The Starmer Years - Can The New Broom Sweep Clean?

[egg]

12 hours ago, Baird of the land said:

Unfortunately the super rich are tax mobile, so pushing the button on the left has little effect. Unlike addressing the extreme increases of the one on the right

The focus needs to be on why there is an extreme increase in people being unwell. Just accepting it as the way it is, and cutting benefits, isn't the answer. MH support and therapeutic services need money throwing at them in a big way. There's no prevention, or cure, just financial support which we can't afford. It's a shambles. 

Re the pic, I just lifted from amnesty or similar. The choice is far from a binary cut benefits or tax the rich, but the latter is an option. My money is on a vat hike though - everyone pays it, including those benefit recipients who keep their money. 

[Mixedkebab]

27 minutes ago, Farmer Saint said:

It's been a poor 12 months for Labour, but to even contemplate that it is worse than the Tories is fucking laughable. They had so many u-turns, and the only times they got stuff through they broke the economy.

17 U turns already from this lot- they will be catching up pretty fast.

Bygone era idealistic plums desperate to prove Labour aren’t as bad as the tories, when it’s clear to see they are all as bad as each other. Whoever is in, the country is in the same position.

Big decisions don’t get made out of fear of upsetting too many within the electorate or rebellious backbenchers- so real tangible improvement never happens
Country too divided and unable to find common ground thanks to social media

Burden on the taxpayer and cost of living continuing to get worse while the super rich and the professional benefit claimants and NHS tourists etc carry on taking the piss out of all of us 

[hypochondriac]

Labour have been shite so far. To what extent they have been worse than the woeful tories really doesn't matter. 

[whelk]

26 minutes ago, hypochondriac said:

Labour have been shite so far. To what extent they have been worse than the woeful tories really doesn't matter. 

Of course it does, by definition if not as bad then there has been improvement 

[hypochondriac]

15 minutes ago, whelk said:

Of course it does, by definition if not as bad then there has been improvement 

I can't remember the first year of the Tories being substantially worse than this so still time. The reason the Tories were so poor is because they had such a long time to do so many things wrong. Labour just haven't had as much time yet. The fact we are even discussing who has been worse is telling. For those who voted labour, are they doing how you expected so far? 

Edited Saturday at 10:26 by hypochondriac

[The Kraken]

5 hours ago, Farmer Saint said:

It's been a poor 12 months for Labour, but to even contemplate that it is worse than the Tories is fucking laughable.

Labour have been poor but I’d much rather a few u turns to get to the right decision than the past ten years.

Gideon and call me Dave’s austerity, we all need to tighten our belts and make shit public services much much shitter.

Boris and his uncountable outright lies and ineptitude.

Lettuce Liz and Quasie killing the economy in sixty days.

And little Rishi just doing what the big boys (and his paymasters) told him to.

Please don’t try and convince me that this iteration of Labour is worse than that. Just not gonna wash.

 

[east-stand-nic]

2 hours ago, The Kraken said:

Labour have been poor but I’d much rather a few u turns to get to the right decision than the past ten years.

Gideon and call me Dave’s austerity, we all need to tighten our belts and make shit public services much much shitter.

Boris and his uncountable outright lies and ineptitude.

Lettuce Liz and Quasie killing the economy in sixty days.

And little Rishi just doing what the big boys (and his paymasters) told him to.

Please don’t try and convince me that this iteration of Labour is worse than that. Just not gonna wash.

 

Here we go again. Boris u turns, he is inept. Trump u turns, he is a buffoon. Sunka u turns, incompetent. Starmer u turns, good man for making sure he gets it right. Utter loon. 

So we're the others not doing a good job then in making u turns to make sure they get it right? Jeez. 

Edited Saturday at 15:57 by east-stand-nic

[egg]

4 minutes ago, east-stand-nic said:

Here we go again. Boris u turns, he is inept. Trump u turns, he is a buffoon. Sunka u turns, incompetent. Starmer u turns, good man for making sure he gets it right. Utter loon. 

