, heading for automatic promotion, weren't they? The fact is that we had probably the most difficult run in of any team in the division and yet Pearson managed to turn around a demoralised team that was leaking like a sieve into one that was hard to break down and gaining in confidence and belief. But if you want to believe that this current team is fantastic and the one we had at the end of the season was crap, then don't let me attempt to spoil your little fantasy. Time will tell whether this team will continue to play decent football or not for a full season, whereas Pearson never had the chance to prove what he could do. IMO there was not that much wrong with those players that a bit of motivation and belief could not fix and there were signs that they were improving those aspects under Pearson. But of course, it is all irrelevant, as they could not be kept anyway, as we are stoney broke. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JohnnyFartPants Posted 20 August, 2008 Share Posted 20 August, 2008 True the side was not that great. But they are being replaced, on the whole, by players who were deemed worse by all the managers we had last season. That could be compared with every England manager being right that MLT wasn't good enough or even that Darren Anderton is a better player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickG Posted 20 August, 2008 Share Posted 20 August, 2008 We obviously played crap against the other Bristol team too, eh? When they were top of the table, heading for automatic promotion, weren't they? The fact is that we had probably the most difficult run in of any team in the division and yet Pearson managed to turn around a demoralised team that was leaking like a sieve into one that was hard to break down and gaining in confidence and belief. But if you want to believe that this current team is fantastic and the one we had at the end of the season was crap, then don't let me attempt to spoil your little fantasy. Time will tell whether this team will continue to play decent football or not for a full season, whereas Pearson never had the chance to prove what he could do. IMO there was not that much wrong with those players that a bit of motivation and belief could not fix and there were signs that they were improving those aspects under Pearson. But of course, it is all irrelevant, as they could not be kept anyway, as we are stoney broke. Think that is a good point, NP did well at making us more solid and you could say, as we all hoped, that he could go on from there and build his side to do better -which we all hoped (it maybe that last season was playing to his strengths of coming in to sort morale and discipline out but maybe not the best as building a team -who knows). But as you point out there are too many changes anyway -the players were all being sold of/released to save money. - sorry for waffle lost what I was going to say! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sidthesquid Posted 20 August, 2008 Share Posted 20 August, 2008 Which two would that be? Richard Wright & Andrew Davies Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
end of an era2 Posted 20 August, 2008 Share Posted 20 August, 2008 Not a bad side??? Wright excepted, if they had been any good we would not having have been scrapping for survival on the last game of the season. Exactly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stevegrant Posted 20 August, 2008 Share Posted 20 August, 2008 On paper, it's a very good side. Unfortunately, football isn't played on paper and players have to perform to their abilities on a regular basis if they are to keep their reputations intact. The vast majority of that team didn't do that last season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aintforever Posted 20 August, 2008 Author Share Posted 20 August, 2008 i agree that most of those players did not do the business for us last season and that the quality of some of the youngsters shows what a hideous waste of money many of them were. BUT most of them did play a role at some point and did a job, wether the quality of the first XI is better or worse is up for debate but over a season it's the quality of the squad that makes the difference and we are a whole squad of capable CCC players down on a sqad that last year finished 5th bottom. How would our current squad cope with say 7-8 of the first team injured? If Coventry had lost the players we had then we would all be saying they are dead certs for relegation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy Durman Posted 20 August, 2008 Share Posted 20 August, 2008 This team lacks pace and that was one of our downfalls last season. That and fitness Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NickG Posted 20 August, 2008 Share Posted 20 August, 2008 This team lacks pace and that was one of our downfalls last season. That and fitness and abilty, organisation and motivation;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bad Wolf Posted 20 August, 2008 Share Posted 20 August, 2008 No Claus? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arizona Posted 21 August, 2008 Share Posted 21 August, 2008 ...from the squad at the end of last season. Not a bad side. R Wright Ostlund Lucketti Davies Vignal Viafara Safri Idiakez Licka Rasiak Saganowski Subs: Pericard Powell Hammill J Wright Makin I'd regard Davies, Wright, Saganowski, Vignal and Rasiak as being good players. The rest were distinctly average, but I'd take most of them over our current crop TBH. I know it's early days, but 2 games and 2 defeats isn't really that much to get excited about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wes Tender Posted 21 August, 2008 Share Posted 21 August, 2008 Surely no-one whose seen Gillet and Schneidlerin play together could want to go back to last season? Or even Holmes, Thomson, Lallana, Dyer.... Safri and Idiakez summed up everyone wrong with us last season. Two players who sat back but couldn't tackle, didn't score and didn't help the defence much. Safri was a tidy player, but a hugely ineffective one. Idiakez was just gutless, old, and never that great. Just because of our midfield now, I think we'd destroy last season's team. Additionally, any squad with Pericard in it is in extreme danger. I seem to recall that Dyer was playing for us last season too. Pearson had already blooded Lallana too and would probably have continued using him had he stayed. Whether Safri was ineffective is purely a matter of opinion and I for one disagree with you. I also disagree that Idiakez was never that great. By using ever I'm presuming you actually meant ever in his entire career? His tackling wasn't great, but his ability to pick out a pass was better than average. The jury's out on Holmes and Thomson. And I don't agree at all with your assertion that just because of our midfield this current team would destroy last season's team. Even accepting that Schneiderlin and Gillett aren't a bad combination, this team's strike force is lighter weight and reliant on no injuries and John not leaving. And there are defensive shortcomings now that would have seen the last season's strikers banging the goals in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alucard Posted 21 August, 2008 Share Posted 21 August, 2008 I seem to recall that Dyer was playing for us last season too. Pearson had already blooded Lallana too and would probably have continued using him had he stayed. Whether Safri was ineffective is purely a matter of opinion and I for one disagree with you. I also disagree that Idiakez was never that great. By using ever I'm presuming you actually meant ever in his entire career? His tackling wasn't great, but his ability to pick out a pass was better than average. The jury's out on Holmes and Thomson. . Pearson did not blood Lallana, GB did back in December 07. Pearson did not see fit to use him for 12 games while he constantly rotated BWP, Saga and Pericard despite Lallana receiving rave reviews in every reserve match he played. Pearson did blood Baseya for 1 minute against Ipswich. As he didn't score he never figured again as we went back to BWP, Saga and Pericard . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arizona Posted 21 August, 2008 Share Posted 21 August, 2008 Pearson did not blood Lallana, GB did back in December 07. Pearson did not see fit to use him for 12 games while he constantly rotated BWP, Saga and Pericard despite Lallana receiving rave reviews in every reserve match he played. Pearson did blood Baseya for 1 minute against Ipswich. As he didn't score he never figured again as we went back to BWP, Saga and Pericard . Learnt his lesson with Pericard I think. After a somewhat dismal performance against Coventry he only made 2 or 3 late substitute appearances in the remaining 6 games. Don't forget Licka also made some decent appearances in the reserves, but was unable to reproduce that form consistently for the first team. It would seem that neither Burley, D&G nor Pearson thought he was ready for regular first team action at such a critical time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alucard Posted 21 August, 2008 Share Posted 21 August, 2008 Learnt his lesson with Pericard I think. After a somewhat dismal performance against Coventry he only made 2 or 3 late substitute appearances in the remaining 6 games. Don't forget Licka also made some decent appearances in the reserves, but was unable to reproduce that form consistently for the first team. It would seem that neither Burley, D&G nor Pearson thought he was ready for regular first team action at such a critical time. Or they were afraid to try assuming the guys who were getting £10K per week were suddenly going to produce the performances they had failed to produce in the previous 40 games. Wes Tender says we had a good squad just lacking in motivation. I would say that £10K p.w. should be motivation enough for anybody to put the effort in. We've seen already this season the difference playing with enthusiasm makes instead of going through the motions to pick up an inflated pay cheque. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arizona Posted 21 August, 2008 Share Posted 21 August, 2008 Or they were afraid to try assuming the guys who were getting £10K per week were suddenly going to produce the performances they had failed to produce in the previous 40 games. Wes Tender says we had a good squad just lacking in motivation. I would say that £10K p.w. should be motivation enough for anybody to put the effort in. We've seen already this season the difference playing with enthusiasm makes instead of going through the motions to pick up an inflated pay cheque. I don't think it's accurate to say they were afraid to try. All 3 management structures played Lallana at some point last season. I saw him myself once or twice earlier in the season and was never really that excited. I am also not convinced that the players last season didn't care, more that they were lacking confidence, leadership and creativity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wes Tender Posted 21 August, 2008 Share Posted 21 August, 2008 Or they were afraid to try assuming the guys who were getting £10K per week were suddenly going to produce the performances they had failed to produce in the previous 40 games. Wes Tender says we had a good squad just lacking in motivation. I would say that £10K p.w. should be motivation enough for anybody to put the effort in. We've seen already this season the difference playing with enthusiasm makes instead of going through the motions to pick up an inflated pay cheque. So by your reasoning, the more they are paid, the more motivated they ought to be? On that basis, it rather shoots down your argument that the youngsters will put in more commitment, as they are paid considerably less, which throws up the probability that they will be off as soon as somebody offers them a much bigger pay cheque. I think that Arizona's summary is a far better yardstick, that they were lacking confidence, leadership and creativity. Anyway, if you were put in as the manager of a club in freefall, short of confidence and motivation, what would you honestly do? Play the youngsters, or attempt to fire up again players with experience? JP has had his hand forced on him by financial circumstances, but nobody has put up evidence to show that Pearson was unprepared to go down the same road as JP if offered the opportunity. We might never know. All that is clear in all probability is that it is far better making selections with the widest variety of options available to one, rather than being forced by circumstances into a narrowed selection. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alucard Posted 21 August, 2008 Share Posted 21 August, 2008 So by your reasoning, the more they are paid, the more motivated they ought to be? On that basis, it rather shoots down your argument that the youngsters will put in more commitment, as they are paid considerably less, which throws up the probability that they will be off as soon as somebody offers them a much bigger pay cheque. I think that Arizona's summary is a far better yardstick, that they were lacking confidence, leadership and creativity. Anyway, if you were put in as the manager of a club in freefall, short of confidence and motivation, what would you honestly do? Play the youngsters, or attempt to fire up again players with experience? JP has had his hand forced on him by financial circumstances, but nobody has put up evidence to show that Pearson was unprepared to go down the same road as JP if offered the opportunity. We might never know. All that is clear in all probability is that it is far better making selections with the widest variety of options available to one, rather than being forced by circumstances into a narrowed selection. Don't try to put words in my mouth. I said somebody who gets paid £10K pw shouldn't need motivating to avoid missing relegation in the last 20 minutes of the season. Professional pride should count but our overpaid, lazy mercenaries from last season did not seem to display any of that. As you say we our forced into a narrowed selection by circumstances and it does not help one iota when so called suporters are taking every opportunity to snipe and ridicule our only option for survival. Perhaps if everybody pulled together we can avoid the shambles of a season we had last year and build for the future but some people seem to take great in us losing games in order to further their petty point scoring mentality Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gordon Mockles Posted 21 August, 2008 Share Posted 21 August, 2008 You've gotta be joking...that side sucks. Just reading those player names (Davies excluded) makes my heart sink. Really? You’d favour Kelvin Davies or Bart over Richard Wright then? Ok! Furthermore, although not a big fan, Rasiak does get goals and Saga would serve a purpose (certainly with our total lack of firepower currently). Safri was a useful player and marshalled the midfield well and had good experience (I rated him with Davies as the other of our best players and our squad clearly looked weaker for it when he was out mid-season). Although not a great player, Licka did enough to warrant a place and can’t have been a pricey player. Lucketti came along and clearly made a difference and helped keep us up. Bizarre to totally dismiss that side. Even though Idiakez had his injury problems, he was often the only creative part (bar Surman who was largely absent end of the season) of the midfield and often the only forward thinking player (in the centre) that fired balls forward for attacking impetus. Not 100% but on a good few occasions which people seem to conveniently forget – Bristol Rovers being an example despite him being subbed and a p*ss poor performance) Just thought I’d give my ten pence worth! very good point and why we should not be adverse to an overhaul