Sheff Weds a threat...pah

[patred44]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/football/teams/s/sheff_wed/8847626.stm

[onthemarch]

is there any good players there we could make some low bids for

[tartanowl]

Of course we will still be a threat. We have arguably the strongest squad in the division. That is why the club signed the players early. They knew it was coming. It is a petition NOT a winding up order. It would be far more serious if it was a winding up order. We have cashflow problems like many businesses. We are in no immediate danger of administration or a 10 point deduction. Our bank has agreed to extend our overdraft facility to make up for the loss in Championship revenue so short term we should be ok. Long term it is uncertain and it will be even more so if we fail to get promoted this season. I will admit we are definitely playing a dangerous game by not paying the taxman on time.

 

If the matchday revenue for the first game won't cover the costs we have 2 options:

 

Sell Lee Grant, pay off the tax bill, tread water for a year, hope we get promoted at the first time of asking.

 

Accept the £5m investment offer on the table from the American group Club 9 Sports and carry on as we are albeit with an additional £400k per annum 'managment fee'.

[Thedelldays]

oh dear......we have seen this all before somewhere

[S-Clarke]

Of course we will still be a threat. We have arguably the strongest squad in the division. That is why the club signed the players early. They knew it was coming.

 

well in my eyes that's almost cheating. You should be made to terminate all of those players contracts.

[Dave Benson Phillips]

Of course we will still be a threat. We have arguably the strongest squad in the division. That is why the club signed the players early. They knew it was coming. It is a petition NOT a winding up order. It would be far more serious if it was a winding up order. We have cashflow problems like many businesses. We are in no immediate danger of administration or a 10 point deduction. Our bank has agreed to extend our overdraft facility to make up for the loss in Championship revenue so short term we should be ok. Long term it is uncertain and it will be even more so if we fail to get promoted this season. I will admit we are definitely playing a dangerous game by not paying the taxman on time.

 

If the matchday revenue for the first game won't cover the costs we have 2 options:

 

Sell Lee Grant, pay off the tax bill, tread water for a year, hope we get promoted at the first time of asking.

 

Accept the £5m investment offer on the table from the American group Club 9 Sports and carry on as we are albeit with an additional £400k per annum 'managment fee'.

 

I think what you are saying fella, is that your lot is up sh!t creak without a paddle.

[Doctoroncall]

Of course we will still be a threat. We have arguably the strongest squad in the division. That is why the club signed the players early. They knew it was coming. It is a petition NOT a winding up order. It would be far more serious if it was a winding up order. We have cashflow problems like many businesses. We are in no immediate danger of administration or a 10 point deduction. Our bank has agreed to extend our overdraft facility to make up for the loss in Championship revenue so short term we should be ok. Long term it is uncertain and it will be even more so if we fail to get promoted this season. I will admit we are definitely playing a dangerous game by not paying the taxman on time.

 

If the matchday revenue for the first game won't cover the costs we have 2 options:

 

Sell Lee Grant, pay off the tax bill, tread water for a year, hope we get promoted at the first time of asking.

 

Accept the £5m investment offer on the table from the American group Club 9 Sports and carry on as we are albeit with an additional £400k per annum 'managment fee'.

 

Gambling is a dangerous game, especially with the HMRC.

[tartanowl]

well in my eyes that's almost cheating. You should be made to terminate all of those players contracts.

 

Why? We are still honouring the players contracts and the payment will be made.

[tartanowl]

Gambling is a dangerous game, especially with the HMRC.

 

It is indeed.

[doddisalegend]

well in my eyes that's almost cheating. You should be made to terminate all of those players contracts.

 

We can hardly bleat about clubs with money troubles can we? I know we paid our tax bill on time but still we've been in a similair postion not so long ago we got very very lucky many other fans still consider us cheats. Still -10pts for the owls for going into admin would help us out;)

 

I doubt anything will come of it how many times did Southend go through this last season?

[holepuncture]

club 9 is all a scam! pinnacle-esq. They simply have enough capital and assets and want hold of your future cash flow.

 

Blag a commercial mortgage and pay it back through some kind of '£400k p.a management fee' vehicle, i think the big boys call it a leveraged buyout, I see it as a slow motion burglary.