So we're the others not doing a good job then in making u turns to make sure they get it right? Jeez. 

He said nothing about Boris's u turns. You made that up. His complaint was Boris's dishonesty, and general shit ness as a PM. You may also want to read his actual words about the others. 

[east-stand-nic]

Just now, egg said:

He said nothing about Boris's u turns. You made that up. His complaint was Boris's dishonesty, and general shit ness as a PM. You may also want to read his actual words about the others. 

I have seen almost every single person on this forum over the years call out Boris, trump and sunak over their u turns. Are you denying that? 

So why is starmer now thought of as good for doing u turns? Think about it. As ever I am full on correct in pointing out the incredible double standards. 

[AlexLaw76]

37 minutes ago, east-stand-nic said:

I have seen almost every single person on this forum over the years call out Boris, trump and sunak over their u turns. Are you denying that? 

So why is starmer now thought of as good for doing u turns? Think about it. As ever I am full on correct in pointing out the incredible double standards. 

 

[egg]

55 minutes ago, east-stand-nic said:

I have seen almost every single person on this forum over the years call out Boris, trump and sunak over their u turns. Are you denying that? 

So why is starmer now thought of as good for doing u turns? Think about it. As ever I am full on correct in pointing out the incredible double standards. 

Err, you were replying to a post. What may have been said by others in the past isn't the issue. Play the post you're replying to.

Your last sentence is nonsense. All you've shown is that you say what you want and refuse to address what's actually being discussed. 

[Gloucester Saint]

32 minutes ago, AlexLaw76 said:

 

Boris and Farage broke all of theirs to farmers and fisherman. I await that account’s apology for supporting Brexit and being pricks in damaging our economy. I don’t like Starmer either, nor did I vote for him, but some farmers have short memories (no offence intended @Farmer Saint as you are not in that category).

Edited Saturday at 17:15 by Gloucester Saint

[AlexLaw76]

3 minutes ago, Gloucester Saint said:

Boris and Farage broke all of theirs to farmers and fisherman. I await that account’s apology for supporting Brexit and being pricks in damaging our economy. I don’t like Starmer either, nor did I vote for him, but some farmers have short memories (no offence intended @Farmer Saint as you are not in that category).

He is not practicing what he spent years preaching. Few of them are.

 

[whelk]

12 hours ago, east-stand-nic said:

I have seen almost every single person on this forum over the years call out Boris, trump and sunak over their u turns. Are you denying that? 

So why is starmer now thought of as good for doing u turns? Think about it. As ever I am full on correct in pointing out the incredible double standards. 

Comical cunt 

[aintforever]

14 hours ago, east-stand-nic said:

I have seen almost every single person on this forum over the years call out Boris, trump and sunak over their u turns. Are you denying that? 

So why is starmer now thought of as good for doing u turns? Think about it. As ever I am full on correct in pointing out the incredible double standards. 

Not sure U-turns were high on the list of criticism of the three you mention there. 
 

Labour have made a rocky start but whoever won the last election would have had difficult decisions to make given the state of what they inherited. I don’t agree with all they have done but they are definitely an improvement on the chaos that preceded them. At least they appear to be thinking long term and getting on with the job not infighting and just desperately trying to start culture wars every 5 mins. That in itself is refreshing.

[CB Fry]

14 hours ago, east-stand-nic said:

I have seen almost every single person on this forum over the years call out Boris, trump and sunak over their u turns. Are you denying that? 

So why is starmer now thought of as good for doing u turns? Think about it. As ever I am full on correct in pointing out the incredible double standards. 

I have never wavered or u-turned on my opinion that you are a pitifully thick cunt

[east-stand-nic]

5 minutes ago, CB Fry said:

I have never wavered or u-turned on my opinion that you are a pitifully thick cunt

Roughly translated into "Bloody hell, this guy has done it again and shown us all up as blinkered childish twats".

Here endeth the lesson.

[CB Fry]

1 minute ago, east-stand-nic said:

Roughly translated into "Bloody hell, this guy has done it again and shown us all up as blinkered childish twats".