this season. That "expensive" side, performing like that, would have been thrashed by the lightweight youths and Lowe signings and cheap options playing like they did on Saturday. WHAT? Thrashed like Cardiff and Birmingham?! Performing like “that” ? Agreed, they were often poor but a good portion of our squad’s total disarray was down to a certain p*ssed up, demotivating manager (not forfeiting blame to the players either) and Pearson came along and made a big difference. Not adverse to an overhaul? How can you be so blasé and, as a well placed post yesterday stated, happy clappy (i.e. happily swallowing poor decision after poor decision, making out it’s not bad when clearly to the vast detriment of our club). That’s the same demented ethos as those Deal or No Deal people that lose 250K and comment “It’s alright, It’s alright – I’m not upset!”. “YES YOU F*CKIN ARE! YES YOU BLO*DY SHOULD BE!!! YOU’VE JUST BLOWN 250 GRAND FOR THE MEASLY SUM OF 1p! How can you not be p*ssed off? Stop being in denial - ADMIT IT!!” LOL :smt119 That hypothetical example, young Nicholas, is a bit wide of the mark. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wes Tender Posted 21 August, 2008 Share Posted 21 August, 2008 Don't try to put words in my mouth. I said somebody who gets paid £10K pw shouldn't need motivating to avoid missing relegation in the last 20 minutes of the season. Professional pride should count but our overpaid, lazy mercenaries from last season did not seem to display any of that. I reiterate; you state that because they were paid £10k pw, the older players ought to be sufficiently motivated. The youngsters perhaps on a third of that should presumably play their hearts out because they love the club or more sensibly because they wish to put themselves in the window to attract offers from Premiership Clubs. Is money a primary motivator or not? Therefore is somebody more motivated because they receive more, or not? Certainly, as I said, it will be a defining factor should any of the youngsters shine and are offered place with higher division teams at much higher wages. At some stage if they have been reasonably successful in their careers, they will themselves become older players at some lower league club and in turn be accused of being mercenaries. Ironic, isn't it? And anyway, it wasn't a case that they all played badly all season. It was because we had disruption with three different management changes, the first manager having constantly tinkered with the team, playing people out of position, not knowing his best team for most of the time. That way lies dispondency and lack of cohesion and creativity. As you say we our forced into a narrowed selection by circumstances and it does not help one iota when so called suporters are taking every opportunity to snipe and ridicule our only option for survival. Perhaps if everybody pulled together we can avoid the shambles of a season we had last year and build for the future but some people seem to take great in us losing games in order to further their petty point scoring mentality Most are behind the team and are doing their sniping at Lowe, Wilde and Crouch and nothing wrong with that. The blame for our current predicament lies firmly at their doors and most would wish all of them gone. I have a lot of sympathy for JP who seems to be struggling to keep players who he was told would be kept, cannot play others who were expected to be gone and has generally had his hands tied by the board. Also, as this is a forum, it would be an incredibly dull place if we were all singing from the same song sheet, wouldn't it? I would respond also to the implication that most of our older players were lazy mercenaries last seaon, but Gordon Mockles has done an excellent job there already Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John B Posted 21 August, 2008 Share Posted 21 August, 2008 i have to say i agree that isnt a bad side. Two specialist full backs and solid centre backs. Rasiak would get 20 in a season if played regularly. Better than our current crop of gash imo. only problem this team would bankrupt us Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saintjinksie Posted 21 August, 2008 Share Posted 21 August, 2008 only problem this team would bankrupt us yeah but relegation to league 1 will cost a bit too Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
voteforpedro Posted 21 August, 2008 Share Posted 21 August, 2008 Well, it coincides pretty well with what Nigel Pearson played against Sheffield United in our last game, one of the best teams in the league. That day, the team was R Wright, Wright, Powell, Perry, Surman, Viafara, Safri, Idiakez, (Licka) Euell, Saganowski (Lallana) John. It was a team capable of scoring three goals against decent opposition whilst conceding two. At least they have done better than our current team in that respect, scoring more than they concede. But then it seems to me that Pearson was a good motivator of those older players, whilst the current regime has told those that remain that they are surplus to requirements, which is hardly the best way to motivate people, is it? Ok so in that one game they scored more than they conceded, but what about the rest of the season? With the exception of R Wright (who was only here on loan) those players had planty of chances to prove how good they were, but time and time agian they failed to perform, content to take their astronomical wages, for very little work. 6 of those players started in our 5-0 defeat to sheff wed, a team that spent the season hovering above the relegation zone, 6 of them started in our 3-0 loss at home to watford, 6 of them started in our cup defeat to bristol rovers, 5 of them started our 5-0 defeat to hull, 7 of them started our home defeat to burnley.