 

In this league, an old ground like yours is a liability, not an asset.

 

Relying on the sale of one player (who again is more of a liability than an asset in this league), after just one game, is a speculative punt of monumental proportions, especially with your bargaining and negotiation positioning shot to pieces by the taxmans WUP

 

All the best for the season for the forthcoming season.

[Tom28]

Time for speculative bids of £550k for either Mark Beevers or Marcus Tudgay I reckon...

[tartanowl]

club 9 is all a scam! pinnacle-esq. They simply have enough capital and assets and want hold of your future cash flow.

 

Blag a commercial mortgage and pay it back through some kind of '£400k p.a management fee' vehicle, i think the big boys call it a leveraged buyout, I see it as a slow motion burglary.

 

In this league, an old ground like yours is a liability, not an asset.

 

Relying on the sale of one player (who again is more of a liability than an asset in this league), after just one game, is a speculative punt of monumental proportions, especially with your bargaining and negotiation positioning shot to pieces by the taxmans WUP

 

All the best for the season for the forthcoming season.

 

Thanks for your kind words.

[tartanowl]

I can't remember, how did you get on after relegations last time? Were you as confident of instant return, and did it happen?

 

We had a far reduced wage bill to this season and a terrible squad of players. It was obvious we were not going to get promoted after our previous relegation. We took 1 year to stabilise and got promoted the year after.

[for_heaven's_Saint]

We had a far reduced wage bill to this season and a terrible squad of players. It was obvious we were not going to get promoted after our previous relegation. We took 1 year to stabilise and got promoted the year after.

 

Reminds me of someone...

[saintsub]

I have heard some lame excuses in my time ...but to say we knew it was coming is laughable!!! I must tell the HMRC next time my tax bill is due that I have spent the money on a new house, car, boat and staff but don't worry the bank will lend me more and I hope that I will have enough to pay the bank soon. LOL

[saint_stevo]

We had a far reduced wage bill to this season and a terrible squad of players. It was obvious we were not going to get promoted after our previous relegation. We took 1 year to stabilise and got promoted the year after.

 

Sounds like Saints to be fair.

 

Firesale at Hillsborough? Bye Bye Tudgay?

[saintsub]

AP - hurry up - cheap players going in the Sheffield area.

[EastleighSoulBoy]

AP - hurry up - cheap players going in the Sheffield area.

 

Yup, they'd be a steel.

[saintsub]

Get your coat!!!!

[Smirking_Saint]

Sounds like Saints to be fair.

 

Firesale at Hillsborough? Bye Bye Tudgay?

 

I'd love it if we signed Tudgay, and a Miller and Beevers.

[trousers]

Why? We are still honouring the players contracts and the payment will be made.

 

Whilst putting non-footballing creditor's money in jeopardy.

 

Call it what you like. It's called "cheating" and/or "immoral" in these 'ere parts....

[trousers]

Why? We are still honouring the players contracts and the payment will be made.

 

[tartanowl]

I have heard some lame excuses in my time ...but to say we knew it was coming is laughable!!! I must tell the HMRC next time my tax bill is due that I have spent the money on a new house, car, boat and staff but don't worry the bank will lend me more and I hope that I will have enough to pay the bank soon. LOL

 

Why is it laughable? It seems a sensible course of action to me if it was on the horizon. We sign good players and give ourselves a better chance of promotion. As long as the money owed to HMRC is paid by 11th August we don't have a problem.

[trousers]

As long as the money owed to HMRC is paid by 11th August we don't have a problem.

 

And if it isn't paid....?

[tartanowl]

Whilst putting non-footballing creditor's money in jeopardy.

 

Call it what you like. It's called "cheating" and/or "immoral" in these 'ere parts....

 

It's delaying a payment. Businesses do this all the time. It's not a recommended course of action but in our position we had no choice.

[tartanowl]

And if it isn't paid....?

 

It will be paid. If it isn't we will enter administration. Just like you did.

[View From The Top]

It will be paid. If it isn't we will enter administration. Just like you did.

 

I like the cut of your jib. Straight and honest. Makes a change.

[Dazza82]

It will be paid. If it isn't we will enter administration. Just like you did.

 

Difference being all our taxes were paid and up to date

[Smirking_Saint]

It will be paid. If it isn't we will enter administration. Just like you did.