Here endeth the lesson.

Nah. Just that you are a pitifully thick cunt.

[Farmer Saint]

14 hours ago, Gloucester Saint said:

Boris and Farage broke all of theirs to farmers and fisherman. I await that account’s apology for supporting Brexit and being pricks in damaging our economy. I don’t like Starmer either, nor did I vote for him, but some farmers have short memories (no offence intended @Farmer Saint as you are not in that category).

I know a couple of farmers who supported Brexit, and then have stopped farming due to not having the labour available post Brexit, including one that after Brexit decided to turn half his land into a fucking vineyard, using labour models from pre-2016.

We told him not to, but to be honest he is a ruddy old racist and deserved what he got. You reap what you sow. 

[Farmer Saint]

15 hours ago, east-stand-nic said:

I have seen almost every single person on this forum over the years call out Boris, trump and sunak over their u turns. Are you denying that? 

So why is starmer now thought of as good for doing u turns? Think about it. As ever I am full on correct in pointing out the incredible double standards. 

People hated Boris because of his corruption. He was always goes to flip-flop, or wiff-waff on policies because that's part of who he is (and he did also have to deal with COVID).

People hate Trump because he's a bi-polar moron, who doesn't understand the first thing about geo-politics, economics, business and constitutional rights. What he does know is manipulation, lying, cheating and how to do illegal things in plain sight. He needs to be careful as when the dildo of consequence arrives, it rarely arrives lubed.

 

[Lord Duckhunter]

2 hours ago, aintforever said:

Not sure U-turns were high on the list of criticism of the three you mention there. 
 

 At least they appear to be thinking long term and getting on with the job not infighting and just desperately trying to start culture wars every 5 mins. That in itself is refreshing.

There’s plenty of in fighting, Sue gray anyone, and they’re now briefing left right and centre. 
 

It’s been a complete and utter shambles from Lord Alli & winter fuel  through “Island of strangers”, to the latest cock up where it looks like we could have 2 tier PIP benefits, with 2 people with the same disability receiving different levels of support depending on when they were diagnosed. A Government with a 100 plus majority that can’t get this small fiscal measure through parliament is a dead duck. 
 

What ever you and other lefties try and pretend , you know deep down that this has been far far worse than you ever thought it would be. Incompetence & muddled thinking right from the very start. The bloke and Reeves are completely out of their depth and the party needs to ditch both to have any chance of a re set….

Edited Sunday at 09:16 by Lord Duckhunter

[tdmickey3]

3 minutes ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

There’s plenty of in fighting, Sue gray anyone, and they’re now briefing left right and centre. 
 

It’s been a complete and utter shambles from Lord Alli & winter fuel  through “Island of strangers”, to the latest cock up where it looks like we could have 2 tier PIP benefits, with 2 people with the same disability receiving different levels of support depending on when they were diagnosed. A Government with a 100 plus majority that can’t get this small fiscal measure through parliament is a dead duck. 
 

What ever you and other lefties try and pretend , you know deep down that this has been far far worse than you ever thought it would be. Incompetence & muddled thinking right from the very start. The bloke and Reeves are completely out of their depth and the party needs to ditch both to have any chance of a re set….

Bring back Maggie I say, what about you?

She was wonderful wasn’t she, well only for those with a short and selective memory 

[egg]

15 minutes ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

There’s plenty of in fighting, Sue gray anyone, and they’re now briefing left right and centre. 
 

It’s been a complete and utter shambles from Lord Alli & winter fuel  through “Island of strangers”, to the latest cock up where it looks like we could have 2 tier PIP benefits, with 2 people with the same disability receiving different levels of support depending on when they were diagnosed. A Government with a 100 plus majority that can’t get this small fiscal measure through parliament is a dead duck. 
 

What ever you and other lefties try and pretend , you know deep down that this has been far far worse than you ever thought it would be. Incompetence & muddled thinking right from the very start. The bloke and Reeves are completely out of their depth and the party needs to ditch both to have any chance of a re set….