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saintkiptanui Posted 21 August, 2008 Share Posted 21 August, 2008 i have to say i agree that isnt a bad side. two specialist full backs and solid centre backs. Rasiak would get 20 in a season if played regularly. better than our current crop of gash IMO. shut up. That lot nearly got us relegated, silly little draper. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CHAPEL END CHARLIE Posted 21 August, 2008 Share Posted 21 August, 2008 Ok so in that one game they scored more than they conceded, but what about the rest of the season? With the exception of R Wright (who was only here on loan) those players had planty of chances to prove how good they were, but time and time agian they failed to perform, content to take their astronomical wages, for very little work. 6 of those players started in our 5-0 defeat to sheff wed, a team that spent the season hovering above the relegation zone, 6 of them started in our 3-0 loss at home to watford, 6 of them started in our cup defeat to bristol rovers, 5 of them started our 5-0 defeat to hull, 7 of them started our home defeat to burnley.... On that basis I expect you exclusivly blame the poor bloody infantry for the Battle of the Somme rather than the Field Marshalls . Yes last seasons squad obviously weren't brilliant but half the problem was with the inept leadership the team was burdened with before Nigel Pearson's arrival and financial constraints . I've said it before and I'm quite happy to repeat myself - the 2007/8 squad properly led and organised would/should have been quite capable of finishing the season safley mid table or better IMO . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wes Tender Posted 21 August, 2008 Share Posted 21 August, 2008 I suspect that if some anorak was to analyse which combination of players last season was capable of beating the best teams and which lost against the worst teams, some sort of pattern might emerge. But don't tell me that the players in the team were crap and yet they beat West Brom 3-2 and drew the return. That they also beat Cardiff, QPR, Burnley, Bristol City, Stoke, etc, often over one leg, losing the other. I really can't be arsed to see who played in one leg and who played in the other. But we beat Sheffield Utd twice and had other wins with a 13 wins total and 14 draws. As is typical with Saints, they often beat the top teams and lose to the bottom ones. Far too early to make statements along the lines that this current team would thrash last season's. They'll need some wins under their belt before any conclusions are reached. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alucard Posted 22 August, 2008 Share Posted 22 August, 2008 I suspect that if some anorak was to analyse which combination of players last season was capable of beating the best teams and which lost against the worst teams, some sort of pattern might emerge. But don't tell me that the players in the team were crap and yet they beat West Brom 3-2 and drew the return. That they also beat Cardiff, QPR, Burnley, Bristol City, Stoke, etc, often over one leg, losing the other. I really can't be arsed to see who played in one leg and who played in the other. But we beat Sheffield Utd twice and had other wins with a 13 wins total and 14 draws. As is typical with Saints, they often beat the top teams and lose to the bottom ones. Far too early to make statements along the lines that this current team would thrash last season's. They'll need some wins under their belt before any conclusions are reached. Well I've think we've found the mug who is going to buy the Saints highlights of 2007/08 season DVD. However much you put your head in the sand and pretend that last season was really good you can't get away from the fact that we achieved our worst league position for over 40 years. I've seen all of those and in my opinion the entertainment and football quality was the worst as well and that includes the Branfoot years. You say we won 13 games like it was something to be proud of. FFS S****horpe won 11 times Leicester 12 and Coventry 14. For me the epitome of last season was the Bristol R debacle which made us the laughing stock of the nation on prime time TV and I received calls from many parts of the country taking the ****. For a large part of last season I was embarrassed to be a Saints fan and dreaded going to matches but from what I've seen so far from our youngsters I have been entertained, can't wait for the next match and even if we get relegated I am going to enjoy the season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Create an account or sign in to comment
You need to be a member in order to leave a comment
Create an account
Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!
Register a new accountSign in
Already have an account? Sign in here.
Sign In Now