 

Ours was not due to tax, infact i believe our tax was fully up to date.

 

We went into admin because the bank withdrew our overdraft facility and the speculation is this was because they could only see our income lessening due to Lowes influence.

 

Not being a WUM or anything but i really don't think you guys should be being so blase about all of this, admin is not a good place to be and from what i remember recently any club that has had a WUP issued against them has hit sh*t creek pretty quickly.

[Block 5]

Oh dear.

I'm looking forward to visiting Hillsborough this season.

Let's hope there's still a football club there in September.

[saintsub]

There is a real danger of the 'pot calling kettle black' here and I appologise for making light of it - but I hope SWFC learn from our mistakes - 'if money in less = than money out result happiness, money out = less than money in result misery (and god help us - we know).

 

Good luck but HRMC are not known for their patience and looks like they are lining their tanks up outside Hilsborough.

 

BTW small hint - you are guaranteed to get little sympathy and loads of abuse if you come on your rivals notice board!

[tartanowl]

Ours was not due to tax, infact i believe our tax was fully up to date.

 

We went into admin because the bank withdrew our overdraft facility and the speculation is this was because they could only see our income lessening due to Lowes influence.

 

Not being a WUM or anything but i really don't think you guys should be being so blase about all of this, admin is not a good place to be and from what i remember recently any club that has had a WUP issued against them has hit sh*t creek pretty quickly.

 

You still went into admin. You deserved your points deduction just as we will if we are forced to do the same. That is the rules.

 

I am not blase about this. I know just how serious this is and what a bad situation it is we are in. What concerns me most is that the club didn't mention a thing up until it was announced in the press. We have (so far successfully) managed to stay out of admin for going on 10 years since our initial relegation from the Premiership. We have fought through it, paid our bills, and suffered for years with mediocre transfer and wage budgets. We haven't spent way outwith our means like Cardiff or Portsmouth. We are in trouble but then again so are many other clubs. We are far from being the first to do this, and we won't be the last.

[tartanowl]

I like the cut of your jib. Straight and honest. Makes a change.

 

Thank you. That's how I try to be.

[tartanowl]

There is a real danger of the 'pot calling kettle black' here and I appologise for making light of it - but I hope SWFC learn from our mistakes - 'if money in less = than money out result happiness, money out = less than money in result misery (and god help us - we know).

 

Good luck but HRMC are not known for their patience and looks like they are lining their tanks up outside Hilsborough.

BTW small hint - you are guaranteed to get little sympathy and loads of abuse if you come on your rivals notice board!

 

Don't worry I'm very aware of this.

[a1ex2001]

We took 1 year to stabilise and got promoted the year after.

 

Not quite how I remember it, I remember the stabalisation year being a flirtation with further relegation and the promotion year being a bit of a squeak in via the play offs, hardly we will walk this league form?

[Smirking_Saint]

You still went into admin. You deserved your points deduction just as we will if we are forced to do the same. That is the rules.

 

I am not blase about this. I know just how serious this is and what a bad situation it is we are in. What concerns me most is that the club didn't mention a thing up until it was announced in the press. We have (so far successfully) managed to stay out of admin for going on 10 years since our initial relegation from the Premiership. We have fought through it, paid our bills, and suffered for years with mediocre transfer and wage budgets. We haven't spent way outwith our means like Cardiff or Portsmouth. We are in trouble but then again so are many other clubs. We are far from being the first to do this, and we won't be the last.

 

don't get me wrong we deserved what we got !!

[tartanowl]

Not quite how I remember it, I remember the stabalisation year being a flirtation with further relegation and the promotion year being a bit of a squeak in via the play offs, hardly we will walk this league form?

 

How is it any different? Ok, we were nearly relegated the first season, but we survived. After getting used to the league, stabilising and almost completely changing the squad we won promotion by the playoffs the following season. We had a far weaker squad and lower wage bill then than we do now. The league is not going to be easy this season (I know this) but we are a far better team and squad than the one that was promoted from here last time.