Far worse than expected, yes, far worse than what went before, no. What would the direction of travel been if the Tories had gotten back in? Increased borrowing, benefit cuts, other cuts, more distance between us and Europe. Anything else? Anything positive? 

[Gloucester Saint]

7 minutes ago, egg said:

Far worse than expected, yes, far worse than what went before, no. What would the direction of travel been if the Tories had gotten back in? Increased borrowing, benefit cuts, other cuts, more distance between us and Europe. Anything else? Anything positive? 

And then there’s Reform. 18 year olds overseeing key services such as social care and transport in some of the biggest county councils (Warwickshire, Leicestershire) because Reform councillors keep quitting within a month of being elected. And the only reason they were selected to stand is because of Islamophobic and other tweets.

Their own Chair said it would be a waste of his time campaigning for a Reform government.

God help us if they get anywhere near power.

[AlexLaw76]

6 minutes ago, Gloucester Saint said:

And then there’s Reform. 18 year olds overseeing key services such as social care and transport in some of the biggest county councils (Warwickshire, Leicestershire) because Reform councillors keep quitting within a month of being elected. And the only reason they were selected to stand is because of Islamophobic and other tweets.

Their own Chair said it would be a waste of his time campaigning for a Reform government.

God help us if they get anywhere near power.

Labour carry on like this, they will help them get there 

[Gloucester Saint]

Just now, AlexLaw76 said:

Labour carry on like this, they will help them get there 

This we agree on. If you try to ape Reform and are perceived not to deliver on much of your programme in an everyday way, what are Red Wall voters then going to do in 2029? 

[whelk]

10 minutes ago, AlexLaw76 said:

Labour carry on like this, they will help them get there 

I wager there is absolutely nothing Labour could do to stop you voting Reform. That party is made for you

[Gloucester Saint]

1 minute ago, whelk said:

I wager there is absolutely nothing Labour could do to stop you voting Reform. That party is made for you

The classic is Farage in order to make inroads in the Welsh elections next year stating that he wants to re-start blast furnaces - bit of a technical issue there Nigel! - and re-industrialise Wales.

It’s reheated Trump, he has no ideas of his own. Lowe is a cunt but at least he had some ideas. And what has happened in states like Pennsylvania where Trump promised to get coal mining going again? Zero mines but he has cut all of the miners with COPD conditions Medicaid.

Stupidity costs lives.

[egg]

18 minutes ago, AlexLaw76 said:

Labour carry on like this, they will help them get there 

The thing is, we're fucked. Personally, I'd tell the electorate that - lay it out - and make it clear that they'll get poorer if we don't tax the super rich as they'll be the ones paying. Get the public onside. In reality, they're moving the deckchairs around the Titanic, and it's not going to get any better by continually rearranging them. I'd explain that in reality the number of illegal immigrants isn't high and tell them we can't just shove them on planes or boats, and despite the BS from other parties, they ain't doing that either. I'd explain that the Tory government oversaw mass legal immigration and that they're getting numbers down and that like it or not, Brexit was a shit show, and we need legal immigration to give us a workforce in vital areas like the NHS. I'd have a plan to control legal migration and explain that we're limiting it to people we need, not every one who thinks that Blackpool looks a nice place to work for the summer. 

Give them some some honesty, explain the reality of a Reform or Tory government, and stop fucking about trying to appease the people that can actually help. 

Re Reform. The sad thing is that nobody I've spoken to who like them has any idea what they actually stand for, or considers what a reform government would actually do. They think they'll get a better NHS, that boats suddenly won't depart from France, that services will increase and taxes drop - none of them even considering that life doesn't work like that. Tragic that people think that Farage is a man of the people, and it's staggering how many people can see that Trump is a maniac but in the same breath see Nigel as our saviour. 

[rallyboy]

Coal mines, that's what we need, reopen coal mines that were not viable 40 years ago.

Farage is a clueless twat trying to guess what stupid people want to hear.

oh but RB, you can't call them stupid....

If they believe that spending hundreds of millions of pounds on coal mines is the answer to anything, they are stupid.

[egg]

12 minutes ago, rallyboy said:

Coal mines, that's what we need, reopen coal mines that were not viable 40 years ago.

Farage is a clueless twat trying to guess what stupid people want to hear.

oh but RB, you can't call them stupid....

If they believe that spending hundreds of millions of pounds on coal mines is the answer to anything, they are stupid.

Hundreds of millions, no, but the recent steel works scenario was a farce. We had to, basically, steal the plant from the Chinese, then buy overpriced coal from them to make it work. 

We need steel furnaces for military purposes if nothing else, and coal to operate the furnaces. Whatever that costs is necessary. We also need to be able to power our power stations in time of need. What we don't need is a bigger coal industry than that, but we need more than we have. 

[Gloucester Saint]

24 minutes ago, egg said:

The thing is, we're fucked. Personally, I'd tell the electorate that - lay it out - and make it clear that they'll get poorer if we don't tax the super rich as they'll be the ones paying. Get the public onside. In reality, they're moving the deckchairs around the Titanic, and it's not going to get any better by continually rearranging them. I'd explain that in reality the number of illegal immigrants isn't high and tell them we can't just shove them on planes or boats, and despite the BS from other parties, they ain't doing that either. I'd explain that the Tory government oversaw mass legal immigration and that they're getting numbers down and that like it or not, Brexit was a shit show, and we need legal immigration to give us a workforce in vital areas like the NHS. I'd have a plan to control legal migration and explain that we're limiting it to people we need, not every one who thinks that Blackpool looks a nice place to work for the summer. 

Give them some some honesty, explain the reality of a Reform or Tory government, and stop fucking about trying to appease the people that can actually help. 

Re Reform. The sad thing is that nobody I've spoken to who like them has any idea what they actually stand for, or considers what a reform government would actually do. They think they'll get a better NHS, that boats suddenly won't depart from France, that services will increase and taxes drop - none of them even considering that life doesn't work like that. Tragic that people think that Farage is a man of the people, and it's staggering how many people can see that Trump is a maniac but in the same breath see Nigel as our saviour. 

100% all of that and the UK needs to move closer still to the EU on trade to regain a bit more of the 6% economic pie we lost.

Some of the Red Wall won’t like that but they voted Leave in 2016 because they didn’t see the pie as theirs anyway, in spite of the fact they’ve made themselves even poorer. Let them vote Reform and wallow in it, but get the rest of the country motoring again to help pull their pants up and fund their key services even if they’re too ignorant to see it.

Edited Sunday at 10:49 by Gloucester Saint

[Gloucester Saint]

Also, let’s see how Reform do when their acne-clad 18 year olds start cutting SEND budgets as Farage wants to do as part of the DOGE tribute act.

It’ll make the winter fuel allowance and welfare uproar look tiny by comparison. And the fallout with Zia Yusuf will be permanent this time.

[egg]

10 minutes ago, Gloucester Saint said:

100% all of that and the UK needs to move closer still to the EU on trade to regain a bit more of the 6% economic pie we lost.

Some of the Red Wall won’t like that but they voted Leave in 2016 because they didn’t see the pie as theirs anyway, in spite of the fact they’ve made themselves even poorer. Let them vote Reform and wallow in it, but get the rest of the country motoring again to help pull their pants up and fund their key services even if they’re too ignorant to see it.

Yep, agreed. I think closer ties to the EU would have happened if it wasn't for the Trump factor. We're trying to keep both sweet, but if we have to pick a lane, it's the EU all day long. 

[whelk]

22 minutes ago, Gloucester Saint said:

Also, let’s see how Reform do when their acne-clad 18 year olds start cutting SEND budgets as Farage wants to do as part of the DOGE tribute act.

It’ll make the winter fuel allowance and welfare uproar look tiny by comparison. And the fallout with Zia Yusuf will be permanent this time.