[patred44]

Dress it it up if you like OWLS.. we all know why. Get the players in before the transfer embargo starts.......IT IS PLAIN CHEATING

 

MINUS 10 POINTS COMING YOUR WAY

[tartanowl]

Dress it it up if you like OWLS.. we all know why. Get the players in before the transfer embargo starts.......IT IS PLAIN CHEATING

 

MINUS 10 POINTS COMING YOUR WAY

 

Not unless we enter admin.

[Matthew Le God]

We have arguably the strongest squad in the division.

 

Sheff Weds have little in the way of money hence why they haven't signed anyone other than free transfers.

 

Yes, they are some good players at this level, but if Saints wanted any these players signed this summer they have the resources to outbid Wednesday. Your first choice right back next season is a player deemed not good enough for Saints or Norwich in the last 7 months.

[tartanowl]

Sheff Weds have little in the way of money hence why they haven't signed anyone other than free transfers.

 

Yes, they are some good players at this level, but if Saints wanted any these players Weds signed this summer they have the resources to outbid Wednesday. Your first choice right back next season is a player deemed not good enough for Saints or Norwich in the last 6 months.

 

Who is the weakest player in our starting XI.

[Matthew Le God]

Who is the weakest player in our starting XI.

 

...and wouldn't even make it into our starting XI

 

If he were still at Saints he'd be 3rd choice right back.

Edited 23 July, 2010 by Matthew Le God

[corky morris]

Its playing the system in the way the fish ****ers did & that is exactly why the revenue are after them. Its not cheating according to the law, but without doubt there are absolutely no morals in securing players knowingly prior to a winding up petition. In the tax world I think it is called an 'associated transaction' (?) where you participate in a transaction in order to avoid tax. SWFC are not avoiding tax, just delaying it (hopefully for them). Its basically financial engineering with a high degree of risk because as we all know players values plummet when you are forced sellers. The preferred creditor rule is the ultimate goal of HMRC.

[tartanowl]

...and wouldn't even make it into our starting XI

 

If he were still at Saints he'd be 3rd choice right back.

 

Just as some of your players wouldn't make it into ours.

[Smirking_Saint]

Who is the weakest player in our starting XI.

 

True, but you have a few weakish links.

 

Our Spine is better (Fonte, Schniederlin, Lambert) plus we have 3 fantastic full backs for this level, a keeper that was wanted by a premiership team and a 20 goal midfielder in Lallana.

 

Our weakest player is probably Hammond, who CDAJFY if he was in your squad.

 

Morrisson is a good free signing if he finds form in this league, Tudgay is a player that i admire, and probably the only player i would LOVE us to take off of your hands.

 

Beevers and Miller would probably just improve the saints team but to be honest i woulnd't be creaming in my pants, they are pretty much on the same level as Jaidi and Hammond.

 

I am also confident there are more signings for us to come.

[Chez]

How is it any different? Ok, we were nearly relegated the first season, but we survived. After getting used to the league, stabilising and almost completely changing the squad we won promotion by the playoffs the following season. We had a far weaker squad and lower wage bill then than we do now. The league is not going to be easy this season (I know this) but we are a far better team and squad than the one that was promoted from here last time.

 

I think its pretty obvious they are more Norwich (of last season) than Saints (of last season) this time round.

[Smirking_Saint]

Just as some of your players wouldn't make it into ours.

 

I would argue that a team mad up of the two sides would have the majority of Saints players in it, but then i am a saints fan !!

[tartanowl]

True, but you have a few weakish links.

 

Our Spine is better (Fonte, Schniederlin, Lambert) plus we have 3 fantastic full backs for this level, a keeper that was wanted by a premiership team and a 20 goal midfielder in Lallana.

 

Our weakest player is probably Hammond, who CDAJFY if he was in your squad.

 

Morrisson is a good free signing if he finds form in this league, Tudgay is a player that i admire, and probably the only player i would LOVE us to take off of your hands.

 

Beevers and Miller would probably just improve the saints team but to be honest i woulnd't be creaming in my pants, they are pretty much on the same level as Jaidi and Hammond.

 

I am also confident there are more signings for us to come.

 

What are these few links? I can think of right back and that's about it. The rest of the steam is well balanced and very strong.

[tartanowl]

I would argue that a team mad up of the two sides would have the majority of Saints players in it, but then i am a saints fan !!

 

I'm a Wednesday fan and I disagree.