I’m sure (well hope) their ideology will dissipate when the individuals affected ie concerned parents give their feedback and abuse. In my experience even right wing Tory councillors don’t drive through stuff the public hate and there is always consultations and feedback. Just try closing a facility of any sorts! And legislation means the Councils can’t decide to do things differently. Very slow, bureaucratic organisations. 
 

Also don’t think Reform has overall majority in Warwickshire where the 18 yo is temporarily leader. They will get fuck all in terms of any radical agenda done. 

Edited Sunday at 11:21 by whelk

[Gloucester Saint]

1 hour ago, whelk said:

I’m sure (well hope) their ideology will dissipate when the individuals affected ie concerned parents give their feedback and abuse. In my experience even right wing Tory councillors don’t drive through stuff the public hate and there is always consultations and feedback. Just try closing a facility of any sorts! And legislation means the Councils can’t decide to do things differently. Very slow, bureaucratic organisations. 
 

Also don’t think Reform has overall majority in Warwickshire where the 18 yo is temporarily leader. They will get fuck all in terms of any radical agenda done. 

Although part of me does want to see Reform voting areas experience their policies directly and the penny drop for some.

[whelk]

22 minutes ago, Gloucester Saint said:

Although part of me does want to see Reform voting areas experience their policies directly and the penny drop for some.

Yeah absolutely - any Reform voter should get exactly they deserve in terms of shit services. Be great when they massively reduce council tax though and fix all the potholes whilst operating adult social care without immigrants 

[Lord Duckhunter]

4 hours ago, egg said:

Far worse than expected, yes, far worse than what went before, no. What would the direction of travel been if the Tories had gotten back in? 

I’d have thought Sunak & Hunt would have probably managed decline a bit better than Starmer & Reeves are. Increasing NICS & her first budget did incredible harm to the economy and they’ve never really recovered from that cluster fuck. It’s only going to get worse, because Reeves will be back for more taxes and increased borrowing despite promising she wouldn’t, and I doubt he’ll be smashing the gangs anytime soon. It takes a special kind of incompetence to be so unpopular and so hamstrung a year into a landslide, but he’s somehow managed it. He’s a dud, a plodder who was over promoted because he wasn’t Corbyn. If they don’t bin him soon, he’ll hand the next election to Nigel on a plate….

[Weston Super Saint]

5 minutes ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

I’d have thought Sunak & Hunt would have probably managed decline a bit better than Starmer & Reeves are. Increasing NICS & her first budget did incredible harm to the economy and they’ve never really recovered from that cluster fuck. It’s only going to get worse, because Reeves will be back for more taxes and increased borrowing despite promising she wouldn’t, and I doubt he’ll be smashing the gangs anytime soon. It takes a special kind of incompetence to be so unpopular and so hamstrung a year into a landslide, but he’s somehow managed it. He’s a dud, a plodder who was over promoted because he wasn’t Corbyn. If they don’t bin him soon, he’ll hand the next election to Nigel on a plate….

He was good at PM question time though, against Boris and Liz.

Talk is cheap I guess?

[egg]

34 minutes ago, Lord Duckhunter said:

I’d have thought Sunak & Hunt would have probably managed decline a bit better than Starmer & Reeves are. Increasing NICS & her first budget did incredible harm to the economy and they’ve never really recovered from that cluster fuck. It’s only going to get worse, because Reeves will be back for more taxes and increased borrowing despite promising she wouldn’t, and I doubt he’ll be smashing the gangs anytime soon. It takes a special kind of incompetence to be so unpopular and so hamstrung a year into a landslide, but he’s somehow managed it. He’s a dud, a plodder who was over promoted because he wasn’t Corbyn. If they don’t bin him soon, he’ll hand the next election to Nigel on a plate….

Thanks. We're agreed that the NI changes were a mistake, but, revenue had to be increased. They should have just reduced the daft Tory NI giveaway. 

Although we agree that labour have been crap, what do you think that Sunak and Hunt would have done that would have improved things from where they left them? Or just carried in as they were? 

[whelk]

lol at all the idiots who think they know the political outcome after year 1 of 5

at least some have grown up and dropped ‘Rachel from accounts’ line. Guffaw guffaw

[Farmer Saint]

1 hour ago, whelk said:

lol at all the idiots who think they know the political outcome after year 1 of 5

at least some have grown up and dropped ‘Rachel from accounts’ line. Guffaw guffaw

To be fair unless we see anything radical, which is what I wanted under Labour, it is rather predictable. 

This country has gone to the dogs because we allowed racist mouth-breathers who don't and have never properly contributed to the productivity or prosperity of the country to decide the most important political moment in the country's history.

We'll never recover properly and unless we do something very differently (and take note Reform, I don't mean your daft 1970's policies) we'll be in the same position in 4 more years, taxing the middle earners to the hilt and letting the rich get away with murder.

[Weston Super Saint]

21 minutes ago, Farmer Saint said:

 

This country has gone to the dogs because we allowed racist mouth-breathers who don't and have never properly contributed to the productivity or prosperity of the country to decide the most important political moment in the country's history.

 

Very liberal elite of you.

Everyone can have a vote. As long as they have the same opinions as you?

[Gloucester Saint]

21 minutes ago, Farmer Saint said:

To be fair unless we see anything radical, which is what I wanted under Labour, it is rather predictable. 

This country has gone to the dogs because we allowed racist mouth-breathers who don't and have never properly contributed to the productivity or prosperity of the country to decide the most important political moment in the country's history.

We'll never recover properly and unless we do something very differently (and take note Reform, I don't mean your daft 1970's policies) we'll be in the same position in 4 more years, taxing the middle earners to the hilt and letting the rich get away with murder.

Not to mention severely restricting our trade access to our by far our biggest trade partner on our doorstep.

[Gloucester Saint]

1 minute ago, Weston Super Saint said:

Very liberal elite of you.

Everyone can have a vote. As long as they have the same opinions as you?

As long as they don’t want lots of freebies from an economy 6% smaller as a result of a hard Brexit.

Nobody can fix that properly.

[Weston Super Saint]

4 minutes ago, Gloucester Saint said:

As long as they don’t want lots of freebies from an economy 6% smaller as a result of a hard Brexit.

Nobody can fix that properly.

They can 'want' whatever they like. That's how democracies work!

 

[AlexLaw76]

5 minutes ago, Gloucester Saint said:

As long as they don’t want lots of freebies from an economy 6% smaller as a result of a hard Brexit.

Nobody can fix that properly.

Dont think anyone expects freebees 

unless you arrive via Dover- fix that and Starmer / Labour may get a 2nd series 

Edited Sunday at 16:33 by AlexLaw76

[Farmer Saint]

5 minutes ago, Gloucester Saint said:

Not to mention severely restricting our trade access to our by far our biggest trade partner on our doorstep.

Gullible twats.

I do worry for those in this country, but as soon as I have the opportunity (not now due to family reasons) I will be moving me and my kids to a country where 50% of the country have to try 3 times to put their underwear on correctly every morning.

[Gloucester Saint]

18 minutes ago, Weston Super Saint said:

They can 'want' whatever they like. That's how democracies work!

 

Many groups do but some generations have a disproportionate armada of non-dom owned newspaper outlets to push for theirs, whilst also decimating the economy. It is democracy, yes, but I struggle to sympathise when the same people moan constantly about winter fuel allowance, WASPI etc when they overwhelmingly voted leave.

Edited Sunday at 16:52 by Gloucester Saint

[Gloucester Saint]

20 minutes ago, AlexLaw76 said:

Dont think anyone expects freebees 

unless you arrive via Dover- fix that and Starmer / Labour may get a 2nd series 

Boat issue does need sorting and annoys me as much as you. There isn’t a panacea though, as Reform would find out. Making it far harder to employee illegals by shutting down firms and much bigger penalties for boards of large companies would help more than smashing the gangs or Rwanda though. SMEs are getting some heavier penalties but drop in the ocean compared to the fast food firms.